The Night in Haiku
CROSSING 880
Cursing, honking, smells
like beer, rage, broken glass; “We
are all embarrassed.”
$24.5 MILLION GUARANTEED
DeAngelo, lit
up like a Christmas tree, torched
by a Royal flush.
JAY'S OAKLAND VACATION
Cutler drops back, looks,
orders pizza, waits, texts his
wife, throws deep, touchdown!
ANOTHER PLANET
KSFO tells
me: “Look at the positives.”
Where's my microscope?
P.S. Thanks to blackbegonia for getting the haiku rolling.
posted by Raider Take at 1:41 PM
103 Comments:
The Aftermath Haiku
Left with bitter thoughts
"What happened?" I hear a voice,
"Here, have some kool-aid!"
How can the Raiders lose to the Broncos after all the pre-game hype and boasting about how great the new Raiders are and how young and inexperience they Donkeys are!! From all the chatter and postings from Raider fans on this and other sites throughout the pre-season, I expected the Raiders to go undefeated this season....well,now we realoze the Raiders can't win them all..Maybe another high draft pick or free agent signing for a defensive back will solve the problem!! LOL...
Could you say that in haiku, please?
Lost Raider Nation
Our leader is blind
only sees visions from the past
we suffer in the new reality
our coach must mold
crap into greatness
only two hands
and so much crap
Raider00, you made me spit out my beer in laughter.
Coaches Haiku
Don't look at Kiffin
Ryan is the problem here
five years without blitz
RT,
i was crying in my beer when i wrote it. but i believe it is the truth.
I want to throw something out there just to see what everyone thinks. Is it possible that Kiffin wants out so much that he is "tanking it" so Al has to fire him. That game was as poor as a coaching job as we have seen from Kiffin since he's gotten here. We all now Ryan sucks so no suprises on the D-side of the ball. Last year I thought he matched Shannarat in both games and we outplayed them in both games. This game was a total joke. I have concerns now that Kiffin just is not into it. And maybe he is pushing the envelope back to Al saying "ok, you want me, you got me". Am I paranoid or does any of this make sense?
RaiderMike
RaiderMike, I doubt Kiffin would deliberately throw a game, but it's certainly possible that he's not stressing over the prospect of getting fired, either. He'd have money in the bank, several months off and options galore.
A better conspiracy theory, in my opinion, is that Ryan threw the game to help get Kiffin fired (they're obviously not buddies).
After all, if JaMarcus doesn't lose grasp of the ball, and if Curry makes those catches, we might be talking about a different story on offense. But Kiffin has no control over those mistakes. Nor does he have control over the organization putting our receiving hopes in the hands of a known head case like Javon Walker, who was unable to play last night.
Ryan, on the other hand, orchestrated a complete train wreck on defense, despite having all his horses available, Hall, Wilson, Huff, etc.
I'm not saying the defensive meltdown was actually deliberate, but it makes good food for conspiracy thought.
Don't get me wrong RT, I'm definitely not saying it was conspired to lose the game. I'm saying he's got this d-coordinator who he clearly does not want and maybe he just doesn't care that much anymore since this is the hand he is being forced to play. Hence, some of the questionable play calling on offense. The other thing is if he really was fed up with Ryan even though he can't fire him he can start stripping him of some play calling duties. A.D. can't do shit about that. If Kiffin doesn't do that I'm convinced he could care less if the team wins 2 games all year. You almost can't blame him.
RaiderMike
Gotcha, RaiderMike, I may have read too much into "tanking it" there.
I certainly don't think it's out of the question that Kiffin might be suffering from apathy, which could affect his performance as a coach. We certainly have become acquainted with a lot of players whose apathy has affected their performance over the past several years.
Let's just hope we see a different team next week and put this one behind us. I appreciate the "group therapy" aspect of this website. Like Tony Soprano once said to Dr. Melfi "Everytime I come here it's like taking a sh@$t". It helps gettin this stuff off your chest. I'm flying out from NY to the San Diego game and I'm scared to death I'm taking a 4,000 mile trip to witness the same trash I saw last night. I'm dragging the wife too. Could be unprecedented grounds for divorce.
RaiderMike
I couldn't agree with you more Take. Kiffin and Ryan made no attempts last night to make the proper adjustments during game time or during the half time.
I am still Embarrassed!!!!!!!!
And if Kiffin does not make the proper adjustments and make every player accountable for every play during divisional games.......
We'll be at 0-8 and Kiffin will be let go. Bank on that one for sure.
Lofton is not the answer and he never will be. Ryan is no genius.... So why does Al think he is? Oh, that's right; cause Al calls Ryan from upstairs and tells Ryan what play to run next.
Knapp will be gone after this season. Bank on it. He's going to take off and join Jim Mora up north. They have history together since Atlanta days and they want to make it big. See Paul Hackett.
Hall was schooled all night long. I am still at awe as to how Hall needed to play off his guy 10 yds, on every down. WTF is that? This guy is an embarassement to us all. He's a true shut down corner? S*** he got schooled like this when he was in Atlanta. F. Washington wasn't great, but at least he knew where he needed to be at; at all times. And the rest of the D had to supplement Hall all night. Wilson was out of coverage to help Hall and then the LB's had to make adjustments into coverage. Bad news all night long.
The offensive line sucked so bad and the WR's didn't do a thing to help Russell during the game. Not one. I was very heart broken.
Bad Officiating.... hands down
I am so Angry with Davis, Kiffin and Ryan and the whole team. Man, all the time and money we fans spent to watch our beloved Raiders begin the NFL season in style got flushed down the sewer.
"No Discipline," Kiffin was right.
Once again I only blame Al. He's the beginning and the end of this team.
Mr. DUVA
We need to make captain Al walk the plank
The Jags lost a few linemen, they went out and signed M.Brown and C.Slaughter.
Shouldn't we be doing that? Hell, shouldn't we have done that BEFORE the injuries?
Oh sorry, haiku mode. Let's see here, now that I addressed one part of the problem, I guess I'll hit the other:
Where was the defense?
Where the hell was the coaching???
Depth or not, JUST WIN!!!
Psycho
mr. duva, you are 100% right. and as much as i hate to say this - nancy gay is right too in her article that came out tonight for tomorrows liberal rag.
al will never listen to the fans because he doesn't give a fat rats ass about us fans. but he is to blame and he will always end up blaming others for his faults.
how many millions did he spend on this so-called talent? wow.
yeah, yeah i know its only one lousy game. but if they don't shape up like RIGHT NOW, its gonna be one hell of a long year folks!
whoops, that was me.
Angelic Raider-
My sister (broncos fan) was over at the house and said this game was boring to watch because we put up such a crappy fight, saying that normally whatever the record we both show up and make a game of it. She wound up leaving in the middle of the third because she lives over an hour away. Every single person at work loved making jabs all day long, but RAIDER FANS I held my head because our love for this team is not on the surface love, it's deep in our souls love like someone making fun of your kid. I am not happy nor do I think this is acceptable football, but in the end are you really gonna give up and go be a Dolphins fans or some bandwagon team. Be angry, thank Sean for giving us this Blog to vent and go stab your local Chargers fan in the neck!!!!!
No more Merriman, Wooo Hoooo!
Psycho - {Doing the Merriman sack dance}
I think the problem defensively is the reason why Ryan wants out. The Athletic Director (or A.D.) is telling him how to coach defensively. Which is why we still use the "Prevent-You-From-Winning" Defense, why we still want the front 4 to pressure instead of blitz (even though we have the talent to create pressure, and would be better off doing so), and why we have a "Vanilla" Defense.
That's fine if he's frustrated and wants out, I respect that. But I think he should take a look at what Kiffin's doing, standing up, doing it his way, keeping it honest, and trying. Rob Ryan doesn't even look like he's trying out there. I think it's because he didn't get the HC job, when he deserved it. Kiffin proved that he's not an NFL Coach on Monday Night for reason explained in my first response on the other blog post (good play calling-wrong time; not a good "confidence" builder; has no structure to his methodology on offense [something Gruden is still good at]; etc).
But Rob Ryan is like Madden in that he knows how to build confidence, and he knows how to coach (and has proven it several times); but it seems like he's quit on the Raiders because maybe he feels trapped (unlike Kiffin), and can't coach the way he knows.
I'd rather let him walk, than to let him quit on us.
But at the same time, I feel he needs to take a stand and tell the Athletic Director that he would consider his thoughts, (maybe use them occassionally to switch it up), but use his style more; if he's fired for that everyone knows why, and the "cat's out of the bag". At least he would go out with the dignity that he did things his way; and it worked!
I by this view more than Kiffin is wanting out. I don't think he and Ryan see eye to eye, because Ryan knows Kiffin is not built to be an NFL Coach. I think when the offense didn't get points on the first drive, Ryan said to himself, "Okay dude, if you're not going to reward your offense for their work; and help our defense build confidence; I'm not going to help you out" and didn't call his best game. I truly think that pressuring the QB with disguised blitzes, and other schemes was the game plan (listen to ALL the coaches talking about it leading up to the week); and when Kiffin didn't go for 3; Ryan's attitude was more about "teaching Lane a lesson" than it was about the team.
This is the reason why I think both need to go. Ryan deserved a shot at HC at the time because of his LEADERSHIP! If he showed the same leadership now as he did under Norv and Art Shell, I think he's our HC today. But who does Al replace Kiffin with now? A guy that defensively has quit? An Offensive Coordinator that is likely to leave next year? James Lofton, who only has WR Coaching experience? Who would he replace Ryan with? Martindale, Ryan's closest friend and ally? I think they made a mistake in not letting Ryan go when he wanted to. Just like I think they made a mistake in not letting Javon walk when he wanted to walk.
Haiku format:
Who's going to lead?
Too many ego's clashing
And a college coach
Nate:
You just can't keep changing head coaches and expect positive results.If Ryan wanted to go last year he would have left-no questions asked. Ryan is a buffoon and should have been sent packing last year. If you have been watching the Raiders over the years there was times when they had dc's that blitzed way too much so I don't buy that Al is telling Ryan how to coach his defense. The fact is Al went to bat for this dope last year and now he won't can him out of principle. Best case scenario is Kiffin starts stripping him of his duties since he can't get rid of him. I just don't know if Kiffin has the balls to do this.
RaiderMike
Forget about the offensive wows. It's a work in progress. How can we expect an offense built around Russell and McFadden with below-average O-line and inexperienced WR to come out and operate on all cylinders? We can't. IMO, they will quickly get better.
But we should expect our defense to perform at a high level, given their continuity in coaching over the past 4-5 years and spoon-fed player acquisitions.
If you have any doubts that this defense is a colossal failure, than look no further than the Broncos first drive, the numerous breakdowns on third-and-long, and the absolutely embarrassing meltdown at the corner by D. Hall.
Newsflash: Blitzing will begin this week. There are no other options to get QB pressure.
Haiku Style:
5 years with Robbie
not a single blitz in sight
he’s not a Ryan
Okay, now that we've stunk up the place with the first game, suddenly everything we knew wasn't true is now true, and ALL of the blame is on Al Davis. Let's shoot him.
Kiffin is not a hero here. Ryan offered to leave because he had other offers. Davis wouldn't let him out of his contract - that's on Al. Al apparently believed that Ryan just didn't have the horses. Well, Ryan has better horses but the same results. Al was wrong. Let's move on.
Hall is not as bad as he looked. He's been to two Pro Bowls. But you can't play one corner on press and the other in soft zone. Ryan stayed with that all night and it was damn stupid.
The offense didn't stink the place up, it was the defense. Russell made a few mistakes and Curry dropped a pass (not two, the other was over his head, out of his reach). But the development of Russell looks very positive so far. Shanahan went head hunting, JaMarcus puts up a 111.1 QB rating.
Kiffin is still making rookie coach mistakes, and that's on Kiffin. On that first drive he should have kicked the field goal. Any idiot knows that, so Kiffin is apparently sub-idiot which is why Al would have asked him to resign if he in fact did that.
And it is on Kiffin, not Al Davis, that this team was not prepared for the season opener. It is on Kiffin, not Al Davis, that Kiffin takes division games lightly.
There is no way on God's green earth that the talent on this team is as bad as what showed up on Monday night. That's on Kiffin.
And the next person on this site who even suggests that Nancy Gay so much as has a brain stem, should get a boot up their...
If Kiffin is failing as a coach, is not Al Davis sort of responsible for hiring yet another failure as a coach? The coaches themselves are not responsible for the coaching carousel, so who is?
Why, yes, RT. It does happen to be Davis who hires the head coach. So, yes, whenever a team loses, on that basis, it always comes back to the ownership. How stunningly brilliant of you.
But guess what! Al Davis is the owner we've got. He's not going anywhere. And if Kiffin doesn't put it together better than he has, it will be Al Davis who fires him.
Davis didn't fire Kiffin because Kiffin shows promise. I supported keeping Kiffin around for another season, but that doesn't mean I was right. Only Kiffin can prove that - not Davis. Anybody who believes that crap about Davis not firing Kiffin because he didn't want to pay his contract isn't very bright or very observant regarding Davis' history.
The talent on this team has improved markedly since Shell. The reason that the talent has improved is because of Lane Kiffin's successful communications with Al Davis. But Davis doesn't coach this team. It wasn't Davis' job to prepare this team to play on Monday. That is KIFFIN'S FAILURE and nobody elses'. No matter where Kiffin wants to point his finger.
Just because Al Davis isn't going anywhere doesn't mean he's not responsible for a pattern of poor coaching hires that has been the single biggest factor in why the Raiders have racked up one of the worst five-year stretches (if not the worst) in the modern history of the NFL.
Simply saying "he's not going anywhere" isn't helpful. The Bidwills (Cardinals) and Fords (Lions) aren't going anywhere either. Is that really the type of excuse we want to employ? Is that what it has come to--not Commitment to Excellence, but simply, It Is The Way It Is?
Listen, Al Davis has done so much for this league and the Raiders. But he hasn't done ANYTHING since he traded Gruden. Gruden wasn't going to re-sign with the Raiders, and Davis made the most of it, getting what he could; but a few things happened that backfired on him.
#1. Bruce Allen (a great GM), walked out the door with Gruden.
#2. Al Davis has done nothing to replace either one.
After Monday Night, I've come to the conclusion that Kiffin would be a better GM; but dude is not ready for coaching in the NFL. I feel Rob Ryan has quit on the team, even though he's physically there, as a way of payback to Al not making him Head Coach, and the lack of offensive help that Kiffin does not give him. I'm not going to rehash my points on the lack of coaching. But Al Davis needs to step in, and step in NOW; or get the hell out of ownership!
The only reason why the "Raider Greats" do not step in and intervene with him is because everyone knows that if he steps out as owner while still alive; he won't be alive much longer. For all the great things, the bad things, and love him or hate him; nobody in sports today will ever mold a legacy the way he did; and I respect that tremendously. But Al needs to look in the mirror and ask, "If I truly love this team, I need to step out so they can succeed in a way I can no longer help them succeed." Then call up Mark Cuban and sell the team to a proven sports owner who has an attitude like Al; and gives back to his players and fans the way Al did.
Turn the page, it's time for Al to move on. It's time to bring back the swagger, and it has to start at the top, work down to the Head Coach, then the coaching staff; and replace them with a GM, and a coaching staff that will work together; not blame and quit on each other. The worst part is the coaching staff reflects Al's contributions to the team in the last 6 years.
Another thing, Kiffin's poor excuse of a press conference yesterday should piss us off even more.
I heard, "We tried our best, and we will try our best this weekend in KC. If we lose, just know we tried to do some things different, and we did our best." His demeanor, words, and body language throughout the presser showed nothing but DEFEAT! And then to say, "I wouldn't change any of the calls I made." Are you kidding me? Blaming the defense for not showing up is one thing, but refusing to recognize your own coaching blunders is another. The team looked like $h!t, played like $h!t, and your play calling on both sides of the ball were $h!t. Then to come out trying to convince us that it was shinola, is just deplorable.
Didn't have time to read them all. But I know what was said.
How can Ryan be so mad on the sideline when there was not a single blitz called that I could see. Early on we were actually doing fairly well against the run. But on third down, a four man rush???????????????????
H
Great, RT. And what, exactly, was that solution you offered?
Is Al just going to disappear before the KC game and then everything will be fine? Let's all hold our breath and wait for that.
I think I might have a better short term suggestion. Let's hold Kiffin and Ryan accountable instead of blaming all of the world's evils on Al.
well folks, things COULD be worse. we could have drafted vince young. boy is this guy a basket case!
for all you vince young supporters:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/09/07/sports/s142843D54.DTL
Personally, I can't understand why anyone would even suggest that no one wants to be the Head Coach for the Raiders. It's the perfect "no-lose" situation. If you win, you overcame the evil Al Davis (so you are doubly brilliant), and if you lose it's all Al's fault. Head Coach for the Raiders has to be the least accountable job in football.
Felicia Young said her son needs some space.
"It is hard, all he is going through right now. He's hurting inside and out," she told the newspaper.
"But he will be fine if people are prayerful and help my baby boy out. He is a young man. He just needs a lot of love and support."
awwwwww, how cute. nice to know mommy's got his back! gotta protect her baby boy from those baaaad booing fans!
so lets all cheer up now guys. least we're not titan fans.....
RT:
>>>>
Simply saying "he's not going anywhere" isn't helpful. The Bidwills (Cardinals) and Fords (Lions) aren't going anywhere either. Is that really the type of excuse we want to employ? Is that what it has come to--not Commitment to Excellence, but simply, It Is The Way It Is?
>>>>
What do you propose we do about it?
Do you guys really need me to submit a laundry list of solutions? Isn't it obvious to you by now? Do you not see any patterns, just isolated incidents?
No, RT, it's not. Let's have your list. Better yet, give Raiders HQ a call and tell them to Al.
In the mean time, this fan is going to be making it very clear that I expect much better from Kiffin, and I don't need his excuses.
Blanda, it's funny how you like suggest that my opinion as a fan is somehow invalidated by the fact that I can't do anything about it because the organization won't take my calls...while at the same time you give ultimatums to Lane Kiffin, as if his he's on your speed dial.
Jeez...
At the top of my list of solutions, since you asked:
Don't hire coaches that can't hack it.
Super beginning, RT. Pick us new one.
In the mean time, I hope Kiffin can be convinced to use his intelligence and obvious football knowledge to prepare his team to play and make smart decisions on the football field. I believe that Kiffin has that ability. I just wish he'd use.
And no, I don't have Kiffin on speed dial, but I do believe the nation sends the wrong message when we absolutely refuse to hold a Head Coach accountable with IAAF.
BR said, "I think I might have a better short term suggestion. Let's hold Kiffin and Ryan accountable instead of blaming all of the world's evils on Al."
This is the biggest reason why Al needs to step away. He needs to hold himself accountable first to the organization woes! It is as you said before, "He should get the credit when things are good, and when there bad. It cannot be one-sided!" Then hold others accountable.
He hasn't held anyone accountable since Callahan. He has given every coach since Callahan nothing to work with, and yet demands a winning season. He was invisible when Art Shell was here; and now he is treating Kiffin like he did Turner. For Al to sit back and watch his coaching staff bicker against each other and do nothing about it, is truly apprehensible.
These changes have to start with how Al has ran this team since even before Gruden showed up! If not, we are in the same boat. Then you go down the line from there.
BR also said, "In the mean time, this fan is going to be making it very clear that I expect much better from Kiffin, and I don't need his excuses."
I'm going to make it very clear as a fan that I expect much better from THE RAIDERS ORGANIZATION, AND I AM TIRED OF THEIR EXCUSES!
Let me clear up the excuses:
Game planning, coaching, players, no GM, organizational bickering and finger pointing, losing, overpaying 2nd rate players, stock-piling 2nd rate players, lack of commitment from the team, lack of commitment from the coaches, lack of commitment to the season ticket holders and other fans, lack of commitment for the sorry organization we fans have seen the last 6 years, and a lack of honesty.
Blanda:
Let's whittle this down--how many consecutive bad head coaches need to be hired before you hold the person doing the hiring MORE accountable than the coaches being hired (which, by the way, isn't saying that the coaches themselves are unaccountable)?
According to you, we're now at four (Callahan, Turner, Shell and now, you seem to be saying, Kiffin). Would five your number? Eight? Thirteen? Just curious.
Nate,
I would agree that this latest disappoint must rest on everyone from the Owner to the Water Boy. Especially the Water Boy! Ok, maybe we'll give him a pass. He is a boy after all. But everyone else is on notice.
Did anyone else notice Caveman losing his sh*t on the sideline? I understand his frustration, but maybe he could have saved that outburst for practice and pulled his position coaches together for an emergency meeting. Hell, he should have asked Lofton over for some advise! Lofton must have been licking his chops thinking about what he'd to to our secondary if he was working for the Broncos.
Now, let's go to KC and put up our 42!
So you want more suggestions?
Here's another:
Fire Rob Ryan. I said it last January. It was just so obvious. Now, after having been given a load of expensive new weapons, he orchestrates one of the worst defensive performances I've ever seen.
This is what I wrote in January: "I would submit that this Ryan business is a window into the future of our team, as viewed through the lenses of control and decision making, which in turn have bearing on a lot of things."
Maybe the Raiders should answer my calls, eh?
First off, let's narrow some responsibilities. It's not Al's job to prepare his team for game day. That job belongs to Kiffin and Ryan. I didn't see a lack of talent on Monday night, I saw a team completely (with the exception of JRuss, McFadden and Fargas) unprepared.
Good choice, though. If the Raiders put up the same defense against KC, Rob Ryan would not be my DC by week three. Who do we replace him with? My immediate choice would be to plug Martindale in as interim DC and see how he does.
We're supposed to be the most knowledgeable fan base in pro sports. It amazes me that we sit around here and make it all about personalities and not on knowledge of the game. We're continually looking for owners who we'd rather have a beer with.
Let's just take one issue. Blitzing. Supposedly we don't blitz because Al Davis doesn't like blitzing. Since when?
Blitzing has been a staple in Raider defenses throughout their history. That's why Al likes shut down corners - SO WE CAN BLITZ! What Al doesn't like is having the CORNERS blitz. But even then, it's a good idea to throw one in every so often when the other team isn't looking for it. From Ryan I have never seen such a love for 3rd down PREVENT defenses. That's not Davis - that's Ryan!
Davis may call the field with a play now and then, but he doesn't design the game plan and he doesn't call every play. (In fact, since the Raiders blitzed one time in 10 3rd downs, I'd suggest that it was Davis who called the blitz down.) And I can pretty much guarantee you that Davis got in Ryan's ear about the game last Monday.
Why is Ryan still here? Because he was decent in his second year here, and the defense looked even better in his third year (under Shell). Last season the wheels completely came off. I believe that it was reasonable for Al to believe that with better horses the defense would improve. If Ryan's defense doesn't improve, Ryan will be gone. And he should be.
This whole conversation reeks of de ja vu. Que of the discussions from last year.
I’m not prepared to throw Kiffin to the wolves yet. IMO, he needs to be given more control in order to truly have a chance to be successful.
The simplest short-term solution is to give Kiffin control over the defense, including his defensive coaching staff... like it could get any worse. Give him the power to fire Ryan, or keep him with Kiffin (not Davis) calling the shots.
Let’s try it Kiffin’s way. Before it’s too late.
One more thought. Neither Kiffin nor Ryan are trying to sabotage the Raiders, so just stop that discussion. These guys aren’t that dumb; I’m sure both would like future employment.
Oh, and if you're wondering what got Ryan pissed off on the sideline - I suspect he had just gotten an earfull from Al Davis.
I guess that conversational deja vu is to be expected to some degree, since Monday night was like a bad flashback.
So this is what I keep seeing here. RT says we have to blame Davis for hiring bad coaches. NYRaider says you can't blame the coaches because Al's a bad owner. Additionally it is argued that Kiffin must be given more authority than any other coach has in the NFL.
I'll tell you what, let's blame Al for bad ownership decisions, let's blame the coaches for bad coaching decisions, and let's blame the players for poor play.
What I saw this last Monday had one issue and one issue only - BAD COACHING! (Bad officiating too, but there's nothing to be done about that.) Yes, Curry dropped a pass. Guess what. He's not the first or only WR to do that.
However, continually going for it on 4th down instead of taking points or field position - that's BAD COACHING!
I noticed you didn't answer my question: "How many consecutive bad head coaches need to be hired before you hold the person doing the hiring MORE accountable than the coaches being hired."
I don't know, RT, you tell me. Fact is, you can just about count on your fingers how many teams have head coaches who have only been with the team more than three years.
Fact is, I don't blame Davis for hiring Kiffin. He's got a lot of promise. I'd like to see him exercise some of that promise before he gets fired. I count only two really bad coaching hires from Davis - Joe Bugel and Shell II. All others were reasonable hires, but some didn't work out for a variety of reasons.
I believe that Davis took his eye off the ball for a long while, and that's on his doorstep, but I saw him step up and do something about it this past off season. I'm still waiting for Kiffin to sweep off his doorstep.
Perhaps, but I only need one finger to count how many teams have had four head coaches over the previous five seasons.
Blanda - Since you’re putting words in my mouth, I'm curious. At what point can we say that Al Davis is no longer the Raiders' best option to handle all the critical functions which he presently manages? Better yet, when will HE finally conclude that?
The man is 79 years old, and truly an icon of professional sports. But when is it enough? When will he stop micro-managing this organization and delegate true authority? He doesn’t have to delegate it all to the head coach, but there must be other options to protect his legacy.
Just like you, I'm disgusted with what I witnessed Monday.
The personnel on this team has improved greatly since Shell II. That, to me, is to Kiffin's credit because he demanded Al's ear and gave him the facts. It's to Davis' credit (while expected) that he listened. In short, it was Kiffin who drew Al Davis out of hibernation, and whether Kiffin makes it through the year or not, he deserves that credit. However, as poor as Raider personnel had become ("too many backups"), there is not enough cap space to completely rebuild after only one season. And I believe we will be even much better next season.
But Kiffin is also responsible for the preparedness of the team on the field. We can give Kiffin the responsibility of hiring all football personnel, but that won't make him a decent game day coach. Let's let him prove he can do the job he's hired to do before we add to his responsibilities.
RT, I can name a team that had three. They are right across the bay. I think the Cowboys went through that many coaches in the same amount of time. Ditto the Redskins. Ditto the Falcons. Ditto the Bengals.
I guess the best answer to your question (the answer to which proves absolutely nothing) is, it happens.
On the flip side I can think of quite a number teams who fire WINNING coaches. Fortunately we don't have one of those.
Blanda, you just used my argument why Kiffin needs to be GM, not Head Coach, and why Al needs to step aside. So who do you replace Kiffin with as HC, James Lofton or Greg Knapp?
Ryan needs to go too, but he should not be replaced by Martindale (because if Ryan goes, Martindale follows him out the door). So my question stands, if Ryan is out, who do you replace him with? Willie Brown? Let Kiffin make a plea to Ken Norton Jr (whom he has wanted since being hired)?
Seems to me, Kiffin prefers a blue-collar work ethic in his players, and not so much the high-priced prima donna types. IMO, had Davis given Kiffin more autonomy wrt player personnel, I believe we would see a completely different roster than we see now, and with ample cap space.
I have no information that Kiffin wanted Norton. But I thought he would be a good hire.
Martindale won't follow Ryan out the door to be an LB coach over an offer to be DC. During the season he especially won't follow Ryan out the door to be unemployed. Fact is, Davis considered Martindale at the time he hired Ryan.
And there is virtually no chance that Kiffin will be changed to GM. We have GM, and his name is Al Davis. What we need is a coach who isn't intimidated by Davis, and not afraid to report the HC's version of the facts. He does that, Davis will listen, as we've all seen this past off season.
My issue with Kiffin right now is TWO ISSUES, and two only. Preparing the team for the season opener, and poor game management - for the Denver game. THAT is not on Davis. THAT is on KIFFIN!
BR, how would Martindale be any different than Ryan? He followed Ryan over from NE, where he started. I know he would follow Ryan.
NYRaider, I think what Kiffin prefers is 180 players on the opening day of practice from which he can pick and choose. That's why a lot of coaches prefer coaching at the college level.
In the NFL the conditions on the ground are made as even as possible by rules so that any given team can beat any other given team on any given game day. Show me where Kiffin got the expertise to manipulate these rules better than the 31 other teams, and I'll support his promotion to GM.
Blanda I love Al and continue to be a big Al supporter but I just don't know what this love affair with Ryan is all about. The guy STINKS plain for anyone to see. He brings nothing to the table. Al gets into these love affairs sometimes and this is what drives us crazy. Kiffin is a work in progress and I am willing to be patient for a couple of years. I believe he is going to be a pretty good coach. The only question is whether he is cut out to be a head coach or more of a OC. Gruden for all his faults didn't take sh$#t from anyone on the team and this got results and respect. I would like to see a little of that emerge in Kiffin. If Al is not gonna get rid of SOB then I feel Kiffin should limit his role.
RaiderMike
Nate, by that logic, Ryan and the other SOB should be the same. Shouldn't they both be the same as Buddy? Just because you like somebody and work well with that person doesn't mean that you subscribe to all of their philosophies. Wasn't Callahan different than Gruden? Gruden hated to pass, Callahan was pass happy.
And I refuse to believe that Martindale is so loyal to Rob that he'd follow him to the unemployment line. Martindale's family might have something to say about that.
i have a question for all the fans who want kiffin fired.
is the next coach getting all the bad draft picks, and will he have the worst DC in the league forced upon him ??
if yes, than how will the next guy, no matter who it is, turn the raiders into winners ?
the raiders play bad because they have bad players. it really is that simple.
Mike, there are things to be said in Ryan's defense. As I said earlier, the defense improved steadily in his second season, and looked good in his third. The wheels came off in the fourth season, but there was good reason to believe that it was primarily a personnel problem. The personnel has improved. They are doing a better job of stopping the run. But the pass defense this last Monday was non existent. It almost seemed like they were trying to run some kind of an experiment to see how many defensive concepts you could go with on a single play.
Perhaps it wasn't the players trying to do too much, maybe it was Lane and Rob.
raider00, I'm not asking for Kiffin's head - yet. And the problem on Monday had nothing to do with bad players. It had everything to do with failure to prepare your team to play on game day. For cryin' out loud, Kiffin used the excuse that the fans were just so up and rowdy it took them out of their game.
Well, okay... Let's all go to the next game and keep our mouths shut and sit on our hands.
Blanda,
please tell me, who are our impact players ?
who do we have, on either side of the ball, that is a game changer ?
the only pro bowler we've had since 2000, is punter shane lechler.
that aint much to brag on.
Why do people always leave Nnamdi out? He got the invite too late to go, but he went. Also, teams with losing records get passed over. On a losing team, it's the punter who will be selected first. He got the most action.
Nnamdi is a game changer - but nobody will throw to him. McFadden is a game changer, he just hasn't changed a game yet. Same with JRuss. Jury's out on Walker. We never got to see Carter. Huff might develop into a game changer now that he's at his natural position.
But here's the reality. Nobody is ever identified as a game changer until that player's team starts winning.
Blanda,
you are right about Nnamdi. he is a great football player. but he cannot impact a game as long as the other corner can easily be tourched.
i cannot go along with jruss/mcfadden, because they haven't done it yet. hopefully in the future.
but maybe that's our problem. our best players are a corner that no one tests, and a rookie qb, and rb.
i can't think of too many head coaches that can win if dealt that hand.
long live shane lechler !!!!!!
I'll tell you what BR I'm still in but if the defensive schemes this Sun are like last Mon and SOB dosen't get canned Al has got some serious questions to answer. For instance- Is this about proving a point to Kiffin or doing what's best for the organization? If it's about the former it's gonna be a long, long year. God willing we won't see it Sunday.
RaiderMike
Mike, I agree. I would not go into week three with the same defensive tactics we saw last Monday. And it is TACTICS that were the primary problem. Ryan is responsible for game day defensive tactics and Shanahan blew him up.
Hall is not a bad player. Yes, he's had some issues, but he's a two time pro-bowler. You don't do that twice based on an accident. Hall was bad because he was continuously put out of position to succeed. When Shanahan finds the hole in your strong side zone, you don't neglect to plug that hole as Ryan failed to do for the entire game.
And you never have one side press and the other play loose. As innovative as that might sound, it leaves your field full of holes.
And here's why Kiffin will likely lose against the Chiefs. From Jason Jones:
Many of the Raiders don't buy much into the old rivalries in the AFC West. Kiffin is on the record for not believing that a coach should put too much into a game just because it's a rivalry game.
That's not the case with the Chiefs.
"They make us understand it," Page said. "They let you know it's an important game. They let you know that the Raiders-Chiefs is a game that's a rivalry. They put it up all around the facility, it's Raider week. They let you know that it's a big rivalry so that's our game, to let younger guys know what it means."
Blanda,
this "raider week" garbage is a bunch of college bullspit.
so big deal, the chefs play hard against the raiders, but suck against everyone else.
same goes for ratface, post elway, and shittenheimer, the great raider hater, who chokes EVERYTIME, in big games.
what does this all prove ?
i agree with kiffin. i'd rather see the raiders play well, and get up, for 16 games, not just division games.
kiffin is not saying he doesn't want raiders to play extra hard against division foes.
he's saying lets treat every game
like its a division rival.
big diifference.
As per above - if the Raiders come out flat, and the Chiefs come out pumped, you'll know why. And you shouldn't expect any better results than Monday.
Blanda, you really should consider applying for a job with the Raiders, maybe as an assistant for Al Davis. You would do a great job kissing his ass and telling him what he wants to hear. I imagine all the spineless yes men at Raiders HQ in Alameda are exactly like you, so you should fit right in. I would have loved to see you in the Black Hole this past Monday spewing out your crap. You would have had your ass handed to you by some real Raider fans.
Ooooo... Stearn words spoken by one who wishes to remain unidentified. How courageous of you.
If Kiffin thinks Monday nite at home was loud, what's he gonna do Sunday in KC?
I predict several false starts by our O line, and blitzing by the D... after all, just how stupid can Ryan be?
Come on down to the Black Hole on the 28th for the Chargers game, section 106 row 12 seat 11 and I will be glad to identify myself to you. Maybe you can give a sermon to myself and the rest of the Raider fans in the Black Hole about how we are in such good hands with decrepit Al Davis as our owner and his wonderful personnel decisions. Then we can all laugh our asses off and collectively throw you over the wall. You give Raider fans a bad name, don't ever show yourself in the Black Hole, little kiss asses like you are NOT welcome.
Ano, you're a mindless cowardly little troll. I don't waste too much time on people without enough brain cells to formulate an argument.
I happen to have a good many friends who sit in the Black Hole on a regular basis, and they happen to be very nice people. They also happen to be intelligent enough that they allow others reasonable opinions even if they don't agree with their own.
Here's another clue - the Black Hole as an entity, does not put up a nameless, faceless fake as their spokesperson. In other words, if you represented the Black Hole, you'd be intelligent.
i just hope there isn't this kind of disunity in that locker room.....
My take: Al and the coaches equally have to take the blame on that fiasco. Its time to start from square one again and work upward. Whatever Kiffin and Ryan did last week didn't work, and as a copy cat league, we are going to see the same thing next week, and every other week until things get fixed.
Is it Al's fault we have shitty coaches? YES. That still is no excuse for coaches to be complete morons.
So where do we go from here?
Myself I hope the coaches suddenly start being less obviously moronic. They have more control over the situation than the owner.
Blaming the owner now is useless. The pieces are in place... good, bad, or horrible... it's still the coaches job to use them in less than a high school mentality.
Ahh the "Black hole Einstein" is back.. the same guy that called me a pussy because I didn't agree that the team is already fucked after one week of preseason.
Hint: purchasing a season ticket in the Black Hole does not gain you IQ points, increase your manhood, or prove how superior a Raider fan you are.
Ugg ugg.
" section 106 row 12 seat 11"
Gave up before the season began and will beat the fuck out of anyone that hasn't also given up.
If this is what the black hole is about... it's no surprise that we have the worst reputation of any NFL team.
“We talk about it early in the week. Rob and the owner are in communication,” Kiffin said. “For the most part, I let Rob do his thing over there. He has a belief in certain things and he has a conversation with the owner about that. So that wasn’t the way the game plan ended up the other night.”
This my friends- IS NOT GOOD!
RaiderMike
RaiderMike beat me to it, but...
I base a lot of what I believe about the current goings-on with the Raiders on observations provided by Jerry MacDonald. This tidbit should come as no surprise to any of us.
http://tinyurl.com/62nv5u
As many of us suspected, Al Davis is the Defensive Coordinator. Add that to his list of duties. Rob Ryan is not running this defense. He’s just a spineless spectator.
Raiders had the fewest blitzes in the NFL, and when we did blitz, it was mostly ineffective. Could that be because we don’t disguise our defensive formations and coverages?
This is truly disturbing, mostly because there no way to effect change until Davis steps down, which he appears to have no intention of doing. (Que definition of insanity.)
RaiderMike, this is what I'm talking about. I think Kiffin and Ryan don't get along, and they definitely don't see eye-to-eye; and as Head Coach, you have to get that from your staff. I think Kiffin and Ryan are quitting on each other, and the team is suffering for it. Either one, or both has to go. At this point if you had to choose between one or the other, who would you fire?
One of these guys has built confidence with his group, and these guys will go to battle for him, and takes the blame when things don't go right. The other guy is non-chalant, doesn't really get things done, points the finger of blame, then says "I don't have the power to change it. It is what it is." But neither one show good leadership quality when things are down.
If I had to choose between the 2, Kiffin would be gone. If I had it my way, Kiffin, Ryan, and Al Davis would be gone.
Nate - why should Kiffin shoulder the blame for something he has no control over? Would you?
When the defense is on the field, Kiffin is nothing more than a casual observer. My question is, what the hell is Ryan doing?
At the end of the day, Ryan is implementing someone else's philosophy, and doing it very badly.
The entire organization is made up of puppets, and Kiffin prefers not to be one. Can you blame him?
So I agree that Kiffin should go, but for different reasons. We need a coach that will bow to his master and do and say whatever he is told. Clearly, he’s not our guy.
He's the Head Coach. The Head Coach sets the tone for the game plan on both sides of the ball. Even if he isn't a part of the plan, it is his job as LEADER to set the tone. Blow smoke up the skirts, and say "we have been working diligently on some different things that I don't want to tip my hand on." You build the confidence in the team. His tone, demeanor, attitude, and words seem to say "I quit." Do you really think that Jon Gruden is really involved with the defensive planning of the Buccaneers? No! He leaves that to Monte Kiffin, but he doesn't throw him under the bus when things aren't working well. We have failed to see that from Kiffin since he's been here.
The problem is, he and Ryan don't see eye-to-eye, and they don't care for each other. As Head Coach, you have to put your personal issues aside, and if your coach doesn't get on board with your game plan, you trump his game calling authority. If he is "really" taking a stand against Davis, then take a stand and be a coach, not a whiner. As Head Coach, he has the authority to trump Rob Ryan. The problem I have with Kiffin, is he is continually proving that he has mentally quit on this team; and he and Ryan have quit on each other.
Ryan continues to blast Kiffin by saying, "How do you expect our defense to be effective when the offense can't score?" Both are acting like the Presidential Candidates! Both of their poop stinks like poop.
I'm not saying one or the other needs to go, I'm saying all 3 need to go. Al Davis, Kiffin, and Ryan. But Al is looking at it as one or the other. In the end, the decision is going to be one or the other, and Kiffin is going to get the short end. You don't build unity on a team with division. That is what Kiffin and Ryan are doing because they can't put their personal issues aside. I can imagine that this started with a comment from Kiffin like, "That's not the way my dad runs a defense."
The most telling quote came from Nnamdi who said, "When a team lines up on us and just goes out and plays, we can handle it. But, when they start scheming us the way these guys did, and we weren't particularly ready for it, anything can happen. And it showed (Monday)."
The game plan is the foundation to what we should want to accomplish. Adjusting to what the other team "schemes" should be the structure to that foundation.
What Nnamdi basically said here is we are relying on the foundation to win games, with no adjustments. You don't win football games that way, and Monday Night proves that. Nobody in this League "just goes out and plays", except the Raiders. And we wonder why we've only won 19 games? This is a game of adjustments and scheming.
Nate - I believe therein lies the frustrations you hear from Kiffin. Give the man the automony he needs and let's see if he can produce a winner. I believe he can.
Short of that, I believe he will be let go, eventually, and the puppet show will continue.
NY is right Nate. Al is tying Kiffins hands. I love Al but "Just Win Baby" seems to be out the door. Instead this organization has become a twisted hobby for his twilight years. Not good. It's all the shit I didn't want to believe. This defense has been a colosal failure. And I don't care they looked good 2 years ago when everyone was kicking the piss out of us and running out the clock for 3 quarters (sorry Blanda). I am just hopeful that at some point clearer heads are gonna prevail. But I am losing faith.
RaiderMike
No matter who is calling the defensive plays, they suck. If it's Davis, that's a big problem, unless Davis wants to spend his days in practice explaining to the players and other coaches how he wants his plays implemented. If not, the coaches are playing a game of telephone. I'd join with everyone here in demanding that Davis either coach, openly, or let his coaches do their damn jobs.
If Ryan is letting Davis interfere against his better judgment, that's on Ryan. He's not there to be a yes man. He's there to be a DC.
Kiffin is showing damn poor judgment, at this juncture (the season's first game), by throwing half of his team under the buss.
I'm the first to admit that I've called for greater involvement from Davis - but as the Owner/GM, not as a distant coach. You can't coach a team by meeting behind closed doors with the DC.
If Davis wants to coach again, he has to get his walker down to the practice field on a daily basis.
Al, if any of this is true, back off now or we're doomed to lose, baby.
But as I've said earlier, Davis DOES NOT have an aversion to blitzing. Raider teams have always blitzed. Davis has an aversion to CORNERS BLITZING, because it is so easy to get burned that way. So the pat little answer that the Raiders aren't blitzing because Al doesn't like blitzing is crap. No matter who it comes from.
If they are not blitzing there's a football explanation for it that has to do with these particular players. I have no idea what that could be, but there certainly seems plenty of information available that whatever the assumption is, it's wrong! Somebody needs to admit it and move on.
Bama7
Blanda, it's over. Your days of spewing confusion as to "whether" Al is meddling in the play calling are over. Let your apologistic nature regarding Al end. Please. It's all been exposed. Many of us on this board were called Al haters or some acronymn that meant we blamed everything on Al. Well, we were right. The Al blamers were right. End of story. Kiffin is the first coach we have had that has said "enough is enough... I'm telling the truth of what goes on here." Kiffin has all but said, the disaster that is our defense is Al and Rob commuicating (read as Al is lost and we have to accept his lost ways)
It can't be any clearer. Our outdated, prevent, unagressive defensive schemes built around two "lock down" corners and a vanilla front seven loaded with unphysical, speedy, combine type potential guys is simply an awful way to appraoch today's nfl.
Kiffin is the best thing that could have happened to us. He forces Al to correct errors.
I have been monitoring RT but have not really posted anything recently. The main reason being the one that originally brought me to this site. You, the regular posters, have a great knowledge of this team. My two cents is usually a day late a cent short and not as well thought out in most cases.
I cannot, however, watch this one go by. If anyone sees this season as other than over please try to convince me. Kiffin has been made a eunich. He fought the good fight for a while but it is over.
Kiffin is done, I predict, before the season ends and we are back to where we started - which is nowhere. 4 coaches in 5 years, double digit losses six seasons in a row....
Welcome to the black hole brought to you by AD.
Bama7
Not true MEMDF. It's not over. Al CAN be moved to the 21st century by Kiffin. The Lamonica, 7 yard drop offensive playbook has been put back on Al's office bookcase, right next to the commemorative Heidi Game Video and Superbowl II souvenir pom-pom.
The old man was forced by the press and the shell/walsh reign to abandon that beloved scheme. So perhaps now the old man will say, "the heck with it, run something else on defense." And then when something modern works he can call a press conference and announce to everyone that he never liked the lock down corner, four man vanilla rush defense that we had been running for the last 25 years... it was everyone else's fault all around him.
I bet we change big time next week in Arrowhead. Credit to Kiffin's candor and his resigned attitude to speak the truth.
Bama,
I totally agree. The way I look at it, Kiffin can keep his mouth shut and lose his job during the Bye week, or he can ask for the moon. If he gets control and still loses his job, oh well.
If he starts winning he knows the Old Man, God Bless him, can come down and say, "This, ladies and gentlemen, is why I brought Lane in. I told you before, he reminds me of one person. Me."
Oh, and anyone thinking Al would do anything differently in Lane's shoes is fooling himself.
"Anybody who believes that crap about Davis not firing Kiffin because he didn't want to pay his contract isn't very bright or very observant regarding Davis' history."
Hmmmm so the beef that Shannarat has with Al Davis was about peanuts.... yeah blanda what history are you talking about??
rob ryan fires back....
http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/2008/09/11/ryan-fires-back/
I'll let Rob Ryan speak for himself.
It reflects what I have been saying, both about the coverage on Monday, and about Davis' involvement. I wish Ryan had done this earlier, but his timing is his own business.
Cutler passed for 299 yards and two touchdowns and, most significantly, did not get sacked once. In a statistical rarity, the Raiders also failed to register a single quarterback hurry or knock down a pass from Cutler.
That led to a flurry of questions for Kiffin, who was asked why the team didn’t blitz more in an effort to knock Cutler out of his comfort zone.
“Rob and the owner (Davis) are always in communication,” Kiffin said Wednesday. “For the most part, I let Rob do his thing over there. He has a belief in certain things and he has a conversation with the owner about that. So, that wasn’t the way the game plan ended up the other night.”
HMMMM Rob lays in the bed of his ruler.... what a shocker huh guys...blanda is the pillow in between davis legs
According to Ryan, he doesn't read the papers regarding the Raiders, other than occasionally. He'll see something negative, even untrue, and he lets it go assuming the negativity stops if they win. Unfortunately they haven't been winning for five years, so the negativity has never stopped.
Just a guess, but I bet Kiffin doesn't read the papers either. I think he isn't even fully aware of how some of his comments are taken. Of course Kiffin doesn't have much involvement in the defense. Few offensive minded HCs do. I guarantee you that Gruden stays out of Monte Kiffin's way. So when Kiffin says he has little involvement on the defensive side, it is blown into "Davis won't allow Kiffin to be involved in the defensive side."
I believe Ryan when he says that he talks to Davis mainly in the off season and only occasionally during the regular season. That would be fully consistent with what I've heard from Madden, Flores, etc.
Gruden has said that Davis occasionally attended defensive team meetings. He said at first he got angry about it, but figured if Bresnahan didn't mind it was no big deal. It is possible that the "weekly meetings" Kiffin was referring to was those times when Davis sits in on the defensive meetings. Perhaps it DOES rankle Kiffin, but not necessarily. It is also possible that Kiffin was just so upset by the defense on Monday that he refused to answer for it, and left it to Ryan. That latter is what I think is most likely.
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