Out of The Woods
My take on the 49ers game is essentially the same as my take after the Cardinals game: (1) the outcome, in terms of the final score, is immaterial; (2) the good news resides more in what we are attempting as opposed to how we are executing; and (3) Daunte Culpepper is our guy at quarterback.
Regarding point number one, here’s all you need to know: The Raiders were 4-1 and the Colts were 1-3 at the conclusion of last year’s preseason.
As for how we’re executing—well, they must be dipping that pigskin in bacon grease, because we have a bunch of guys who can neither grab it nor hold it.
However, I attribute much of this to the fact that they are trying to re-learn normal football after last year’s experiment in absurdity. They are like children orphaned in the woods and raised by wolves for a year. You can’t teach them English overnight, because they still want to bark.
If you think I’m kidding, I’m not. On offense, we’ve got a bunch of guys who’ve been jerked around with three coaches and systems in three seasons, coupled with two new quarterbacks each on their third stop in three seasons, coupled with another quarterback who was a human piñata last year—all throwing to a guy who wore street clothes for most of the 2006 season.
If that ain’t coming out of the woods, I don’t know what is.
So I don’t mind if the execution is a bit rough right now, because it will get better. What’s important is that our players have been reintroduced to civilization by Kiffin, Knapp, Cable and crew. I still wouldn’t let them near the china cabinet, but at least they’ve stopped chasing cats and chewing on bones.
Exhibit A of our assimilation back into society: Our offensive line, which played relatively stoutly on Saturday night.
So I’m not worried. I think that our offense will steadily improve in the coming weeks, that the mistakes will lessen and that the resurrection will begin in earnest.
As for Daunte Culpepper, I still think he’s the key to everything, even though no one is saying it. I think he’s the team’s trump card in the Russell negotiations, and I think he will be the starter on September 9.
I've said it before, but this time I mean it: The Return to Glory starts now.
posted by Raider Take at 7:47 AM
150 Comments:
I was for the most part happy with our performance. But the Jury is still out on the O-line for me. I mean the 49ers didnt have one starter playing on the D-line and their starters arent that good to begin with. Still im looking forward to a fairly productive season.
ekgraider
ps can we just trade Jamarcus already.
I don't care what people say about Dante's hands being small! He had the same hands when he was in minnesotta and he played great, I know that once he gets in the rithm with the center fumbles won't be a problem.
About Walter, I am sorry but he made too many mistakes if you ask me and to top it off he threw an interception in the middle of the field, I would have him running laps and doing pushups, on top of everything else he wasn't being pressured, when the season starts if he is our qb he will be pressured from all over the field.
Mccown, I would want to see more of him, only because he hasn't really played with us but a total of 2 quarters.
Russell can wait until next year! we will be ok with him or without him.
raiderdecoachella
I was very disappointed in the drops, fumbles and penalties (although that interference call on Ward was completely idiotic).
On the plus side, Culpepper didn't lose one of the fumbles from center. I hope he's gotten it out of his system and doesn't pull a Brooks on opening day. But he's he's easily the most accurate of the three and has the best arm. He kind of exudes leadership, too, doesn't he?
A few more long, time and play consuming drives again. I think we're now approaching a 100% improvement on the number of this type of drive from both last year's pre and regular season.
Well, shut my mouth! Look at Jordan! As for the O-Line? A total of two sacks in in two games, and they've been opening all kinds of running Lane's.
But the biggest difference over the last four years is that when the QB comes to the huddle, you see patience and confidence, even when the wheels looked like they were coming off early. All three of the QBs know that they will be able to move the ball down the field. I have not, at any time, seen that kind of huddle confidence since their Super Bowl year.
DT Gerard Warren was just traded by (are you sitting down?)...
...the Broncos to the Raiders. Could provide some nice depth for the interior D-line.
When Kiff was asked what he saw during the second to last play of the game, he said, “I saw the ball hit (Whitted) in the hands and then drop it.” Simple and to the point.
IMO the dropsies should fall under “riding a bike” category. These guys have to be expected to handle the snap, make a smooth exchange with the RB, or simply catch a pass that hits them in the hands. That’s football, and it’s something most of them have been doing all their lives.
As an east coast fan, I rely heavily on the postings on this and any Raider-oriented website to keep tabs on the S & B. From what I gather, the Kiffin system is in full swing, and this system, as opposed to a collection of talented individuals, can withstand holdouts and injuries without serious consequence. Now if only JRuss would come to realize that if the O-line continues their strong play into the regular season, the Raiders have 3 very capable QB's on their roster. Bye bye leverage!
I wanted to see this deal done, and it's done. It's a good move, and hopefully structured like we had with the Patriots regarding Gabriel.
http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders/ci_6669422
bama7
3 points:
1) Kiffen's been good about making statements through action and he has been quoted as saying the scholarships around Oakland are a thing of the past. Look for Alvis Whitted to be cut this week and guys like taylor to stop dropping passes immediately.
2)Agree RT, that Culpepper is our guy and hoping he stays healthy.
3)I'm glad to have Warren, but why did the donkeys do this? They must feel he has nothing left.
bama7
For all of us donkey haters:
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/hashmarks/0-2-241/Broncos-Request-Shorts-and-Pads-For-Third-Preseason-Game.html
Bama, the donkeys don't want Warren because they are switching to the 3-4. Interior linemen are just supposed to hold the line of scrimage, not penetrate it. Warren is a penetration guy, and suits our system better.
As for the donkeys not being able to pick up a blitz, several of us around these parts noticed before camp that Denver's O-Line was beginning to go south. Looks like we were right.
The G. Warren situation in Denver was exactly what we went through with Sapp, except they didn't try to plug him in at DE. G. Warren should thrive just like Sapp is now, I'm happy to have him. Suddenly we're stacked at DT, with Kelly & Sands playing so well. Good move. I just don't know what we gave up to get him?
Psycho
1) Seems like the Russell nogotiations at least picked up again so hopefully it won't be long now and we can get on with our lives.
2) Hate to say I told you so, but did I not say to keep an eye on Sam Williams? He was all over the place Saturday. On one drive, he made every play I think.
3) Nice 'Take' RT, I couldn't be any more minty, nor fresh.
4) Jordan at least backed up 3 or 4 of those words. Good start for a guy who doesn't know the zone system.
5) The real O-line test is this Friday. Can't wait.
Psycho
I predicted that Crockett would still make the team. He hasn't done anything to hurt his cause. That, and the fact that he was the closest thing there was to a leader on offense last year, I still say he makes it.
Kiffin said, "make it impossible to cut you," and the players, for the most part, are taking him up on that request.
Whitted. Here is somebody who has managed to survive in the NFL for 10 years on the strength of hard work and being willing to sacrafice his body by blocking. What may finally be his undoing is dropping the game winning pass in the endzone in a pre season game. He exposed his one weakness. Dropping a pass righ to his hands.
Bama7
Blanda, I understand what you are saying about Warren scheme-wise with the donkeys but I just would think they'd take less in compensation from another team just so we wouldn't get the guy. Seems odd, particularly when Indy could have used his services. Wait... maybe that clears it up for me... the bigger threat to them was Indy grabbing Warren. Wow, we really need to win an AFC west contest.
"RT"
I agree with most of what you said but the "WR"s who were dropping the ball were either not here last year or they were starters for the Raiders....Like Whitted....so NO EXCUSE....they should be performing....and T-Taylor was a 1st round draft pick....
As for the drop by Whitted at the end of the game in the "EndZone". he was interfeared with....the "DB" tackled his foot while the ball was in the air and he made a nice attemp to get back up for the ball....there should have been a "PassInt" call and the ball placed at the (1)....but we all know why that did not happen....at the end of the game there were several "NON-Calls" against SadFran durring their long drives....I saw extreemly apparent holding on play after play....
Culpper be da "MAN"....and he should start Friday with Walter playing second....This is Culppers team and I can see it when he comes in the huddle....the whole game picks up....ThankYou Al for giving me what I was asking for....
He also gave me "JRus" as I was campaynning for him all last year....now please give me the other requset....Trade Jordan and Portster to "KC" for "LJ"....and than I will be totally happy....now we would have enough money to sign "LJ" and give money to Burgas.....
Lamont might look good for one game but he is like Portster....they both dissapear and run their mouths....one great "LJ" is better than 2 "LameDucks".....
The "Donko"s are falling and I just want to remind everyone that I called it back in June....I had been consentrating on their moves and drop off last season...and the apparent failure of "Jay Betray"...and I said it looked like "Shanon" was getting desperate....and now it's apparent...he will go the same rout as "GrudDumb"....without a star "QB" they are nothing....
As far as the trade with the "Donko"s Lambardi in now on their team....How does that work???
PantyRaider....JustLaughinBaby!!!!
"Don't Play So Rough CowGirls"
Bama7
After reading this article it makes me think perhaps Davis is thinking of trading Russell. It makes sense as to what's been going on, but I think it'd be a terrible move. Russell has unbelievable talent and Al's too scared to commit. If we trade Russell away and he ends up being as big as P Manning, we'll be talked about like the red sox were from 1918 to just a few years ago.
http://www.mercurynews.com/timkawakami
Bama7
After reading this article it makes me think perhaps Davis is thinking of trading Russell. It makes sense as to what's been going on, but I think it'd be a terrible move. Russell has unbelievable talent and Al's too scared to commit. If we trade Russell away and he ends up being as big as P Manning, we'll be talked about like the red sox were from 1918 to just a few years ago.
http://www.mercurynews.com/timkawakami
I disagree with this guys opinion.
Maybe Al is simply waiting to see if Culpepper starts off flying this season, and Russell's bargaining chips start dwindling? I'm not going to start thinking trade until game four.... we are in unchartered territory here. Al is blazing a new trail... and not bending over to the Number one picks demands might be worth the wait if it can save us cap dollars in the long run.
Re Russell:
Please note that that idiotic article about trading Russell is by Kawakami, one of the biggest haters at the Merc. Nobody lies his ass off quite so hard as he.
As for Warren, apparently the deal is that the donkeys get a #5 or nothing. They were expected to release him anyway. If he makes the Raiders opeing day roster, the donkeys get a 2008 5th round pick. If he fails to make the roster, they get nothing.
He may well not make the opening day roster because he's missed all of camp. So the Raiders may cut him, then wait to see if he clears waivers, then sign him to a new contract and not have to pay the donkeys anything.
Added, re Warren...
Consider him as having a complicated audition, and depending on whether the Raiders decide they like him, they'll pay his contract amount for this year ($600K).
Bama7
Gary, the one thing about the Russell negotiations that seem unfair to Russell is that apparently Al is insisting on a "skill" clause. No other first round pick has had that clause working against the guarantee... at least that's what I read. If that clause is there then they'll probably never sign. Who would? It may take an injury but someone will take Russell off our hands if that's indeed what Al wants... and it looks like that's what Al wants if he insists on a skill clause. Right?
Raiders trade for Gerard Warren from donkeys
http://www.milehighreport.com/story/2007/8/20/105121/330nver...
Bama7, my understanding is a little different. What I understand is that Russell's agents are claiming that Davis wants "too much" of the guarantee to be covered under the "skill clause," and it's not that no other 1st round picks have been subjected to it, it's that it hasn't applied to as much of it.
But this is the largest Rookie contract in the history of the NFL, so what do they expect.
I'm hearing rumblings that they are not that far off. Personnally, I'm thinking there might be an added factor here which nobody is discussing.
I think that Russell's agents are very weary of the Raider's O-Line last season, and they were very worried about the potential for Russell to have his career ended by injury before the season even actually starts. They're making sure he misses the preseason in order to get the latest assesment on the O-Line.
They would never actually say that, because it would hurt Russell's relationship with his teammates, especially the players on the O-Line. But if they hold him out through preseason, there is no worry of him actually playing in a game until they're sure the O-Line is rebuilt.
Bama7
Well Blanda if Russell's side is doing that then they obviously forgot the Eli Manning fiasco of a few years ago. Eli's daddy didn't want his son going to the Chargers remember? They were a lousy, dysfunctionbal team and Eli was going to get killed, remember? Bet Eli's still kicking himself over that decision.
And you say that the skill clause that Al is demanding is not a first, but is it not a first for the FIRST pick in a draft?
I'm sorry, I just feel like for all the good Kiffen is doing to restore us to dominance, Al is still finding a way to f(*& something up.
http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/
Commentary/Columns/2007/dickey2205.htm
glenn dickey's article in PFW. i do disagree with him with most of what he says here except this statement:
"The Raiders seldom sell out now, and there’s a nasty element in their crowds."
these 2 statements just aren't rue glenn. come on, this isn't L.A. bud! i've been to those games many, many times. i can't even begin to describe the stabbings and fights there as compared to here. no way it's even close! since the PSL's have gone away, ticket sales last year were much better. we were able to see games we taped after attending! so that's not true either.
scratch that: i meant that i AGREE with most of what he said except that one statement about sellouts and bad crowds.
I am extremely impressed with the coaching. We've come out twice looking and playing like a well coached team. Cable has done a tremendous job with the OL. Everybody with the exception of Grove is playing really well. Even Gallery who i was about to give up on had his moments. #74 is playing solid RT and when Newberry replaces Grove i think the line will play really well and continue to get better as they gain more experience together and with coach Cable/Kiffins system.
Despite getting off to a horrific start plauged with poor field positioning, drops, bad snaps, INT, and a fumbled handoff the Raiders maintained their composure and with imaginative playcalling ran 3 impressive, long drives of 70+ yards.
Walter didn't play that bad despite his poor star and that horrible pass for the INT. His receivers didn't help him any with 2 drops, but when he got settled in he led us on a long drive. I think he is playing well enough to make the team even though he is still inconsistent. I still think he has potential.
When Culpepper took the field against AZ last week, i was surprised when people cheered him the loudest. After 2 games i have to say that i'm cheering too. I think Culpepper has a chance at not only being the starting QB, but having a bigtime comeback season. His bullet for a TD on the rollout was money. He could turn out to be a steal. I hope he starts next week.
I'd give Burgess, Sapp and Morrison some lawn chairs till it's time to go Lion hunting, cause they at midseason form...
I think Taylor and Whitted days are numbered. They are both dropping too many passes and we have too much competition at WR. I'm almost glad that Whitted dropped that game winnning pass in the endzone, since it will not help him make the team.
The tight ends still need to work on their blocking. If you review the tape you will that both starters missed several blocks, but they both made and great catches and will be exciting to watch.
Lamont Jordan stepped it up. Even without that big 30+ yard gain he averaged around 5 yards a carry. We have a strong set of backs with Jordan, Rhodes, & "Joe." I expect big things from our running game this year.
I'm pumped up for the season. I think we are farther along than anyone expects us to be. Even though we didn't win at the end, if you watch other team's preseason games you will see sloppy play, wasted time outs, missed tackles and bad football. While we made our mistakes, we put together 3 long drives, the OL played well and no serious injuries. We are on the right track to returning to greatness!!!
Speculation and "BullShit"....So I may as well tune in with some of my own....
"Warnibg....The following is Total Bull-Shit without any fondation".....
History has been very good to AlDavis as he and his Raiders have been the first at several new developments in professional sports....and he may want to go out with another first....but first he needed to manuver his team into position....
Now I draw a comparison to a famous fighter named CasiousClay....MohamadAhli....who declared he would be the first to win the "Belt" 3 times....so how did he do it....by loosing to Spinks and than coming back to beat his ass to death and recapture the belt....so was it a "Fall" he took in the first fight...
Now we come to last season....MrDavis passed on several coaching prospects and late in the process he brought in his friend ArtShell...and they were very in-active in free agency....did very little to improve the team.....and than the team was run into the ground and the players were not put is a position to win the games....
The result....a loosing season and noterity as the "Worst Team" in NFL history....and in position to get the #1 draft choice....so was it a "Fall"....well we certainly know it was bad....the "Worst" in our history....not quiet....the 1960 team only won (1) game but was a 10 game winner in AlDavis's first season....but they did not go to the top from the bottom....
So now that his team is in position to make a statement he is doing it by busting the agents out of their "PowerPosition" with rookey contracts....
OK...So that's the first statment he is going to make as a "First" in the NFL while he forces decisions about how things are done in the future....
What is the second statment....He now has his team at the bottom and no team has ever rissen from the bottom to the top in one season....so look out....this year he has been extreemly active in free agency and in the draft where he stock-Piled picks....and now the team appears ready to make a statment with a new firey coach and the #3 "D" in the NFL....
So are the Raiders poised to make a run at the top....some of the other teams in the west are poised to fall to the bottom....What do you think.....
PantyRaider's...."BullShit"!!!!!
Am I missing something? Can the Raiders trade Russell if they have not signed him? Would they trade his "rights?"
Trade Talk is "Crap" and just talk....why would we do something like that....we would just loose big time....NO way....
AlDavis is in the controlling position and these agents can't walk away from all that commission and neither can "JRus"....they would just loose next year and make nothing this year....just look at the losses MatLainert took by waitting one more year and staying in school....he would have been the first to SadFran instead of Smith....but last year he fell to #10.....and this year Quinn fell to #22....NO way they are ready to take that type of a gamble....NO way....
PantyRaider.....StandPatttttt!!!!
As far as Russells trade rights, a friend of mine in the Raider NG had this to say:
Now his rights can't be traded until the end of the
League Year (March 1, 2008). f Al really wants to punish Russell and his
agents, he'll pull all that money off the table and offer only what he HAS
to offer: a one-year contract for rookie minimum! If they balk and decide
to reenter the draft in '08, JR will be LUCKY to get drafted in the second
half of the first round. Any team that drafts a rookie who has reentered
the draft from the previous year will NOT be provided Entering Player Pool
dollars for him--meaning they would get less cap space to sign their rookie
class if JR is included than they would if they didn't draft him. It would
suck losing all that value, but Al is in the power position in these
negotiations and JR will have to step in and tell his agents to get
something done or fuck off and die.
--RFM
And you say that the skill clause that Al is demanding is not a first, but is it not a first for the FIRST pick in a draft?
I'm sorry, I just feel like for all the good Kiffen is doing to restore us to dominance, Al is still finding a way to f(*& something up.
I think Al is weighing how much he needs Russell NOW, to making sure he doesn't hamstring the club in the future... so I don't see how he can be fucking things up. He's prolly doing just the opposite. As much as I'd love to see JR signed, if it costs us in the future because we don't have any cap space... I think he is doing the right thing here, especially since with every day, Al has more power in the negotiations. JR's agents are prolly sweating bullets here... knowing if they wait too long and he STILL signs for less than they want (which almost seems a certainty) they are DONE in signing any other number one picks.
Let me weigh in on a few topics and give my 2 cents:
(1) Russell will sign. It would be career & financial suicide to reenter the draft. These are the consequences if he doesn't sign:
(a) does not earn a paycheck in 07
(b) would lose approx. a conservative estimate of $10M to $20M in guaranteed money by sliding out of the top 5 picks in 08.
(c) loses out on any potential endorsement deals in 07
(d) seriously stunts his career development & growth by sitting out 07 which in turn makes him slide further down the 08 draft order.
(e) gets a stigma attached to his name & reputation
At the end of the day, Metz & Lock need to protect their reputation, save face, and earn their commission. To have Russell reenter the draft in 08 would harm Metz & Lock's present & future earnings.
Al Davis has all of the leverage and he knows it. If Metz & Lock are waiting for Davis to blink then they are in for a rude awakening...ain't gonna happen.
Gerrard Warren was a low risk, steal ... his playing style is very similar to Sapp. He is a 1 gap, penetrating DT who causes havoc by getting into the backfield to disrupt the timing of running plays & pressure the QB. Warren is a huge upgrade over Brayton, Shaw, and Hawthorne. I see us going with 9 DLinemen:
Starters: DBurg, Sapp, Sands, Kelly
Subs: Warren, Hawthorne, Huntley, Richardson, Moses
Bye Bye Tollfeson, Brayton, Shaw, and any other scrub I'm forgetting.
The ZBS seems to suit Jordan's running style. He ran the ball with authority & decisiveness vs. SF.
Pepper will be our starter week 1:
He offers the best combination of experience, mobility, and passing prowess.
Kiffin is Gruden minus the sarcasm. I'm lovin' the attitude, decisiveness, and direction Kiffin is leading our team. I like that he called out Huff and raised the bar for him to become more of a playmaker. I like that he doesn't make excuses for bad play or make too much out of good play ... even keel, what have you done for me lately...compete, accountability, and raising the excpectations. Good stuff. Kiffin truly talks the talk, and walks the walk.
look folks, i don't think it'll ever get that far, with russell going back to the draft. the raiders lose BIG TIME in that scenario. they lose this year also because we all know mccown and culpepper are here only as temps. next year (assuming russell doesn't play at all in '07) will essentially be his rookie year. does that mean we start whomever is still here while russell sits and learns? so we wait 2 years for his services instead of getting him that valuable experience this year? the raiders lose again if culpepper has a good comeback year. he'll command a much higher salary. a salary we probably cannot do. he'll want to move on and the salary he commands is starter $. mccown probably won't be back in '08 so that means walter gets the nod next year while russell sits. thats an entire year or more wasted waiting on russell! might as well start the season with walter with culpepper backing him up OR just damn the torpedos and just pay the guy (russell) what he wants!
you know the saying: hindsight's 20-20.....
well, we could have gotten culpepper for cheap and we could have traded down and got johnson......... yeah, yeah i know - that's all played out. but ya can't help but wonder if al would have listened to super scout/GM scorpio..... just kidding folks. smile. :o)
Dream on faida fanatics, "take" had one thing right , the faidas won more preseason games than the dolts, so look forward to another year of mediocrity, as for "culpumper" being your qb... I agree, of all the LOSERS you got in qb jerseys, he's about as good as "aaron brooksy" was, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha....You see improvement on the "o-line" ? The 5 TIME WORLD CHAMPIONS NEVER DEFEATED IN A SUPER BOWL 49ERS didn't have one starting D-lineman in the entire game and they still put pressure on your "a" team..... Dream all you want, the faidas will be crying in their face paint all season long. The refs will probably keep them from winning 1 game all year long! The GREAT KARNACK has spoken, keep defending the "nation" crybabies. Did you hear that MAROON the "brick os shizzle" trying to talk up your faidas on the sidelines, what a laugh, he slobbers like sylvester the cat, ad "l' mushmouth atkinson" sounded like he had downed 4 or 5 40's before the game even started! Oh yeah and the faida propaganda machine is already in full swing with that tired old....."jimmy the plunk" and "tommyboy flowers flores" should be in the hall of fame again. When will you LOSERS get a clue. 0-16 in choketown...."The autumn wind is a stank from mcaphee stadium" Where's "mamby pamby mossyman" when you need him? big al (MR.) davis really dropped the oblate spheroid on that one eh, panty smeller?
PS faida fanatics, I started taking spelling lessons from the "faida nation" in general. I expect to be spellin rite up their with "panty stainer" all season long. Get your "defend the nation" pee-shirts" early....you'll need em!
Why would "j-rust" want to sign with a PROVEN LOSER? he's got all the cards, he is playing it smart, "big al(MR.) davias the genius" will screw this pick up as he did with "todd the geezer maroonavitch" when "big al (mR.) davis the geius" put all that time and money into grooming a prototype qb machine of the future.....so much fore the "genius" of "big al (MR.) davis" you are dreaming if you think "j-rust" will ever take a snap from that swisscheese o-line of the faidas. He's too smart for that, he'll do an "ellie manning" and hold out for a chance with a team that can possibly win 3 or 4 games in a season! Keep on dreaming nation!!!! Get out those rilla gorilla magilla qbkilla suits.
at least we don't pack fudge like you gay whiner fans.....you may have 5 rings, but we at least we're not gonna die from aids. at least on our side of the bay, we didn't have dead people who voted for our stadium. what an embarrassment that was! that's because your gay city is too busy looking after gay rights and marriages instead of building a 5 time superbowl winning team a decent stadium! who'll be laughing last when your quack doctor moves them to a different town that WILL build a stadium?
dude/dike, whatever you are. why do you even waste your time here? speaking of panties, why don't you go chase your tommyboy ammiano and all your limp wrist liberals in your gay town frisco? we don't bother you but then again, you must be a closet raider fan because you're obviously spending time in our chat. so just leave us alone man.
Last year, if my memory is any good, Matt Leinart didn't sign until camp was over [or just about over] and things seemed to work out just fine. As I've said before, a big plus is JaMarcus isn't woofing so his head's on right...fortunately for the Nation, Culpepper is stepping up and may hold the job down until Russell is ready. Culpepper's fumbling just comes along with the pluses [he fumbled in Minnesota too], all the more reason for Russell and his big paws to get in camp....
Anon 11:33 Huh?
Hindsight: instead of posturing for a blockbuster pre-draft trade, shouldn’t the Raiders have been negotiating with Russell to determine whether or not the terms of a deal would be realistic for them?
The #1 pick in the draft is far too important to screw up. We had any number of options, for which my first choice has always been (and still is) to sign Russell. And now, almost 3 games into the preseason, we don’t have our number pick. For all practical purposes, our number one pick was Zach Miller. Not bad, but not enough!
I believe adequate money has been put on the table, but the holdout may relate to guarantees, a word whose meaning has been twisted and turned into “not really guaranteed.” Sure, let’s place a Michael Vick (a/k/a Pacman Jones) condition in the agreement, but shouldn’t the risk of injury and performance really be ours? Otherwise, we have no business picking #1.
Inasmuch as I think top rookies are way overpaid (and unfairly to veterans), why should we be compelled into groundbreaking territory? Just pay Russell his money and provide him with the guarantees that are commensurate the current market standard (the standard we had to know existed before we made the pick). Then, let the league and the NFLPA hash this mess out, because something clearly needs to be done.
Btw, I agree with Calico’s 9:53 post and remain hopeful those issues place enough pressure on Russell and his agents to sign; but I also agree with Scorpio’s 10:11 post that this standoff could potentially cost us a full year in Russell’s development. There are no winners if this continues.
Random thoughts: The Russell trade rumor is a buncha' BS.
Tyler Brayton is as good as gone, let's just hope Sapp can 'play nice' with G. Warren if he makes the team. The more I think about the Warren trade the more I like it. Another top pick, dirt cheap, low risk guy who just needs a little motivation.
Watching the game again, I think our O-Line is no longer a weakness. It may even be a strenth. But again, we'll get a better look Friday.
Pepper is the man. My guess is he'll be named the starter early next week.
I think Kiffin pays close attention to what the fans say, check out this subtle little quote regarding L. Jordan: "He looked really good today and it’s not just constant conversations with him about being a great back and he came out today."
Psycho
I personally think that Sapp is actually afraid of the competition that Warren is going to bring to the table.
Sapp did kinda seem unusually offended by the G.Warren signing. Maybe he heard footsteps knowing he's considered 'old' and seeing other veterans get cut. He should not feel threatened though. A 40 year old Sapp is probably better than a 27 year old G.Warren IMO.
Or maybe Sapp just knows what buttons to push to make a guy live up to his potential, and let him know who's D-Line this is at the same time.
Psycho
NYRaider:
Davis negotiated with both Russell and Quinn before the draft. That's why they drafted Russell.
Calico is right (nice to hear from ya Calico), Davis holds all of the cards. If Russell's agents choose to sit Russell down for the entire season, and re-enter the draft next year, Davis will have done a big favor for the entire league (and once again showed that he's the only owner with any guts) and saved themselves 60 million dollars. We all hate to lose the #1 pick, but if he sets the bar too high to meet, why be a sucker and buy into it?
At the time we drafted Russell, Culpepper wasn't available. By holding out, Russell made the timing right to acquire Culpepper. And according to Al, Culpepper reminds Davis of Jim Plunkett. He does to me too. They have similar styles, and they came to us via similar histories.
I am certain that statement, which Davis wouldn't have made if Russell were in camp (because he'd want the focus to be on Russell in order to build ticket sales)was designed to draw a line in the sand to Russell's agents. He was saying that if Culpepper pans out, he's absolutely willing to extend Culpeppers contract.
Nobody wanted Russell to be our "quarterback of the future" more than I did. But Russell's agents are being stupid, and Davis is making good business sense. If Culpepper continues to shake off the rust, I can be fully on board with him being our QB (which just might have the effect of speeding the Raider recovery plan).
bama7
Blanda, how can you know Russell's agents are being stupid if you don't really know the details of the contact? The only two facts we know for sure about this are:
1. Everyone that has leaked info on it has said the sticking point is on the guarantee and Al's desire to include a skill clause (and no one has shown proof to me yet that a former 1st pick has a skill clause working against their guarantee).
2. Al has a recent history of being a dumbass in regards to personnel, i.e, Shroeder, Marc Wilson, Rusty Hilger, Jeff George, Kerry Collins, Art Shell, Tom Walsh, Alvis Whitted, James Jett, Bob Buczcowski, Ricky dudley, Jano in the 1st, Tyler Brayton, Derick Gibson.. I could go on but will stop.
This situation should have been worked out a long time ago or we shouldn't have selected the guy.
And yes, Al holds all the cards, he usually does, but it doesn't mean he'll win the hand. he may win for the league, but he's not winning for us. Man up and eat the cost tightwad.
Russell is supposedly the best QB prospect to come down the pipeline in a long, long time. He is tall, 260 lbs, can move and has the best arm ever. Ever. On top of that he is humble and behaves. Let's build around him. If he has a running game and a good defense, his tools will carry us the rest of the way.
Is Al's "hand" that he had no intentions of signing him early, drag the ordeal out and hope the guy capitulates? How do we know his agents aren't offering to back him financially until he signs a REAL contract?
We could have had several weeks of practice under this guy's belt, a few pre-season games and good commeraderie amongnst he and his teammates. Instead we save a few $$'s and waste another year of a great defense if Culpepper doesn't work out.
Miami & Atlanta badly need QBs... (green has little time left) if Russell waits until next year he'd hold a few private workouts, his stock will soar again, he'll agree to a contract before the draft and we lose completely.
Yes, he'd lose some money but he also can't be the lauginstock of the nfl when his guarantee with a skill clause ends up being less than others in this year's draft.
Here's hoping we sign him in the next week. The rams have the best D will face so far, with a solid defensive front that will require decision making by the QB. Let's see how our starter fares. Our luck will be Walter will play against the scrubs and do adequate to well, further prolonging everyone's misery.
Bama7:
One of the things that Kiffin has repeatedly said is that he's confident that the negotiators "are doing everything necessary to protect the future of this team." At first Davis was accused of not ponying up enough money. It turned out that was a lie, and Davis was offering exactly what everyone expected Russell to cost.
Then Davis said that Russell's agents wanted the 30+ million to be flat out guaranteed under all conditions. I haven't heard any denial of that, just the complaint about the "skill clause" that Davis wants inserted. Nobody but you has told me that no #1 pick has ever had to deal with a "skill clause." I haven't heard that from any reliable source, but I have heard that Alex Smith didn't get a skill clause.
Well, Al Davis is not quite the same as current 49er management (thank God!). The player you say that Al screwed up on I don't believe you can lay all at Al's feet. Remember, I don't buy into the opinion that Al makes every draft choice and that coaches never say to him "please get me this particular guy." I don't think that Al was responsible for bringing in Plunkett. I think that was a suggestion from Flores because he didn't trust the actual Davis choice (Pastorini). Basically I don't buy into the frequently stated idea that everything wrong with the Raiders is Al's fault, and all the good things are somebody else's. Al is certainly capable of making mistakes, but I think he makes far fewer of them than most, and his mistakes come on the backs of reasonable gambles.
The guarantee issue has come up because nobody was quite certain what certain types of guarantees would legally do before they were implemented. Note Denver and Ashley Lelie. Lelie simply refused to show up for work, but Denver found themselves in the position of having to pay him his money anyway.
I don't like the idea of putting our whole wad up for the limited gamble, but gamble all the same, of Russell at the expense of signing anyone of value in the future because we can't afford it. That said, the QB is probably the most important position on the field, and Russell may prove himself worth that money, but in any contract BOTH sides deserve some guarantee - not just one.
Bama7:
You said: Yes, he'd lose some money but he also can't be the lauginstock of the nfl when his guarantee with a skill clause ends up being less than others in this year's draft.
His contract only would wind up being less if Russell were a bust. If there's no concern about him being a bust (on his end) then why would he worry about it. It is true that sometimes situations arrise with teams where a player turns out to be a bust because of the actions of the team. I don't think that would be the case here. Everything the Raiders have done prepares them for Russell taking over this team as QB. Davis has smartly, however, covered his hand with the signing of Culpepper. But we'll have to make a decision on Culpepper at the end of the season.
Blanda-
"Davis negotiated with both Russell and Quinn before the draft. That's why they drafted Russell."
If that's so, why isn’t Russell signed? That was last winter. Davis must have seen the writing on the wall.
Making an example of Russell is all well and good, but it leaves us (the Raiders) with a big fat zero. That's a tough pill to swallow for having the #1 pick in the draft.
As far as Culpepper being our next FA savior QB, I see both he and McCown as just stopgaps to our future, and the reason we picked Russell #1. If not, Al should strongly consider securing one of these guys long-term before one of them actually earns a higher salary (and a chance to play somewhere else). Otherwise, it’s back to square one at QB.
It’s just very disappointing because it looked like we had a sound long-term plan at QB. I guess only time will tell if a deal gets done, but wasted time is not on our side.
NYRaider:
The Raiders discussed numbers with Russell and Quinn, not terms.
But I can see it now if Davis signs Russell under his terms and then turns out to be a bust. Russell's name will wind up on Bama's list, and it will be all Davis' fault. But you can't have it every way from Sunday. There's something in business that is known as RISK, and it should apply to both sides, not just one.
Something I find kind of interesting. When I started advocating for Russell, back before the draft, folks argued with me and said that the Raiders should trade down because signing Russell would be inviting a Ryan Leaf type of situation.
I didn't worry about that because I figured that Davis would do exactly what he's doing, by demanding some accountability to what Russell earns. Now the other side is giving me heat, because Davis isn't handing the keys to the kindom over to Russell.
Let me make my position very clear. I'm in favor of signing Russell, but I'm opposed to Ryan Leaf scenarios. Davis either drafted Russell or let Kiffin make the choice (which I strongly support no matter who made the decision), and now he's protecting the team by reducing the gamble. He's signed two competitive QBs, and demanding that in order for Russell to take away 31 million in guarantees Russell has to do more than show up at Alemeda.
Everyone here should know that giving Russell his money is going to mean saying goodbye, at some point, to players we like around here. Perhaps Burgess, perhaps Nhamdi. I can deal with that if Russell is as good as he appears to be. But we'll never be sure of his quality until he gets on an NFL field. What I won't be able to tollerate is losing Burgess, losing Nhamdi, and finding out Russell is a complete waste of human flesh. That's the way San Diego does business, not the Raiders.
Blanda-
You make some good points, and obviously I don't know what's on the table, but all this "let's be groundbreaking and we'll show Russell and his agents talk" is nonsense.
Hopefully, Russell has been given a fair market offer, and not one that sets a "new bar" for the sake of the NFL or Mr. Davis' ego.
If the market for top rookie contracts suggests we assume the risk, than I believe that is what we accepted when we drafted him. As compelling as it might be, let's not be the ones to change the rules (i.e., the market).
bama7
Yes, it gets back to the fact that we don't know the details of the offer. Something is making Russell's side take the VERY risky position of holding out this long.
And Blanda, as for Davis I've seen enough of the guy the last twenty years to know that he ain't all there football wise. I mean first he says dismissing shell was the worst move of his career, then he fires shell, saying "he set the franchise back years". he allowed Walsh as OC, twice dammit! C'mon, that's awful. And the shcolarships, everyone knows those are Al's pets. Everyone knows that. And everyone knows that most of the "pets" suck... and suck for years on end with no chance of being dismissed (until Kiffen)
If anything, Al's the one of guilty of taking credit for all that's been good but avoiding blame for mistakes. At the end of last season he took credit for the defense's resurgence last year, remember?
And as for Namdi, I want him to succeed but prior to last year he was looking like a bust. Let's see the guy back last year up with another strong showing... this time when opposing offenses HAVE to throw the ball on us in a few games.
The Russell ordeal is just senseless. Should have been worked out a long time ago.
Bama:
I guess the difference between us is you see some things as big mistakes, I see them as gambles that didn't pay off. Let's face it, you can never be sure of anything until you actually see it in front of you. Evidence can serve to mislead you. I'll give you a for instance...
Todd Marinovich: Here we're talking about a guy who was brought up by his father, from the day he could walk, to emmulate Ken Stabler. He was even left handed. He brought Todd along through pee wee football, through Pop Warner, through high school, through getting a football schalorship at USC. All the while showing him how to play just like Stabler. I don't know if Marinovich actually won the Heisman, but I know he was a candidate. He was born, bread, and trained to be the Stabler perfect fit for the Raiders.
If you're Al Davis you take that shot. I would have, and whether you admit it or not, you would have too. But it turned out that Todd actually resented his father focusing his life the way he had, and when he left the influence of his father looked for other interests such as surfing and smoking pot.
Davis has a good football mind, but he's not a psychiatrist. All of the football indicators were a go, but it was the psychology that was lacking.
For every decision that Davis may have made that you label a "mistake," I can list two which were unmitigated successes. Nothing is ever "known" until happens. With the benefit of hind sight, we can all call Davis an idiot. But the fact is, in football, as in everything else, you win some and you lose some. For my part, I'll stick with Davis' track record.
Bama7
I'm not so sure Al liked Marinovich for any "stabler" qualities. Al never really liked Stabler and you can read Snake's book and know that. Snake left in a similar way that Marcus Allen left.
I just think Al doesn't know when to get out of the way, that's all. he should watch the games from the booth and do nothing else. Let Kiffen and others run the team now.
NYRaider:
We are unable to nagotiate a longer contract with Culpepper because he is only willing to sign a one year contract....he was offered 15mil over 3 seasons by the "Jag"s but he refused....he left "TB" because they wanted to talk about a longer contract....and when we signed him he was at the end of the rope....so we got him extreemly cheap....he will only cost us $750K if he is not the starter and reach certain thresh-holds....his contract can go as high as $5.5mil if he reaches everything....
I do not believe him to be a "StopGap"....I believe him to be in a position to prove himself and if so he will be offered a new longer term contract by the Raiders and he will sign again with this team....that is how things were presented when he was signed because we have him and can keep him under contract instead of letting another team take him away....
As for "JRus" he is needed also...the style of play between the two are so close that there will not have to be any change in the game plan when we change form one to another...that's a "Plus" that no other team has....but we would have....AlDavis is not going to let "JRus" get away but he is also not going to allow his signing to restict the team from signing Culpepper again for next year and the year after....And I agree....don't go for broke in one season when you are not prepaired to make a ligitimate run for the "SB" any way....why the hell would we do something like that....we are not poised for the "PlayOff"s yet....are we....
PantyRaider....Al's-da-Mastah!!!!
PS...Da "Donko"s are "DeadMeat"....the new "Winner"s on the block...."Shanon" must have learned that when he was their "OC"....I am laughin so hard and enjoying watchin them plunge to the bottom of the "AFCW"....Ha! Ha! Ha!...Or should I say "Hee Hah! Hee Hah! Hee Hah"....
Bama7:
You're right about Stabler and Allen being the same kind of situation, but with a minor exception. Davis' objection to Stabler was that he was a party animal who didn't take care of himself. It had nothing to do with his playing style. He didn't like Allen because of the celebrity crowd that Allen hung out with in LA (including the OJ Simpson crowd). Davis felt both of these guys drew too much personal attention. Allen was also very good about not saying self agrandizing things to the media, but it was apparently a much different case in the locker room.
But I lived in LA at the time they drafted Marinovich, and the Stabler comparison was very real and widely reported. So if I believe what you have to say, that would mean that Davis had nothing to do with drafting Marinovich (Stabler II) because he didn't like Stabler I, or is it because he likes to cut off his nose to spite his face?
Blanda-
You have a good memory about Marijuanavich and his upbringing. I remember the Stabler comparisons, but mostly because he was left handed, plus a lot of wishful thinking.
wrt Russell, I’m worried that Al might have all of the sudden become gun shy from past experiences, and is now wavering on what might otherwise be market-driven terms regarding skill clauses in the Russell negotiations.
PantyRaider-
We can agree to disagree about Culpepper being a stopgap, but the proof is in his refusal to sign a longer deal. He can play his ass off here and leave us in the dust next year when someone like Dan Snyder offers him more than we would ever consider. Meanwhile, we could be drafting another QB next year and starting this same process over again with some other FA retread. That thought has me a little concerned.
Hopefully, we all just blowing off steam here, and Russell is on his way to Alameda.
Bama7
Your riddle leaves me bit perplexed, Batman. Seriously, Blanda, I think Al did pick Marinovich, but not because of any Stabler resemblance. I don't see any resemblance other than they both threw leftie. One's a surfer dude that trained really hard coming up, the other was more a biker dude that's sole workout consisted of curling 12 ounce cans.
Only point I've been trying to make is that the Russell deal should have long since been done and it would have been in our best interest to get him at the stat of camp. Our Qb situation calls for it. McCaown is a back-up. Walter is a good qb if the defense opposing him is not very talented. When the game speeds up, he breaks down. He's not the answer.
Culpepper is good but the son of B cannot, I repeat cannot hold on to a football. Hwo many turnovers did he have when we beat them in Oakland a few years ago? I like him, but for some reason he's a fumbling machine.
We need Russell. If the guy ends up being one of the top 5 qb's in the league then he's worth the 30 mil guranteed.
While Al's "skill clause" argument might be financially prudent, it's not been attached to any former #1 pick best I can tell. Or number 2 for that matter or else we'd be in for one hell of a rebate on Mr Gallery.
Well, I'm obviously not dealing with personality here but with style and technique. Same kind of arm, same kind of touch, same kind of accuracy. But it's not a coincidence that I bring up Marinovich, because I think that's the lesson Davis is reacting to.
Marinovich's background was being brought up for nothing but playing football. When he broke free of his family, it turned out that he had all of the tools, but none of the desire. Russell has similar red flags, only in Russell's case I think it was his uncle. Once he travels 2500 miles away from his family, and no longer under his family's influence, will he have the same desire he's always displayed? Odds are that he'll be fine, but Davis wants to cover his bases in a way that he failed to do with Marinovich, and I can't blame him.
Blanda-
Wasn't it these same character-type issues that the Raiders thoroughly investigated prior to drafting Russell? If Russell wants to get paid (which I believe he does), he can afford to bring Aunt Em with him to the land of Al.
Todd Marinovich's college career was a carbon copy of Stabler's best years in Oakland. I was born and raised in Southern California (Palos Verdes) and have been an avid Trojan & Raider fan my entire life.
I can remember distinctly the comparisons between Marinovich & Snake. Both were extremely accurate short to medium passers who found ways to win. I was not the least bit surprised when Al drafted Marinovich. Al has strong ties to USC and the Raiders were desperate for a QB at the time. Like Blanda said earlier, some times you roll the dice. Marinovich came up "craps" but I will never knock Al for willingly taking calculated risks whether it works out or not. The draft & free agency will always have its fair share of hits & misses.
JRuss & the "skill clause" ...
Does anyone have a good grip on what exactly the "skill clause"
entails? Is it a certain performance standard? Games started? How exactly is it defined? Just wondering because this clause seems to be the standard for #1 picks.
In my mind, the Raiders should be protected in case of detrimental conduct by Russell to include a weight clause; reporting to future minicamps, OTAs, training camp on time; misconduct that involves the law; personal injury away from the football field (ie. horseplay clause in case of biking accident, basketball injury, etc).
Russell should be protected in case of an injury on the field and be allowed to develop his craft without worrying about a "skill clause". Basically, if he is a good citizen & diligent employee he should reap the majority of benefits from a HUGE, landmark contract.
If Al is unnecessarily drawing a line in the sand and bucking the system by not including the "injury & skill" clause that would be a shame.
If Russell is unnecessarily drawing a line in the sand and greedily asking for more than $31M in guarantees in the form of an option bonus that would be a shame.
Todd Marinovich....one point that is not being discussed is that he is the son of Marve Marinovich who played for Al Davis and the Raiders and remained a very close friend with Al.....Al had continual contact with the boy as he was growing up and followed his carrear thru school and onto USC....If I remember corectly it was Al who encouraged him to attend USC and not some other school....it had been agreed upon well in advance that when Todd was ready he would become a Raider....
Todd entered the draft early because of some sort of problems in school....the rest of the NFL was down on drafting him because of those problems....but Al took him with the Raiders #1 pick and was called a "Fool" for the pick....and for once the "Mediot"s turned out right....old family ties had gotten in the way of logic....
Todd was groomed to be another "Snake" and unfortuneately he also had his problems with abuse but could not keep his life together under the influence like Ken could...he was not commited....
NYRaider: This is just my opinion....but Culpper already walked away from "BigBuck"s....he had a garenteed contract with Miami and he could have just sat on his ass and made them pay him....and if he was traded he did not have to renagotiate his contract and the new team would have to keep paying him just as Miami did....but he walked away from that....it was the huge contract that he signed with the "Vikes" and went thru "2011"....he wanted to start over in a place where he was wanted and had a chance to compete without that big money hanging around his neck...
So he declared that he wanted a one year deal where he must prove himself again and earn the money he would be paid latter....so that is where he is now....so it's my opinion that he will not be "$" deiven and will resign with the Raiders on a long term deal for fair market value and turn down the big offers that may or may not turn up....look for the Raiders to nagotiate a contract before the season is up if he is the starter and playing as well as I think he will....
The "BigDollar" offers will come from the "Donko"s -n- "Squaw"s who are in need of help and it would be "Addition-by-Subtraction" for them....
PantyRaider.....Culpepper/Russel Era!!!!
Todd....I recall now that he had leagal problems becuase of the "DrugAbuse"....he was arested for "MaryJane" posession....Thats why USC was not standing behind him and I think he lost elegibility to play his "Sr" season....and went for the draft...
PantyRaider.....LongLongTimeAgo!!!!
Here is a very good history of the "Todd" story if you are interested....that is if you believe "SI" as a source of correct information because it's quoated in the artical....Daddy was an "OL" for the Raiders....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Todd_Marinovich
PantyRaider....MemoryHurtsMeHead!!!
Todd....This is a quoat that I found.....is it true????
mburns said...
Todd is doing great things now. He is happy working with kids, teaching them his art, throwing the football. He has taken the pressure off many fathers who haven't learned from Marv's mistakes. He coaches the kids with intelligence and leadership, and is a great example of loving the game. He truly loves the game and is an excellent coach. The game is lucky to have him back involved.
PantyRaider....Haugh!!!!!
"LJ" signed a 5 year contract to stay in "KC"....Damned-it-anyway!!!!...I don't get 3 wishes...
PantyRaider.....JustSadness!!!!
After losing Ebenezer Ekuban to injury, the Broncos become the lead suitor for Rice.....lets hope that is just "Crap"....or is that why they traded Waren to us.....
The "Lamb"s are also interested as reported......too bad we don't have money left to spend....thank you "JRus".....
PantyRaider....KeepinTrack!!!!!
Calico Jack (6:52) well said. That's exactly my thinking. Contracts are not unilateral, so let's hope the terms on the table are based on market circumstance and not some unreasonable demand(s) by either side.
PantyRaider-
The fins released Culpepper, so he didn’t have a lot of options if he wanted to play. He came to Oakland to compete for a starting job and possibly mend a bad rep he received in Miami. Opportunity ($$) will likely dictate his future, and that could land him anywhere. However, the longer Russell holds out, the more desperate we will be to retain his services... provided he plays well.
PS, I've been reading some Denver media and they (and the fans) seem to be beside themselves about the Warren trade and how thin the Donkeys have left themselves on their D-line. Of course much of the Denver media want to spin the story and say the Donkeys were "lauded" around the NFL for getting anything for a player they were about to release; even suggesting the Raiders would be stuck with Warren’s inflated salary. Yeah! A whopping league vet minimum $600k. Meanwhile, the Donkeys got stuck like pigs for $2.2 million of Warren’s 2007 pay. That’s got to be one of the most amusing stories this year. Plus, you have to credit Al and the Raiders for unprecedented bargain shopping this year.
Panty, is that you? Somebody's been using your banner. Your most recent lengthy post seemed to be very articulate. I guess as the Rum shots accumulated, you sounded more like yourself as you continued. I guess you just don't usually post at the beginning of happy hour. But great memory for the the Marinovich tragedy.
Peter King at SI is claiming that Russell doesn't want to play for the Raiders, which is why he's holding out. Of course, he doesn't present any evidence for that, but it fits right in with his hater ways.
While I have some concern over 3 fumbled snaps in 2 games, I'm very confident that Culpepper will start the season and prove effective. It's not just his greater experience and physical tools. He seems to present the best leadership in the huddle.
After the first few games, if Russell still isn't here and Culpepper is doing well (I'm not discounting Walter as a possibility here, but I don't think it will be McCown), I think the Raiders will begin to explore the possibility of trading the rights to sign Russell. They'll do it before the trade deadline during the season.
I don't know if that would help Russell's cause any (in terms of getting what he wants), but since he never showed up for camp there is little likelihood that Russell would start until somewhere in the 2008 season. So I think that the Raiders would explore the idea of trading his rights for a big time, established player who could make an impact in 2007. This is just a possibility, but it makes sense if the right deal should present itself.
a decent and fair article by glenn dickey:
http://www.examiner.com/a-891681~****
ey__Give_Al_credit_for_taking_a_stand.
html
Scorpio:
I read that article. From someone who publicly hates Al Davis as much as Dickey does, I was simply amazed.
I find much to disagree with, however (while I tend to agree with him about the Russell situation). I'm starting to be of the opinion that the idea that "this team was never going to contend for a playoff spot, whoever the quarterback" might be a wee bit short sighted.
azraider63
One more thing, Marv Marinovich not only played for the Raiders, but he also became our Strength and Conditioning coach after his playing days. So yes, Al was very in tune with Todd's upbringing.
Bama7
Has anyone heard any reports that Mike & Mike ESPN in the morning reported that Oakland and Russell's camp began talks again this week and have made progress? It said that they expect him to sign before the season starts. I saw a post on the net from a Raider fan on this. Another fan chimed in that they heard it too and that Sirius radio was reporting the same thing today, adding that they expected a deal as early as this week.
Bama7
Panty: watching these quick highlights of the SF game i see one play where Culpepper definitley looks like his mobility is back.
But huff & Washington- toast.
http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter?season=2007&week=PRE2&game_id=29481
Bama7:
I saw an article sometime this week that talks about that Culpepper play. It said that was the first test Kiffin gave Culpepper before they signed him, to see if he could make that play. Kif knew the play would come up for Culpepper sometime during the preseason, and when he finally saw it he was pleased.
BlandaRocked:
Sorry If I seemed not myself....but I can't even spell "articulate" so I don't understand how it sliped in there....Ha! Ha!...I guess I just lost my consentration...
NYRaider:
I was reading everything as soon as it became posible that Culpepper would become available...the fish wanted to trade him and his contract but Culpepper forced them to release him so the contract would be trashed and he could go where he want's to play and sign a new deal after he proves himself again...
That is why I don't think "$$$" is his main interest...I think he has made some very good inverstments with all that "Cash" he got from the "Vikes" on that 10 year deal he signed and is now very comfortable....I think his #1 interest is to play ball and start....and to have a new long term home....
Bama7:
I was having a "HeartAtack" when I saw that play...I saw his leg get hit and he was stumbling forward and I thought I saw him limp afterwards....but there was NO problem so I recovered...He looked great....and this team comes alive when he comes in the game....
PantyRaider....Excited!!!!
Well I finally got an answer on how much the cost is for internet viewing of the NFL....so This is what I will do when in Thailand and Cambodia durring the season...going back durring the "BuyWeek"...Oct 2.....
Hello Rich,
Thank you for writing to Yahoo! Sports.
I appreciate your inquiry with regards to the prices for the different subscription packages.
Season Pass: Only $239.99 (until Sept 1, 07:00 GMT) a $40 savings. After Sept 1 the price is $279.99.
Follow Your Team Pass: Pick 1 game per week, only $199.99
Weekly Pass: $19.99 for Week 1, a $5 savings. After Week 1 the price is $24.99.
So I am just happy that I get to see the games....otherwise....I would be in "Torment" while in "Paradise"....
PantyRaider...JustSmilenBaby!!!
Blanda:
I think the Raiders will begin to explore the possibility of trading the rights to sign Russell. They'll do it before the trade deadline during the season.
I was told this by someone that is rarely wrong on things like this:
"To make matters worse for Putz and Cock, the deadline to trade JR's rights expired on Aug 10th. Now his rights can't be traded until the end of the League Year (March 1, 2008).
Blanda-
I read that King article and did he not know that Russell bought a house in Oakland? Is that the sign of someone who doesn't want to be a Raider? I guess that's why Russell wore an all black suit on draft day. Of course, since its under the heading of "Ten Things I Think I Think" he's got cover for shoveling this load of bull.
Gary:
That gives me more faith in the rumblings that the two sides are talking again. Failing to come an agreement would be good for neither side, even though I think the Raiders would be less damaged than Russell.
Realist:
Exactly! But these days I guess the great thing about being a reporter is that you don't need to know the news, you can just make it up on the spot.
You know that commedy show, "Who's Line Is It Anyway?" We ought to have something like that for the news. The Improvisational News Channel! Ah, never mind. All they'd be doing is changing the title.
Blanda-
Now the PTI guys are getting into the act repeating what King said. See how it works, make some stuff up and the other lazy, no good reporters will help throw the bull.
I wish there were a sports news network with guess what...actual sports news without the "booyah" for true fans of the sport. Whatever happened to "Just the facts, ma'am?" Oh that's right, that was a TV show, there never has been sports news like that, its only gotten worse.
Bama7
Can anyone else verify that ESPN's Mike & Mike in the morning radio reported that Jruss may actually sign by the end of this week?
Culpepper (no surprise) got the nod for Saturday.
"Oh, those lovable loser Raiders"
Well here is some "HateMail" from the "DenverPost" after Waren slaped the "Donko"s in da face....or should I say in da "Ass" sense it's hard to tell the differance....
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_6688700
Notice they try to pick on MrDavis and put his aged picture on the artical....so what does PstBowlen look like these days....I need to get his picture and do some "TouchUp" work....long ears and a "ShitTrail" should work....
The "Donko"s have so maney injuries that a "TE" had to play the "OT" position.....their "O" -n- "D" are both bange up....so let's help them out....what do you do with a "LameMule"....yes that's right....shoot the damn thing in the head and put it out of it's missery.....
It's going to so much fun watching them "Plunge" to the bottom and take up the position we are vacating....
PantyRaider....Here'sToLookinUp!!!!
Culpepper..That's great news...thanks for the info.....celibratino time.....so who's second....
Panty-
Here's my response to that Donkey writer:
...It's always interesting to read what the other guy is thinking, or if he is at all. If you know your Donkeys so well, then you know Warren is now in his element with Rod Ryan's one-gap system.
The fact is, the Donkeys have left themselves extremely thin along their D-line, and it looks like they can't stop the run anyway.
Thing about playing a 2-14 team, you never want to lose to them, but sometimes it's unavoidable. See ya real soon.
Meanwhile, keep up the good work!
A must read Jerry McDonald update (editorial) on JaMarcus Russell.
http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/2007/08/22/personal-contact-_-what-a-concept/
I'm sorry, but Jerry McDonald is absolutely right. That's the beauty of having the number one pick in the draft... knowing who you're going to pick and knowing exactly what it's going to cost you. That's why, as dumb as it seems, the Texans picked Williams over Bush. They did their homework. Let's hope this first-time face-to-face of the parties produces a meeting of the minds.
I read Jerry's article. As much as I usually agree with Jerry, he's over the top on this one. I do happen to know the negotiation process. I'm not a negotiator, but I work for folks who do a lot of it. Most negotiations are conducted through e-mail and through telephone conference. It's rediculous to meet because each side has to deal with their own records which are readily available in their own offices. For the most part, face to face negotiations went out the window when desktop computers came in.
That said, that they have now met face to face after not talking for quite some time is a very good sign. The face to face represents some determination to get it resolved after the standoff.
NYRaider:
Good reply....this season will be much more fun than "06"
The artical says everything is the Raiders fault....but where are these agents located....the metting is in LA so that tells me that the Raiders had to travil to LA to meat with the agents....not the other way around....why havent these agents been up in OakTown knocking on the door....they are the ones trying to get a "PayCheck" here....Not the Raiders.....
PantyRaider.....WorthlassNagotiators!!!
A little clarification on my previous post. In this day and age, when there is a face to face it's generally with the idea that it's so close that a deal may be struck, papers will be signed, and a press release will be issued.
My take on this is that they are very close, but there is still a sticking point. When negotiators are fed up with each other is usually when one or both sides start negotiating through the press, and that isn't happening. So it appears to me that both sides have determined that there is currently no rush to finish, but a deal will be done.
I think that this information reflects that the reports on Serus radio are probably accurate. There's a sticking point that both sides want resolved, and both sides think the issue can be resolved. They just haven't quite figured out the best way to do that yet.
BlandaRocked:
I here what your saying and I like that format....it makes alot more sense than the rest of the "Crap" that I have been reading....and it's similar to a 3 1/2 year battle in Fersral Court that I finished with last year....
The parties never got together until late when there was a posibility of settlement....up until than everything was done thru the net and "SnailMail" and sometimes the "Fax" for signiture requierments in a hurry....
PantyRaider....HaveFaithRaiderNation!!!
Panty:
I think Russell's agents are on the east coast, so an LA meeting would have represented "neutral ground" where both sides had to travel, and meeting times would be limited.
Bama7
NY RAider: Thanks, for the heads up on the article. I don't consider J MacDonald a hater. He's my favorite Raider scribe and he's dead on, here. dead on. What he says is exactly where my head is at right now. I put this all on the Raiders at this point. It's obvous the young guy wants to play... but for a fair deal. Al's trying to break him and his agents down... simple as that. The whole ordeal is an embarrassement on an otherwise beautiful off season and camp. And I understand the leverage Al has here, but Al had 'em painted into a corner and is damaging the thing long term. I can pull rank on my wife all day long, but it ain't always the best move. He's gotta come off the skill clause, because they're not common that high in the draft. Again, if they were common, we'd be cashing a nice rebate on Mr Gallery right about now.
The one good thing now, with them meeting, is that Al is close to the kid... Russell can win him over. Again. Al's a softie for a guy that wants to play and wear silver and black. And Russell does. There's hope this guy will be signed soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Blanda-
don't under-estimate the importance of face-to-face. This isn't a real estate transaction where one party is emailing rent rolls and P&L statements. This is a straight-up, in your face deal for a $60 million personal services contract. As a party to this transaction, they have to know their business.
Glad to hear there is some thawing out on the Russell negotiations. I agree with BlandaRocked in terms of the preliminary negotiations & parameters being set & conducted through email & conference calls.
However, never underestimate the impact of meeting face to face. Meeting face to face shows good faith by both side, a committment to get the contract resolved, and a sense of urgency to close the deal. If Russell is moved into his new home in Oakland Hills by Sept. 1st, I will be a happy camper! :)
All eyes on Pepper & the OLine...
The 3rd exhibition game on Friday night vs. the Lambs should be a good opportunity for Culpepper to work with the 1st unit and develop a chemistry with JP, Curry, and Miller. The OLine will be tested by a very good Lamb D front 4. I'm also interested in seeing if Jordan continues to run with authority & decisiveness.
Onward & Upward. Cheers!
Calico Jack
P.S. I miss Heartland Raider rattlin' the cages. Stop by the Raider Take Pub and enjoy a cold one with your Raider comrades.
Well, we do have a new Raider in the family, but sorry it's not JRuss, yet.
My son, Caleb, was born to my wife and I August 22nd, at 5:20pm (CST). He was scouted at the combine at 8 pounds, 8 ounces, and stood tall at 20 inches. Mr. Davis was heard saying, "He'll make a great middle linebacker one day. He could possibly be the next Ted Hendricks."
Good ol' Mr Davis!
Happy times for my family, and happier as the Raiders progress to glory.
Congrats Raider Nate.
Always nice to see some little Raiders in the making.
I have three myself, all playing football right now. The only bumber is my oldest (High School WR) just broke his wrist today in practice.
I think Lil' Caleb should come off the bench and take his spot. Just FedEx him overnight to Phoenix.
Once agian, congrats to you and Mrs. Nate
azraider63
CalicoJack:
I'm with you....I think this game is very important for our season and I hope they get some of the other players involved....The last game against Seattle will not be much of a gage because they will not play their first team very much in that game.....
"TE"s....Miller -n- Madsen are keepers and will produce well for this team....Maybe we keep a blocker or two along with them for the "ShortYardage" plays....
"WR"s....the big 3 are Williams, Curry -n- Porter but I want to see what we have in Higgins....he could be our "CliffBranch"....so time to say good riddens to Whitted....By! By! Baby! By! By!....Taylor can't catch the ball but he runs good routs and gets wide open....Morant and Gabrial have not been getting much exposure so I don't think they will stay around....unless Morant is signed to the "PracticeSquad"...
"RB"...I want to see what "Eche" can do with the #1's....I have seen enough of Jordan and I don't trust him to be consistant....Rhoads -n- Fargas will be good as "Change-o-Pace" backs....but I also want to see more of O'Neil....He can catch-n-Run as a "FB"....Griffith is here to stay.....about Crocket I don't know....age is not on his side....
"OL" will be tested and that's a good thing so I will wait until after the game to look at them....
PantyRaider.....Oh!dat"O".....
Good news for Donkey fans: They have just bolstered their depleted D-line by signing DT John Browning, a tired 11-year veteran who sat out last season with an assortment of injuries and is coming off back surgery. It will be interesting to read how the Denver media spins that into an upgrade over Warren.
Bama7
Congrats, Raider Nate.
As for Culpepper, the rams have a better DL than both Arizona and SFran. They'll be agressive cuz it's the 3rd preseason game. Their starters will play longer and they'll blitz some. Big test for Culpepper. If he handles himself well and doesn't turn the ball over, I think the QB job's his. Hopefully russell will be there to watch the game.
Yeah, where is Hearland? get your cantankerous ass back on the board.
With Russell getting closer the question will soon be; what the hell do we do with 4 QBs? Atlanta needs a QB. Maybe we can we can get a few picks for Walter or McCown. In one sense I'd rather keep Walter, but he seems to have a {psycho}logical issue with going from 'QB of the Future' to where he is, and it might be best for both sides to give wim a fresh start. But yeah, McCown isn't what I thought he was. Going back to RT's point in the Take, Dante fell in our lap and we couldn't be luckier.
Hey Nate congrats. My boys are getting older and I try not to force the Raiders on them. Speaking of proud father, lately my youngest (5) has been wearing Raider grear on his own and asking me stuff like what a shotgun formation is. Maybe he's the next Kiffin.
Psycho
"Todd the geezer marinovitch's" favorite drug was heroin, as usual you faida fanatics try to obfiscate anything that shows your group of lowlife thugs for what they really are. You ALL use the "ref's and NFL have a conspiricy against the faidas" lie to take away from the truth! The faidas aka(big al (MR.) davis) made the biggest mistake in years by wasting a # one on a guy who doesn't want to waste his time in a slum like choketown when he can play somewhere on a real team with a real shot at post season play. 'culpumper was/is a failure where ever he fumbles the ball away, point, he posted some records in Minn. with (who else but) "mamby pamby mossyman" but NO SUPER BOWLS. He went to Mia. where he did diddlysquat, and now he is your qb for big al's deep game? Ha ha ha haha .... what a waste, you will all be watching musical qb's this season... don't be surprised if you see 2 more qb's during the season not currently on the faida roster, maybe some late cast-offs from other teams like, chris sims or out of retirement the other snake, you guessed him "jake the snake plumber" or maybe even another go-around with "jeffy george"!!! Just wince baby, 0-16, no improvement. Sorry "roberta galleria" you lose AGAIN!
Jerry McDonald poseted a correction to Kiffins comments released by the Raiders after his last article. Kiffin made a mistake, this was not the first face to face meeting, it was only the first RECENT face to face meeting.
Hey, did anyone see John Lynch & the Donks complaining last week about the Cowboys playing them "too hard"? They said the Cowboys "games planned" against them and "Blitzed too much". What a bunch of pussies. Warren got out of there just in time.
Psycho
Way to go Raider Nate! Congrats!
NYRaider:
I'm not sure why your thinking real estate deals here. The folks I work for deal with contracts worth billions. In short, they make Russell's deal look like a chicken feed waste of time. We do world wide negotiations, and face to face meetings simply aren't practical. I also have experience in the entertainment industry where most negotiations are conducted over the phone, even though both parties are in the same town.
That face to face meetings are held to a minimum in the days of cell phones, computer e-mail, blackberries, and fax machines shouldn't surprise anybody. We're not living in the 1940s anymore. I don't know how aware you are of this modern technology thing, but now days you can even have a face to face when both parties are on opposite sides of the globe.
Raider Nate:
Amazing! Awesome! Way to go, Mom and Dad!
Anno (6:55AM):
Put your close back on and stop singing "I feel pretty."
Wow! Sorry Blanda, but us little chicken feed farmers think that a face-to-face meeting is necessary when negotiations come to an impasse, even tiny little $60 million deals. Telecom is fine when things are going smooth, but that's not exactly the case, is it?
Anybody know what's going on with Michael Bush? Will he be on the 53-man roster, remain status quo on the unable to perform list or get dumped onto IR (lost for the season)?
I think Bush believes he's ready and wants to play this year. His presence, even later in the season, may provide a huge boost for us.
Gettin' a little testy there, NYRaider? Not sure what upset you, but you began that discussion by telling me that my experience was in "rent rolls."
And if you'll check my previous posts, I never said that the face to face was "unimportant." I said that Jerry's comments were over the top (criticizing the parties for not having one) regarding how negotiations are carried out in this day and age.
In fact, I think I specifically said that it represents that both sides are very close. I agree with Calico here. When both parties agree to travel to neutral ground, it represents a certain urgency to get a deal done.
As to specifically what the problem is, none of us know. We can only speculate on the speculation that has been stated in a not very reliable media. But what I do know is that Al Davis has never had a problem finding money to pay players what they are worth. That's the only track record I have to go on. While I know that Russell's agents have never held a player out before, this is also there first #1. But then again, it's also Al's first #1. If I were Russell's agents, I'd prefer to have a career negotiating lots of #1s. If I was Al, I'd prefer #1s being a very rare thing because that would mean that I had to have the worst record to get it. I'm sure teams like Detroit have lots of experience with this. I'd rather be us.
BlandaRocked:
Just one tiny corection..."JRus"s agents also held out another 1st round pick this year....or at least were very late getting a deal done....They had the last 2 pickes that were unsigned....I think the other one was with the Jets.....something like that....he was signed after Quinn....
HearlandRaiderFan....He just must have ran out of topics to bitch about....he will be back when he has something to attack....That is if he is not one of those sensitive creatures who get's his feeling hurt when too many people disagree with him....Hell....I have had several "Postah"s disagree with me and sometimes with good reason....like last season when I was in "TOTAL" support of ArtShell....and than I had to conceed and "EatCrow"....still have the feathers between my teeth....and a very bad taste in my mouth....
"Donko"s....I can already here the entire NFL laughin...."Shannon" has become desperate and he can't stop the bleeding...."Donkeez-on-da-Rag"...His "D" line is full of Rookies and his "O" line needs a "TE" to play "OT"....and his "RB"s threw a "Shoe"....(Lame)...and his "QB" is a 45% passer....what a beautiful sight...
PantyRaider....Week#2!!!!!
Blanda-
"...you began that discussion by telling me that my experience was in "rent rolls."
Please, don’t put words into my mouth. I merely cited real estate as an example. Check my 6pm post again.
You said... "It's rediculous (i.e., ridiculous) to meet because each side has to deal with their own records which are readily available in their own offices.
I disagree with that not only because the parties are at an impasse and probably need personal contact to iron out their differences, but I don't know what office records they'll need to access in order to finalize the deal, e.g., birth certificate, immunizations, college stats...?
You of all people in this forum know that Al Davis is a hands on, face-to-face kind of person. And, if $60,000,000 (that's a lot of zeros!) is “chicken feed,” why do you support Al’s posturing to save a couple bucks?
Just an un-educated thought.....
Sense the agents for "JRus" want a larger amount of garenteed money than the Raiders are willing to give how about a compromise that benifits the Raiders....we are now at $31mil for a 6 year deal...could we go to $40mil garenteed for a 8 year deal worth $85mil....similar to the 6 year $65mil deal on the table....but include the clause that if "JRus" get's in trouble he may loose his garenteed funds.....Make the "Pie" big enough that they can't walk away from it.....
PantyRaider...PreasureSituation!!!
NYRaider:
I don't think 60 mil is chickenfeed, but it's rather small in comparison to some of things I've worked on.
I think you need to reconsider your position that all that's needed is a birth certificate and a SS number. For 60 mil, the Raiders have to deal with their own financial records, etc. and the agents have to deal with documents that set precedent, plus they have to communicate with their partners before they can sign off on anything. It involves lawyers as well for the vocabulary of the contract.
This is the biggest NFL player contract ever signed. The final deal will have ramifications for the entire league. It is not just a matter of Al and JaMarcus sitting down over a couple of beers. There is a lot more that can be accomplished over the phone, with each side having ready access to their own personnel and documentation, than can be handled face to face than with what they can carry to a remote meeting.
That's how you know it's close. When the issues are limited sufficiently for a face to face.
A little more clarification here seems to be required. We've heard some rumblings in the press that there is nothing but hard feelings in both camps. We've also heard some Davis critics claim that this is all caused by Davis' stuborness. Davis supporters say this caused by Russell's greed.
Based on what I know now, I'd suggest that none of it is true. Both sides understand that what they come up with will essentially be an historical document. Based on a few rumblings from the Commissioner, this could be the last huge rookie NFL contract, ever. Both the future of Russell's agents and the near term future of the Raiders may well depend on how this contract is resolved.
When two sides part company, and don't speak for a week or two, it is generally because they've reached an impasse. They don't fight with each other. Instead they go back to their own people and try to determine a creative way around the impasse. Then they start e-mailing each other with "how about this?" When the other party says, "hey, you might have something there," they refine it a little more. That is the point where they will make arrangements to meet face to face.
If, during those periods when they weren't talking, it was because they were both so pissed off that they couldn't even talk to each other, typically the parties would have been making statements to the press. Except for a very brief period at the very start of camp, that hasn't happened. I think they are working together to overcome the impasse.
They were mad at each other at the beginning of camp because of the damage it was going to do to both sides. It was going to be longer before Russell played in a game, and Al was not going to get the benefit of added ticket sales for people who wanted to see Russell. But once they got past that point, there was no longer a rush, they've calmed down, and both sides are looking for solutions.
Once they've come to an agreement, then the lawyers step in to refine the legalese. Anyone who thinks this is simply a boilerplate contract is nuts. There will be much that is invented purely for this contract.
I don't really care about this article from Pat Kirwin, but you might want to check out the sack stats on the right hand side. We're among the best pass protection teams so far.
http://www.nfl.com/preseason/
storyid=09000d5d8019ca63&template
=with-video&confirm=true
Psycho
I'm conducting an experiment. I call it {Predict who gets cut}. This might be the Vicodin talking, from getting 2 teeth pulled, but I'm going to give this a shot.
I think Kiffin usually has a good early idea of who his starters will be. But as a man of his word and being a fair guy he has given every opportunity to guys who deserve shots. McCown, Walter, Kelly (DT), Crockett, Huff & Stu have all started in games.
All indications point to Daunte being the QB, Kelly moving to DE, and Darius getting lots of time if not starting (and Huff is the guy who should watch out, not so much Stu).
My experiment fucuses on Crockett. If Griffith starts tomorrow I hate to say it but I think Zack is gone. Even if we carry 2 FBs I suspect they'll want to keep Oren O. instead because of upside. I believe they've given Zack lots or reps to be sure of what they're passing up. Just as McCown and Walter have gotten good looks.
Daunte is starting tomorrow because Kif knows he's going to be the man. The 3rd preseason game is the biggest indicator of your final team, as you know. If Zack starts as he has been, he just may stick. But I really think it will be Griffith. Though Zack is a solid all around player, Griffith just 'fits' and will be able to help us more. Gotta' run and I know half that didn't make sense, but wanted to throw it out there. Later.
Psycho
Blanda-
Your last post makes sense, but the scenario is based on no more than conjecture. My point from the beginning is simply that we are four months removed from the draft and we can’t sign our #1 pick. A factor that is now without question a negative force in Russell’s timely development and our hopes for a resurgence back to the top of the AFC West.
I’m sorry, but I’m not convinced that this contract is so vastly different than the ones signed by Calvin Johnson, Mario Williams, Reggie Bush, Alex Smith, etc, that it takes an extra two to four months of negotiation. Obviously, one or both of the sides has made demands beyond reasonable market conditions established by the aforementioned recent contracts.
Like Michael Douglas said in Wall Street, the problem may be caused by “too many vice presidents shuffling papers back and forth..,” as you suggest.
Psycho:
Enjoy those meds while you're able.
I think Zach makes it. Oren I think will go to the practice squad because he hasn't had any significant playing time yet. I think Bush is on the PUP list, perhaps the DL. I think McCown will be released when Russell signs.
Bama7
Agree NY Raider, the Russell ordeal has just gotten ridiculous and his development is simply on hold.
My cuts:
If Russell signs, I think a big name gets cut. Can we cut Rhodes? I only ask because Echamandu looks to be the real deal in our new system and would be cheaper than Rhodes (and probably as good).
Echamandu will probably be responsible for Crockett and Fargas getting the ax, and rightly so.
Lastly, if Russell signs I think it'll be Walter that gets the ax simply because he does not fit the scheme. He needs to play somehwre that runs a Norve style offense.
Okay, two more cuts... please... Whitted & Brayton.
PFT has posted a rumor that the Raiders and Russell parties have met face to face, citing the source article by our favorite Bay area beat muckraker.... drum roll please..... Nancy Gay, who hasn’t had an original thought since she reported Sapp would be cut because of his age (being a threat to his younger coach). What a tool, she read the story by Jerry McDonald and recreated it as her own, like any good writer would.
Cuts of off the top of my head:
Crockett
Whitted
Francis
McFoy
Gabriel
Morris
Slaughter
Walter (traded upon JRuss signing)
Starks
Branch
Brayton
Shaw
Tollfeson
Shotwell
Thanks for the kind words everyone. Mom and baby are fine, and recovering nicely. Little dude already sleeps 4 hours, and is a day old :D
Both should be home Friday morning.
Reading up on some stuff about Jruss meetings, and face-to-face meetings are definitely a step in the right direction.
It is not the first time they met face-to-face with his agents. They met with them prior to the draft, prior to OTA's, and shortly after the OTA's. This was their 4th face-to-face.
Here are some thought about who will get cut:
Whitted, Gabriel, Morant, Boothe, Otis, Walter (traded to Washington), Shaw, Santiago, Starks, Clemons, Hawthorne, Clauss, Carlos Francis, Parson, Richardson (Practice Squad), Bush (Practice Squad), and Crockett
raider nate - congrats.
i agree with most of those cuts but i'd like to see morant get more of a chance.
nate - bush to the practice squad? he'll never make it there! someone else might take him. i'd like to see him on the PUP and hopefully make some kind of contribution this year. ease him and his leg in slowly.
panty, no offense brutha but reading your mis-spelled inputs used to drive me nuts but somehow, perhaps to make yourself stand out in a crowd, i think you're doing it on purpose. BUT it's funny though. i guess that makes you unique in a way.....
Scorpio:
It's for real Bro...except the very obvious like "Postin"-n-"Poastah"....I have had two of those "LearningDisorders" droped on my lap as a kid....and that's what makes it so difficult on the spelling thing....but dispite that issue I have made exalant grades sense HighSchool...94-96%...as an "Engneering Student"....Metalurgist and now as a Graduate Gemologist(GIA)....also as a Master/Mate -w- Celistrial Navigation....It's rather funny but I can do the math-n-Sience thing but not the Spelling-n-Clarical thing....and I misplace names to.....So sorry...I keep trying to improve but I think it's hopeless....
Saw some names that I don't think will get cut....they have "Cap" friendly "$$$" and still could develop.... Boothe, Hawthorne, Morris, Morant....and also Tylar may stay another season....and the Huff thing is NOT going to happen....
"QB"....I think Walter will stay...his "Cap" $$$$ are OK.....and he played better than McCown who I think is gone but we may not get an offer for a trade...Walter would bring an offer...I think several players were flat last week but I don't put much credit on that....I think Kiff's absence had an affect....
#37 is gone and so should #1 Taylor...#5 Fredrickson that "K"...and several "NO-NAME" players who are still on the roster....
PantyRaider....Turk'sCommin!!!!
Belated congratulations to RaiderNate! The Raider Nation just got 1 member stronger with the birth of your fine son.
Panty Raider: I love your unique word play, sense of humor, and bubbling optimism. I must admit that you used to drive me nuts but now I realize the brilliance in your perspective on life. Shoot me an email so I have your contact information. My email address: (chbraidernation1@sbcglobal.net)and let's hook up for a Singha beer in Thailand next year. My wife's family lives in Thailand and we will be visiting next year. Cup Koon Cup.
Question to the RT Crew:
Is it just me or are you sensing the positive vibe Culpepper is giving when on the field. I don't claim to be a body language expert but his genuine enthusiasm when leading & interacting with the O unit seems to ooze from a good place ... a chance to prove his worth to the Raiders, the league, and harsh critics. A good performance vs. the Lambs and I feel we are locked & loaded for an exciting season.
OMG - RUSSELL JUST SIGNED!!!!!
no, i'm just kidding folks. :o)
yep. culpepper is our starter i think. this move only makes too much sense.
CalicoJack:
Cool....That would be great....I live in Chanthabury about 180 Km east of Bangkok....I will be there from 10-2 until 1-21-08....I am the only "Falong" with a "Tuk-Tuk"....you can see it at yourtuktuk.com it's the purple-n-pink one under "Products...Icon"...550cc Diahotsu....They will build another one for me that you can see under "Wise"....800cc....
We can get together with "Calibau" and listen to some music....they are my friends....and also "Marijuana"....
Scorpio:
That's a "DirtyTrick"....what a "LetDown" after getting me excited....
PantyRaider.....JustWishin!!!!
Russell and his agents met with Raider brass face to face today or yesterday. Raider fans ought to be thanking Team Jamarcus for holding out. Had he been in camp on time it's doubtful the Raiders woulda reached out to Dante and we'd be looking at Walter or McWhat? as are only options for opening Sunday. When he does sign, Russell will be broken in slowly by a pro bowl quarter back. What he woulda learned from Walters or McKnown can be left to speculation.
Calico-
IMO Culpepper is all in (100%). I might be putting my foot in my mouth before seeing him in action tonight (although I can't see the game, only listen on Internet radio), but he is clearly determined to be the starter of this team, and almost seems to have an all-business arrogance that suggests he knows he’s the starter. I think it’s great and look forward to seeing what he can bring.
CB #37 is definately gone. And I think Al's current projects will be terminated, Tyler and Alvis (Carlos too?), although Alvis might stick just on pure hard work. This will be yet another sign that Kif is in full control of the team on the field. Not to mention he re-arranged the lockeroom and re-decorated the place.
Blanda - I hope you're right about Crockett, and he has shown he can still play so it is very possible. Maybe going in with only 5 LBs will let us take 2 FBs and hopefully O'Neal is P-Squad like you said. I just have a bad feeling about 'ol Crock right now.
Calico - I get that feeling about Daunte too. He's going to do some damage I think and the team seems to follow him, which is a Kif pet peve. We'll see how it goes, but it may not be a bad idea to keep him around longer than a year to be sure Russell is for real.
I'm pumped. Can't wait for the game. And we should have an announcement on Russell soon after I think. Git'er dun negotiators.
Psycho
Calico-
I agree -- I think he brings more energy and the team feels it. When Russell signs, I think McCown will go just based on the fact Walter is more accurate. I think Russell will sign before the end of preseason and his camp will be the first five weeks of the season[4 games + bye]. If Culpepper struggles, I think we see JaMarcus for game five; if Culpepper is getting it done, JaMarcus waits in the wings...
Panty:
Interesting. My dad has learning disabilities. He got poor grades through high school. After that he only had two years of "air" college where he learned the principles of flight. After being a piolot for many years, he became an aerospace engineer, and was one of the creators of the computer automated satalite testing program.
He always said the same thing as you. He can't read literature because it puts him to sleep. But he enjoys pouring through a 500 page manual of mathmatical calculations. He told me once that the only novelist he could ever read was Steinbeck.
Interesting that he also has a very similar sense of humor to your's, with the same kind of wordplay. I wonder if the learning disability has something to do with that.
Calico, look at my earlier post. 3rd one on the list. "He kind of exudes leadership, too, doesn't he?" He's no nonsense, and seems to know what he's going to do. Davis was right. He reminds me of Plunkett.
Are we talking about Walter! the same guy that threw and INT in the middle of the field in the last game without any type of pressure and also the same guy that the football went thru his hands on third down on shot gun formation?
It is probably me but of all three qb's he has looked the worst(this m*&**er reminds me of Wilson)!
raiderdecoachella
Raiderdecoachella:
The thing about Wilson was that he was a great backup, but a crappy starter. I remember some games where he came off the bench to light up the score board. But as a starter, with the opposing team able to prepare for him, he had no sense of the pocket, and could very easily feel pressured.
I read that rumor on profootballtalk. They say that they've heard that the Raiders determined that Russell would not be ready to start at anytime this season which is why Davis is in no hurry. That would also explain the acquisition of Culpepper. Also, I'm reasonably certain that the evaluation of Russell's readiness would have come from Kiffin.
They also say that the problem is the "option clause" and not the "skills clasue." In other words the Raiders believe that they should be able to recover money for the failure of Russell to meet his responsibilities, not just because he turns out to be a bust. I can almost guarantee that this means the hold up is over the legal language of the contract - defining the risk assessment for both sides.
bama7
I'm with you Raidercoachella... what's the fascination with Walter? He played very, very average against a san fran team that's starting d-line is not that great and most of them weren't even there for our game. He had all day and did very little with one awful decision. Walter doesn't fit our scheme and falls apart with pressure. I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't figure out a way to get him on the pup if russell signs. Or perhaps he could be traded for something. MCown, Russell & Culpepper all fit the scheme. Porblem with Russell seems to be that both sides are painted into a corner and one is going to look bad after the signing. If it's 30 mil or so with no major clauses against the guarantee then Al looks defeated and dumb. If it has a whole bunch of skill and option clauses against a 30 mil or so guarantee then Russell's agents don't look so good. maybe Al could get what he wants if he threw in something on top if Russell ends up being one of the top QB's in the league, something like a bonus for making the pro bowl. One side has to make a sacridifce but needs a bone thrown in to save face.
Honestly, if there isn't some earth-shattering clause in the Russell contract, both sides are going to look ridiculous for taking so long. Let's get Matt Millen on the phone and see if he can straighten this thing out. Apparently, he did something right with Calvin Johnson.
The problem with Walter is that, while he's solid when given time, he often folds under pressure, i.e., poorly thrown passes, fumbles and Ints.
BlandaRocked:
That's funny about your dad...it seems that way for me because when I am in my element....with other science people....we get on very well with the "SenslessHumor" as I put it...and several of them can't spell either...so I feel very comfortable....but we have a vocabluary that fits our trade and we become very good at useing it...."SientificNotation"....
Culpepper is going to light things up tonight and make every Raider fan happy he is our "QB"....I can feel it comming and I see some of you can also....and the more we do the more it puts the "Donko"s on notice...."NO-Prisoners".....
PantyRaider....JustWatchinBaby!!!
NY, coachella and Bama,
i think your assesment of walter isn't fair. this is esentially his second year of actually playing. we all know the story of last year. i've been screaming for him to get a fair shake but we all know it ain't happening. now y'all are coming up with everything thats wrong with him because we have culpepper and soon russell.
how bad was elway and manning in their first few years? i don't recall walter ever lining up under the gaurd. which is what elway did a few times in his rookie year. look how he turned out. it's extremmely rare a QB will pull a marino or a rothlisberger. it always takes a couple of years at least for a QB to develop.
i'm not saying that walter'll be that good but come on now people, be fair!
Scorpio-
I don't think my assessment is unfair. It's based on observation. And I believe he is getting a good look right now by Kiffin and Knap. If he's the guy that emerges in this race, I support him 110%. I've said that all along.
The unfortunate thing for Walter is that he doesn't have more time to mature. He needs to be the best of the three QB's right now to get a shot. If we sign Russell, it may be the best thing for Walter and his career that we trade him. I think Atlanta is looking for a QB.
this guy has a very good point: last paragraph re: russell.
http://www.nbcsports.com/portal/site/nbcsports/
menuitem.6f806e473b4cb158fb00ec22493c2d04/
?vgnextoid=2f6b91a765294110VgnVCM10000075c
1d240RCRD&vgnextchannel=1c7e3e7e17cf2110Vgn
VCM10000094c3d240RCRD&vgnextfmt=default
Scorpio-
Here's the excerpt I believe you're referring to, and I tend to agree:
"Russell’s missed more than 30 practices. And at this point you have to wonder: How much value does Russell have to the Raiders this season? He may sign a six-year deal but he’ll have missed the most critical portion of the first year. It may be the most critical portion of the entire deal. If you’re Oakland, how do you recoup that value now?"
scorpio:
I agree about Walter and I want him to stay on the team....McCown needs to go By-By....not Walter...and his "$$$" are Cap friendly....
But the problem with playing Walter is the same as playing MarcusAllan....what do you do when we had "Bo".....You don't sit "Bo" so Allan can have his carries and you don't sit Culpepper so Walter can have his "Reps"....So what do you do....and than we bring "JRus" into it too....
I think Walter may be very important comming off the bench while "JRus" develops....and when "JRus" takes over we still have Walter coming off the bench to save the day.....he is still a very young player....
Look at the "QB" who was takend right before him who is playing in Cleveland....he is NOT good yet either.....for that matter just look at "Eli".....and he was #1....only Rivers is doing well from the last few years....you have to go back to "BigBen" to find another good "QB"....
NYRaider:
I don't have TV because I live on my boat and can't get cable so I am not able to record a game for you.....but maybe another "Poster" who records the games could send you a copy of tonights game....but you will need to post an address or e-mail so it can be sent....that way you can see the plays after you listen on the radio....that would help...Right???...
PantyRaider....Culpepperrrrrr!!!!!
Bama7
Scorpio, it's true, Walter walked into the unluckiest of situations. I just wish he'd have shown something, just a spark, in Walsh's nightmare scheme. Even Brooks was able to do a small bit when he was in there.. I'm thinking of the KC game and I think there were a few other times Brooks moved the ball a little bit. Walter had one good game, but it wasn't against the afc west.
I'm probably a bit unfair to Walter and I think it's because he just reminds me of Wilson, Shroeder, George et al. Slow to move, slow to react with a big arm. Guess I'm just tired of that approach. I do think he's a bad fit for Kiffen's scheme though (no fault of his own), whereas McCown is better suited albeit probably not a better qb than Walter.
Walter need to be in a system like Norv runs. Would have been nice to have seen him in Norv's last year instead of Collins.
Walter has had a bad break. If he ends up starting for us I'll still pull for him.
George threw for 4,000 yds and 29 "TD"s with only 9 "Int"s....the problem was not "JG" on the "O"....it was the "D"....they were the worst just like our "O" last year was the worst....and "Bungles" sucked....I liked "JG" and was sad to see how "CrudDumb" was trying to change him into a differant type of "QB" to fit his system.....but that does not ussually work.....you have to fit a "QB" in a system which fits him.....
Walter may play a different style but may also be able to play in Kiff's system....Kiff's style is not a "Pure" "WCO".....it's a marrage of 3-4 systems....or at least that's how it's advertised....Gilman-Walsh-Gibbs-w-Shanahan"OL" play....
Gibbs was the "MisDirection" Garu
Gilman was the "VerticalStretch" Garu
Walsh was the "HorazontalOfense" Garu
Shanagan used the "CrackBack"-n-"ZoneBlocking"
Kiffin was said to have used everything at USC and what I have seen so far tells me he will be very un-predictable with the Raiders "O"....I saw a great mix of plays and it will get better as we settle on a "QB" starter and get in the regular season....they don't want to show much now so you know something is comming....
PantyRaider....BrightFuture!!!!
bama and all, i am pulling for walter, and i do hope he stays but his days in a raiders uni may be numbered. if he does go i do hope he ends up in a place that will give him a chance. i think he can be a successful QB in the league.
ny - with regards to that guy's article, not only will the first year of his development be critical, but that's also an entire $10 million down the drain! assuming its a 6 year 60 mil contract.
you know folks, i was just thinking..... panty lives on a boat, and others can't get the game. someone ought to be able to record and send these folks tapes or dvd's.
I just listened to the interview Randy Moss gave on the NFL (No faidas League) channel and he sounded very motivated and excited to be on a TRUE CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM the NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS, 2nd. only to the ALL TIME CHAMPIONSHIP SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS!!!!!!! The faidas made a big MISTAKE when they let Randy Moss go! He wil help the N.E. Patriots go to the playoffs, who knows maybe they'll meet the San Francisco 49ers in the super bowl! One thing we ALL know for sure, the faidas WILL NOT be playing in the post season. 0-16 faidas, the GREAT KARNAK has spoken, just dream babies, and remember the "autumn wind is a stanky old pirate that hasn't had a bath since big al was walking the sidelines at frank uwell field" Defend your fantastical "nation" gorilla rilla smella fella.
Walter....fake hand-off roll out left....and the guy can actually run....I didn't know that....I say he sticks.....
Culpepper....He's da Man.....this whole team comes alive when he's in the game....but it gets flat when he leaves....the "O" did very well wth him at "QB"....
da "D" played very well and only allowed 1 pass and 1 run in the first quarter....great job by the #1's.....and even the #2's-n-#3's did their jobs so we have good depth....
Zebra's tried to make it interesting with their bull shit late in the game as usual....
Raiders look like a "PlayOffTeam"....something to be very hopeful about after next week....
PantyRaider....Death-to-da-"Donko"s!!!!
Panty Raider: My wife's family lives about a 4 hour drive east of Bangkok in a city called Sakaew (mot sure on the spelling but it is very close to Chanthabury. My wife says it must be about 20 minutes from her dad's house. Singha's on me buddy.
Anon Faida Boy: We know you are a Niner fan ... it is difficult to understand what you are saying with a dick in your mouth.
Pepper looked in command tonight. He has been shakin' off the rust, mastering the playbook, and showing his veteran leadership. The hot read on the blitz play to Curry was a thing of beauty.
Walter looked like a guy who knows he is going to be cut. Unless he wants to end up another Tui, who coincidentally would have been more suited for Kiffin's offense due to his mobility. McCown looked much better tonight which gives us a solid #1, #2... a clear cut veteran starter and capable backup. Now we just got to get Russell in asap to make our depth chart complete for the short & long term.
LOL! re: anon faida boy: calico that was funny!
Maybe the "faida broadcasting network" can get a Cambodian language broadcast team on the "fadio" for "prancysmeller", if they had closed captioning on the tube he might even learn to spell "ahupt"...in the style of Goofey. You guys are LOSERS in any language, chinese, navaho, spanish, cambodian, etc., etc. How do you say "keep defending the "nation" baby" in any of those languages "prncey"?
Post a Comment
<< Home