Nice But Not Enough
Nice victory over the Texans. Suddenly it's rainbows over Oakland.
But I'm sorry, I'm not expecting to find a pot of gold anytime soon. Don't be lulled into the warm cocoon of lowered expectations. A sixth-straight season of 11 or more losses is not a major sign of progress under any circumstances.
Tom Cable needs to go, at least back down to the role of line coach (nothing personal here, I'm just not convinced he's head coach material and I'm no longer in a gambling mood at the head coach position). Rob Ryan has earned a one-way ticket. Clear the decks. Hire a capable GM and coach who have an existing relationship, give them the power to hire a staff and run the draft, get out of their way, and give them three years—no exceptions—to turn it around.
Tangible, forceful change is no longer an option, it's a requirement.
posted by Raider Take at 11:50 AM
154 Comments:
Heartland Raider Fan
Participation and Rational discussion is at an all time LOW on this Blog.
It's obvious you've lost touch and can no longer fill the needs of the bloggers who used to frequent this site.
Therefore; you should turn total control of "Raider Take" over to me and a fellow blogger of my choice for no less than 3 years.
Wake up...Al Davis isn't going to reliquish his control either.
Like this Blog (that used to be quite entertaining) you can no longer provide the draw and motivation for Raider fans to come participate any longer... but it is yours and you will keep it "yours".
The choice for Raider fans is easy... stay loyal to the Nation through the tough times (until Al Davis gives up contol, or passes away) or jump ship and take your fickle need for instant gratification with you.
Well, Heartland, I'm glad you've finally figured out the concepts of supply, demand, proprietorship and personal opinion.
Anytime someone mentions "instant gratification" regarding a six-year problem, you know you're dealing with someone special.
Heartland Raider Fan
I'm a Conservative I've always understood "Supply and Demand" and Personal Opinion and RESPONSIBILITY.
Yes "Intant Gratification"....how many Loyal fans (re:true) are there to the teams that have never won, or even been in a Superbowl.
Those Loyal fans would see 6 or 7 dismal years as a walk in the park.
A true conservative understands the concept of doing the right thing, and therefore shouldn't be upset with fans urging Mr. Davis to do the right thing.
Heartland Raider Fan
Nope ....thats Socialism....and that's a proven failed policy.
This is a "Free Market" therefore your free to buy the product or choose another.....with absolutely no legal authority (actual or implied)to impose demands on the business creating the product.
Obviously it's you who doesn't understand "True Proprietorship
.
No, it's called the First Amendment, which as a self-described conservative, you should be familiar with.
Hmmm..., now we are discussing Constitutional Law.
In my tenure as a Raider Fan (44 years), this is hands down the worst stretch.
But as I've always said, I'm a cockeyed (can you say that here) optomist.
I'm looking forward to next weeks game. Why you say? Because what I look forward to is that game where the light goes on, player wise or team wise. There were plenty of holes on the defense, especially on third an long, but the offense and special teams looked the best all year (except for that fumble thing).
The point is can they carry that forward against a better defense. That's what I'm looking for. Hopefully the light went on last Sunday.
Note to all, holding calls are way down league wide this year (except for our guys). Which explains to me why Tommy Kelley can have his jersey ripped off by the Patsies O-Line and there be no calls.
I also was quite shocked to see an instigator get flagged instead of our guy who retalliated.
Just my two cents (adjusted for inflation which shows you how much it's worth.)
H
H, one clarification, we're discussing common sense, not constitutional law.
We have someone here who loves to publish his own opinion, but who would like to censor the opinion of others, thereby contradicting himself and his alleged values.
In Heartland's world, the Detroit automakers are free to run their companies into the ground (certainly their right), but citizens and consumers should not be allowed to voice their displeasure or opinions about the automobiles. No one shall operate a blog that dares criticize the automakers, either. They must not hear an ill word about their failures, as it might hurt their tender little ears and feelings.
Maybe Al Davis should apply for TARP monies and go find some more overpriced free agents to poison the Raiders' lockerroom.
i'm with you raidertake.
i'd like to say yesterday's win was a game of progress.
a game where the lights went on a little for our young guys, and even our coaches.
but real questions linger long in our minds.
such as, why was kwame harris left in to fail so long ? all the while dragging the 0-line down with him.
and why was it so hard to find a role for the talented mcfadden ?
fargas is a nice back, but with so much invested in mcfad, why let him rot on bench ?
and of course the whole kiffin saga. leaving the HC to twist in the wind, while the team was trying to be led by young players on the field.
this was nothing short of a season doomed before it even began for the raiders.
yes, the bad news far outweighed the good in yet another dysfunctional season for mad doctor al, and his silver & black lab rats.
and let me say a word about tom cable.
cable has had his ups and downs, but, if he takes the raiders into tampa and beats grudens, bucs next week, i would have no problem with him returning as HC.
the key is can cable hire his own coaches ?
in other words, if he wants a change at DC, he should be supported by ownership, not stopped.
if he wants to make several coaching changes, or even change the whole staff, he should helped by ownership, not undermined.
i know, i know, cable has his flaws. he loves those strange trick plays, and kwame harris.
but, with a win next week, i'm willing to give him a chance.
afterall, he was put in a tough spot, and was bound to make some mistakes along the way.
besides, if it's cable or fassell, i'm taking cable.
Heartland,
The lack of blogging around here is not RT's fault at all. Just look at the product on the field and the insane person running it.
RT said himself weeks ago that he would take a huge step back from the Raiders and reduce the time spent blogging and trying to figure out this mess. I think I've posted about 3 or 4 posts since, about 1 per week, down from 5-10 per day.
It looks like most everyone else around here is in the same boat.
BTW, didn't you disappear for like 9 months? Do you just show up at the end of each year to rellish in the misery of another losing season? And talk crap to guys like RT just to stir sh*t up?
Couldn't find Blandarocked or what?
Psycho
My Take on Cable. We pretty much screwed ourselves over in making him the interim coach. We had one of the better O-line coaches in the league, and whatever direction we go from here it wouldn't be a bad idea to keep the ZB scheme and Cable around.
Now what? We screwed ourselves out of it because how do you demote a guy from HC to O-Line coach? Talk about awkward. I'm all for wiping the slate clean, hiring a GM and all that crap, but Cable at O-line coach was one of the few things I would've liked to see remain.
Psycho
I feel your frustration. I've had it for a few years.
This team will not succeed until the old man is gone. He will not let it. I've said in other forums: until the Raiders, as a whole, put an honest effort into making a quality football product I will not support them in any meaningful way. No tickets. No gear. No trinkets. Nothing.
Take,
I absolutely agree with your take. It did come across as a somewhat lazy post, but your sentiment is quite clear. You just matter of factly shrugged your shoulders and explained the only way towards a reasonably sane solution. I feel the same way, it's so very depressing that there is nothing exciting to think about going into next season.
While it should be VERY VERY exciting to think about a back like McFadden coming into his own, or maybe finding an electric receiver this off season that Jamarcus could light up the field with....
But instead pounding in my brain is how we could very well poison our talent, make a no. 1 overall QB draft pick into a bust, push some of the most talented players in the league over to other teams, and deal with another gamble of a HC pick.
Your little bit of advise to this organization **cough** al **cough** davis **cough** feels like a sane man trying to tell an insane man that your underwear goes on UNDER the pants NOT over the pants, every single day for 10 years knowing full well that tomorrow he will just do it again.
RT:
I'm glad your're not buying into the fools gold of this one win. But I agree with Psycho. If we put a hurtin on Tampon Bay next week and knock them out of the playoffs I say keep Cable (in spite of the KC debacle). I think we desperately need some continuity at head coach and with so many young players I think starting all over might set us back (especially since we will be limited in our choices). After the last 6 years nobody in their right mind is gonna coach here. Why bring in a re-tread or an unknown long shot.
RaiderMike
Sorry its Raider00 I agree with about Cable.
RaiderMike
Heartland Raider Fan
For someone who has run a blog for a while...you would expect them to understand simple english a little better...especially interpepting their own written words.
"Tangible, forceful change is no longer an option, it's a requirement."
Your words not mine.
Those words sir, go beyond expressing a simple opinion which is your 1st amendment right.
Who are you to insist on a forceful change by someone who runs a free enterprise within the limits of the law?
The simple concept you don't understand is that the Raiders, like the Detroit auto makers have a right to run their companies into the ground if they so choose.
You on the other hand have no "active" say in the matter.
Your choices are to buy their cars reguardless of their business practices or purchase a foriegn.
Just as you have 31 other teams to choose from.
So where is the Censor you speak of?
Such tender little ears...Was my opinion too strong, my words too hurtful? Did I violate your weird view of the 1st Amendment? Al Davis himself would be ashamed of such simpering.
The censorship is in your view that I only have two choices, neither of which is to say what I want on my own blog.
Just like the feds will now bail out the automakers, so will the NFL probably have to bail out the Raiders, to save the economy (league) from mismanagement by one of its primary cogs. In a way, they already have financed the Raiders mismanagement through revenue-sharing. How long do you think the Raiders could stand on their own (Al's) two feet?
Heartland Raider Fan
Such a naive little mind.
Put anything you want on your blog so I can express my 1st ammendment rights....until you deny me that right.....and that would be censorship.
Thanks for the pep talk, but I'm not the one freaking out about someone expressing their opinion on their own blog, nor am I the one suggesting that you don't have a right to an opinion (no matter how odious or misguided it might be).
By the way, I think you'll enjoy my new blog at:
www.YouMustHireAGMNowAlDavisOrElse.com.
Heartland Raider Fan
No ...you would be the one freaking out about dissidence on your blog.
Naturally to the shallow minded, anyone whom would express their disagreement would be considered odious or misguided.
Your words, not mine:
"Those words sir, go beyond expressing a simple opinion which is your 1st amendment right.
Who are you to insist on a forceful change by someone who runs a free enterprise within the limits of the law?"
Cue the disco song: Freak OUT!
Heartland Raider Fan
I have no authority to edit posts on this blog......That would be you ....so once again, point out the censorship.
.
By the way, I think you'll enjoy my new blog at:
www.YouMustHireAGMNowAlDavisOrElse.com.
Gather enough clowns you have a
circus
when was the last time you had this many hits in a day??? LMAO
RT....
Nice thought but NOT realistic in "RaiderVille".....
1st off we are celebrating the little things like a win too late because there is not much else to be happy about...Any little sign of a positive heart-beat will send some of us on a "Raider-High"....
I have seen this play out to the fullest in real life situations where life is on the line and hopelessness is dominate as in Cambodia when gun-fire sent people running for a sanctuary...Any little positive is celebrated as though "Life-is-Grand" when we all knew it was not.....
Thus comes the folowing....
I’m not going to debate whether this is the right moves or the smartest moves….I’m only stating what I believe “MrD” will do in the off-season….
A “GM” is a nice idea but in the reality of the Raider Organization it doesn’t happen….The “OldMan” will continue to run things as long as he believes he still can….That’s as long as he keeps breathing….
The search for a “HC” will be short-n-quick….Either “SOB” will be promoted and his Twin “SOB” hired away from the “Birds” as “DC” or the “HC” job will be offered to the Twin and “SOB” will remain as “DC” under direction of the “SOB“ who can coach….Either way it will be “SOB-n-SOB” as “HC-n-DC”….
Tom “What Was That Play” Cable will be “OLC”-n-”OC”…..He does put the excitement back in Raider Football….Reminds me of the 1st coach for the “SeaBird”s….Jack “That Was a Stupid Play” Pattera…..
On the 1st day of the draft we will take 2 “WR”s and a “LB”….Don’t know in what order yet….
“FA” signings….Albert Hainsworth “DT”….Michael “DogMan” Vick (Slash QB-WR)….Veteran “OT” who fit’s the “ZBS”….Veteran “C” who fit’s the “ZBS”….Awesome-n-Shane re-sign with the team for some huge cash up front….
This will make some-what of a smooth transition for the players that aids in keeping their spirits and hopes up….The “QB”-n-Specialty Players will not have to re-train and learn a new system….The “D” unit will buy into “SOB”s philosophy right from the start and trust in him as “HC” or “DC”….The “Twin”s will work together like clock-work and it will be a 1st in the NFL which gives an old “MrD” his just due….
“O” those Raiders….”D” laughing stock of the NFL…..But “STU” is quiet good at scoring “TD”s…..
PantyRaider..Hopelessness in RaiderVille!!/_
HeartlandRaiderFan.....
Just one small question as a "True" Conservative and I don't mean as in Republicans who are NOT conservatives at all.....That's why they want to "BURN" the Constitution...."Anti-Conservativeism"....
As an owner of a Detroit Auto Manufacturing Plant....How long would you tolerate a would be owner of one of your cars who comes into your public sales office and starts "Ranting" wildly about how you and all your patrons are.......and should be......????/_
I may not always agree with everything the holder of this site has to say....But I always show "Decency"-n-"Respect" to the holder of this site realizing that he extends to me and others the "Privilege" of posting my opinions here freely....But those my friend are "Conservative" Views and NOT shared by all....
PantyRaider....Give Me a Liberal Portion Please!!!!/_
Heartland Raider Fan
Hey Panty Raider.... you better quit sniffing them things and work on being coherant.
Your weak attempt at an anology is totally ridiculous and makes no sense.
Who are you to set the standard on decency and respect. Thats not Conservatism that would be Facism.
But now we're getting into something way over your head.
You Liberals had no problem with disrespect and indecent behavior when it was directed at the current administration....but how dare anyone question your opinions and rants.
Heartland, rather than refuting the content of my takes, you are outraged that I even have a take (despite the name of the site).
You declare that I have only two choices with regard to the Raiders, neither of which is to express my opinion.
You actually say that I've overstepped the 1st Amendment in my latest take.
Frankly, it's getting a bit creepy.
Cultural conservatism is a philosophy that supports preservation of the heritage of a nation or culture....
Decency-n-Respect are old world teachings....NOT of your "New World Order"....
Murder, Thievery-n-Annihilation on the basis of lies-n-deceit were NOT conservative actions by your current administration....
Talk Raider Football....Your too confused about real life issues...
can we please get back to raider football here.
this upcoming game reminds me of when gruden led the raiders into kc for the last game of the 1999 season.
we all remember, the raiders came to life, in hostile road stadium, joe nedney booted the winner, knocking the chefs out of the playoff's.
that was a game where we could pinpoint, hey, gruden and raiders turned a corner.
well, here we are again. this time, ironically, going against gruden, trying to knock'em out of playoff's and trying to turn that tough corner again.
can we do it ? i hope so, and i'm willing to let tom cables future ride on this game.
Heartland Raider Fan
Whats creepy is that you're as bad at understanding simple written english as that illiterate joker Panty Raider....any dissidence at all to the "Raider Gospel" according to you, or your hilarious ravings to reorganize the Raider management and you're off reading between the lines and grasping at straws to defend the silly little notion that you, or your self acclaimed brilliance mean anything to Al Davis.
Heartland Raider Fan:
Who the hell cares whether a person is conservative, liberal, facsist, socialist ... etc?
How on earth are any of these labels relevant to a discussion about Raider football?
Raider Take expressed the opinion that "Tangible, forceful change is no longer an option, it's a requirement." So? Why are you blowing a gasket? Is that such a difficult concept to grasp?
It his blog to express his opinion ... Deal with it. Many Raider fans agree with this assessment based on six consecutive seasons of 11+ losses. Where's the fire, chief?
You write the curious and dubious statement: "Participation and Rational discussion is at an all time LOW on this Blog."
When did you get hired to become the blog census analyst?
Your statement is curious because it seems like you want to desperately imply that this blog is no longer relevant, interesting, or in tune with many Raider fans.
It is dubious because why would you consider participation to be at an all time low when the last post had 257 hits?
Also, who the hell made you the judge and jury on what constitutes 'rational' thought? IMO, your views are irrational. You seem to have a major axe to grind and I'm not quite sure why.
So let me get this straight HRF: Expressing an opinion of dissatisfaction on your own blog is the same as insisting that said opinion is implemented? OK! Now we are getting somewhere.
Longtime fans of an NFL team have 2 choices and 2 choices only.
(a) Be content with a shitty product and keep their yaps shut
(b) jump ship
You've got many Raider fans who visit this site to have a free and open discussion about the current state of the Raiders organization. Suprise, suprise ... there are MANY Raider fans who are disappointed and disgusted with how the franchsise has been run into the ditch.
Is it such a novel and clever concept for a NFL owner to hire a capable GM? Is it a novel and clever concept for a GM to hire a HC who he has an established working relationship with?
It is amusing that you are the one freakin'out over opinions on a blog. For heavens sake Heartland ... take your prozac and come back in 9 months. Get well. You can get busy on your own blog:
www.freeenterprisebutnofreespeech.com
Heartland Raider Fan
Well Calico welcome to the forray.
Yet another dim bulb who chooses to read and interpret what was never written.
"Your choices are to buy their cars reguardless of their business practices or purchase a foriegn.
Just as you have 31 other teams to choose from."
Where is it even inferred that you had to keep your yap shut???
You clowns are so ate up with a sports franchise that you actually believe that your little hopes, dreams, and schemes matter to the Raider organization.
How sad.
Just ignore the yokel from Kansas and he will likely go away...
This too, Shall Pass....
I think it time to turn our attention to the '09 draft. What are we looking for in the 1st round?
A Left Tackle? Obviously but after that?
Our 2nd and 5th round pick was shipped to Atlanta for D Hall.
Lots of Wide Receivers available as it looks now.
Boldquin would be my choice but Chad Johnson could be had, and it looks like T. Holt isn't happy in St Louis. A proven #1 receiver is needed, we've got a team full of #2's.
Money talks and all three have consistently put up eye popping numbers over a significant period of time.
Obviously we need a free safety and still looking for a strong side linebacker. This defense can't stop the run to save it's own life so maybe we need to put more points on the board so the opposing offense will feel compelled to throw the ball more.
Sources say we're looking at Kevin Gilbride, Giants OC as a possible head coach. As much as people say, no one will coach in Oakland, there's only 32 jobs of this ilk. Somebody will dare to try.
Jano and Lechler are fine. Keep Miller as KR and Higgins as he is the truth running back punts. Resign #21, cut #24, and J. Walker please.
That's a start, feel free to add your thoughts.
Raider00 - I'm with you. Too much energy has been spent arguing with an unarmed drive-bye poster.
The Raiders are 2-TD dogs to the Bucs. Apparently, the Raiders have done nothing to instill confidence with the booking community. Understandable.
The Bucs must win to have a shot at a wildcard spot. They have everything to lose.
This is a perfect opportunity for the Raiders to exit this season with a shred of self respect. Tom Cable can make a case for his HC hire, and Rob Ryan can showcase for his next job (somewhere else, please!).
The Raiders can win their 5th game, which, by the smallest of measures, is better than last year.
Actually, winning this game could be dangerous. It may leave a misguided notion that Rob Ryan should remain, or that Cable is the best choice at HC. The latter is less severe, but Cable will need help, particularly with playcalling.
You can be sure this game is of upmost importance to Al Davis, the king of vindictive thought.
Gruden, his former coach is the Bucs HC. Kiffin, father of his former HC, is the DC. Both free-thinkers and both targets of Davis' discontent.
So the 1st Amendment is important to conservatives now? Is this the Goldwater conservatives that were more libertarians of old, or the neo-cons of today that gleefully torture, have secret prisons, secret wiretapping, piss on Habeas Corpus, want to control women's wombs, change the Constitution to discriminate against gays... etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc...
Can I type a few more etc's to make my point?
If Raider Take is suddenly going to be RT's political forum, at least start it off with something that doesn't make me throw up in my mouth first thing in the morning.
Conservatives give a flying FUCK about the Constitution huh???? Maybe the 2nd, but thats about as far as it goes these days.
Give me a fucking break.
Heartland Raider Fan
Hey Gary boy....don't let the facts get in the way of a good rant.
Talk about "drive-bys"!!!
Spew the Liberal talking point and run. You've been indoctrinated well.
Since Heartland has nothing to say about the Raiders except for his one talking point (you don't own the team, so you have no right to an opinion), I suggest that we (myself most included) ignore him. He's beginning to rival Faida Boy, which is quite a feat.
To be honest, I've been ignoring his posts since it became a political flame war.
I'm not going to get into details, but suffice it to say that, as a conservative myself, Heartland is doing no favors for the conservative crowd.
Gary and I have had our differences over the years, so we won't elaborate on that--let's just say that politics has no place in a football blog. It never goes anywhere but to cause problems.
JMHO
---Jeff
Well fellas, happy holidays to you all.
I read always, agree sometimes, and write seldom.
Take I gotta agree with your OPINION. Even taking the tippy toe approach opinion, hanging Kiffin out to dry and waiting four games into the season to fire him, instead of firing him way back in the offseason was the straw that broke my back when it came to blind support for the Raiders and Al Davis.
Cable is growing on me, but by no means am I sold on him. Retaining Cable as head coach in order to keep things the same, will put me back into the wait and see mode instead of arduous supporter(i.e. spender) mode.
Thats my opinion and am sticking to it, unless I change my mind!
Tom Cable's record as a head coach (college and NFL) is 14-43.
Under his watch, I have seen the Raiders play some of the most wretched football ever. The Falcons game and Chiefs home game weren't just losses, they were complete embarrassments.
Even if we win in Tampa Bay, I'm just not feeling it.
For the sake of argument, say Al Davis lets Cable go after the season. Do you really think that he would get a head coaching interview (let alone gig) anywhere in the NFL this offseason? Honestly? I don't.
I think that we need to go in a new direction, top to bottom.
I'm gonna' say this about next year: After we get a new GM, which Al has said he's doing, that GM is going to have a hell of a job in front of him.
Do we stay with Cable for HC continuity's sake? Or do we go for, say Harbaugh or Rob's brother Rex? Or a myriad of other options? I'm undecided right now, except that Cable seems to finally be getting some traction.
I think if we can get Cable a decent OC and a decent QB coach, we'll be in good shape. He'll also need an OL coach with his ZBS philosophy.
I also think we need a different DC, so if that's Rex, I'm good with that. I'm not much on Rob anymore as DC unless we get Rex as a HC. I think I could deal with that scenario.
Personnel-wise, I think we're not as far away as some might suspect.
On defense, I think that if we're able to keep Aso, we have an outstanding DB corps. I think if we can get a Matt Millen-type Middle Linebacker to help stop the run, our LB corps will be solid.
I think our obvious defensive need is the line, both DTs and DEs. We've GOT to be able to rotate those big guys up front.
On offense, I think we're set at RB and FB, given the guys who will be coming back from IR. I think we're better off than we think at WR. We might get ONE WR next year, but I think this crew is progressing pretty well.
It would be nice to get a vet QB to help mentor JR, but who won't be trying to take over.
I think one more offseason is really going to help the OL. Mario is really progressing, and Gallery is doing very well. We could use a vet at Center unless Grove steps WAY up. Possibly another Tackle.
So my thinking is we look to FA for DT/DE/OL, possibly WR.
In the draft, we could go all out for nothing but linemen and I'd be quite happy.
JMHO
---Jeff
Considering we've only drafted one O-lineman in two years (ie during a period of OL need), I wouldn't expect an all-out draft blitz on O-line.
Also, Cable might be our HC by default. If you think about a list of candidates who would actually consider working for Al Davis, the list of potential HCs gets shorter and shorter.
That little Kiffin-bashing display Davis put up on the overhead is a red flag to any would-be coach. You can bank on that.
Heartland Raider Fan
That's OK Raider Take
I understand this blog and your love affair with the Raiders, and obsession for food, is all you probaly have in your shallow, hollow, little life so I'll move on to more intellectually fertile grounds and find my entertainment there.
You have no right to do that!
Food?
Hey, everyone. I don't care what anyone's political leanings are on this site. I have other outlets for that.
I'm here to talk Raider Football. The good, the bad and the ugly of the last six seasons.
What I feel, think or do from a political standpoint is meaningless in the discussions that go on here. I take the same approach on TV also. As soon as a "sports reporter" starts talking politics I change the channel.
I follow politics as closely as I do the Raiders, but they are two distinct and separate things.
Now to quote Forest Gump, "That's all I've got to say about that."
A win Sunday would be huge for this team and would give Al pause to consider keeping Cable. If he stays, I would like to see a different DC. The meanist nastiest DC on the market.
Under league rules he must interview at least one other candidate and that candidate must be a minority.
H
Good. Back to football.
I didn't say I thought we'd go nothing but OL in the draft, just that it's on my Christmas list.
You have to admit, it'd be very nice.
Pretty sure we don't need Crabtree. Picking up a vet WR is probably our best bet there.
JMHO
---Jeff
So let's do a poll on the head coach position. Personally, I think that's the most crucial topic at hand in the twilight of this season:
Who thinks we should:
1. Go with Cable, period, in 2009?
2. Go with Cable in 2009, but only IF we beat the Bucs and finish the season with upside and momentum?
3. Find a new head coach?
2 or 3 for me. I'm not 100% sold on Cable, but I do like the guy and he is also a fan of the team.
I would like to see what he could do with two real tackles though.
But, unless there is a real game changer out there, like Saban going to Alabama, I'm not in the mood for the next great young coach.
If he falls to the second round Antoine Caldwell would make a nice addition to the OL. He made All American at center and can play any position on the line (think depth here). Under Joe Pendry he worked in a system similar to the zone blocking and was the leader of the least penalized line in the conference. I've seen him pull from center and wack people like The Wiz used to do.
H
I say 1. Cable came in during the most difficult of circumstances and had to learn his job on the fly. Cable hasn't really had the chance to really show what he's capable of as an HC. And yet, even with that he's shown signs of boldness and made dramatic changes in personnel. Make no mistake. Last Sunday was about the young players stepping up for Tom Cable.
The second point is that, as H points out, Cable is actually a FAN of the Raiders. I, frankly, am very tired of having coaches around who seem to hate this franchise.
The next point would be that the press seems to like Tom Cable. They don't seem like it is their mission in life to get under his skin or to raise controversey over something he didn't actually say.
The next point is that if we bring in somebody else, no matter who it is, we are going to start all over again with trying to change the culture on this team. It's not going to go away by Al hiring a GM or a different HC. Consistency, where players are accoutable to each other, and continuity are what this team needs most.
All that said, we need a bright mind to fill in at OC. We need someone to design a playbook which takes advantage of the Raiders' strengths and minimizes their weaknesses. I'm wondering if either Lofton or Rathman could fill that role.
Cable has made some real bonehead calls, so it's difficult to just say #1. 2, eh. 3 is more likely.
At the end of the day, I see this process as being the lesser of many evils.
A) Al Davis decides to coach (from the field this time).
B) Davis is forced to hire another unproven young upstart.
C) Davis brings in a retread that will actually work for him after seeing his Kiffin-bashing overhead projector display.
It's not like we're looking at Bill Cowher here. We simply won't have the kind of options at HC that other teams might enjoy. Plus, Davis is notoriously cheap when it comes to HCs.
Given the above, and in the interest of continuity, Cable may be our HC by default. He seems to have the respect of the players. He will need help, though... at least somebody else to call plays.
Sorry, I can’t resist. HRF said, “...so I'll move on to more intellectually fertile grounds” Are you kidding me?
In the immortal words of Harvey Korman, “(your) mind is cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives.” Good luck with that Heartland. Don’t let the door hit you on your way out.
I remember your rants last time you were here (about a year ago), but I don't remember the digressions and personal attacks. Maybe you should consider upping your meds.
Good points Blanda but it all goes out the window if they look like crap sun against TB. They gotta show something in this game and if they do I say bring Cable back big time. The game against Houston was the best coached Raider game in 6 years. It was encouraging to say the least. A repeat against the Yucs this sun shows something could be brewin.
RaiderMike
i'm already on record, but i'll cast a vote for #2. tom cable must beat the bucs, on the road, in a meaningful game(for them).
we must see something from this team. more than one good game a month.
this is 1999 all over again. final week, in kc, nedney wins it, chefs stay home.
that was a turn the corner moment for the raiders.
we are at the fork in the road again. if cable is to stay around, he needs this game, just as gruden needed it in 1999.
Raiders left for dead.
New coach! New GM, New DC, and see if you can't get it right this time. It can be done but can Al bring himself to do it the right way. He spends freely but not very wisely. It won't happen over night but in 2 years we could be atop the AFC West. We need free agents with proven track records, no more throwing good money after bad. The leagues highest payroll ought to bring more than 4 or 5 victories.
I'm surprised at some of the responses. One game does not make a good coach. In the three games prior to Houston, the Raiders looked like the most unprepared team in the history of pro sports. They, plain and simple, got their ass kicked three straight games... making like 8 pure ass-kickings this year. How can a team be so up and down, yet on the brink of a turnaround? It's just not possible. I don’t think Cable should win a job on one game, or even two.
In a perfect world it will be left up to someone other than Davis, like a bonafide GM, who will in turn interview Cable along with other suitable HC candidates, and make a decision based on the merits of each.
Or, should we just come to the realization that Davis will not change, and hope the law of averages is in our favor.
Poll Question:
My answer is #3 with Cable coming back as OLine coach.
For those who think this would create an awkward sitation ... think again. Cable loves the Raiders, is a loyal coach, who would be proud to work with the OLine again.
Having answered the poll question, it is time to move on to a more sound approach to rebuilding this team.
Step 1 needs to be hiring a GM BEFORE a HC is brought on board.
Step 2 is to allow the new GM to pick the HC. With a GM on board, the list for potential HC candidates expands. This would include more capable HC candidates for 2 reasons:
(1) The new GM can reach out to HC candidates who have a past relationship with him
(2) Having a GM in place makes the Raiders gig more appealing to prospective candidates.
Step 3 is to allow the new HC to fill out his staff. It is critical to hire the best available OC & DC on the market.
There are coaches on this staff who are worth retaining;
ST Coach Schneider (sp?)
WR Coach Lofton
RB Coach Rathman
OL Coach Cable
DL Coach Millard
LB Coach Martenelli
DB Coach Perry
Of course, if the new HC has upgrades for these coaching positions ... all the better.
It might be sad to say but ... I would like to see the Raiders treat this offseason like the eqivalent of an expansion team ... an expansion team with a head start since there are certain important pieces already in place.
When I say treating this offseason like an expansion team what I'm trying to convey is the idea that this team/franchise needs to be scrubbed/altered/evaluated from top to bottom with a comprehensive plan to rebuild not reload.
I'm #3 as already stated, and I'm totally on board with Calico Jack's process.
I'm also in accord with NYRaider regarding short memories. That's what I mean about the cocoon of lowered expectations. Don't be fooled and lulled by the (very) occasional rousing victory sandwiched between ongoing debacles and embarrassments. Even Shell had a rousing victory (Steelers).
The time is now for a Dolphins-like reckoning and awakening, which includes a major housecleaning, both real and philosophical.
I would love to have the positives from this week reiterated by a road win but even then is cable really the answer? I'm not convinced.
RT, I am actually surprised at your poll. You have led the charge on the GM and other drastic changes (and I am solidly with you). cable staying or going means nothing with out those changes.
The way things have been going, i.e., moss and jordan coming back to haunt, chucky will run up the score with the kiffins in the wings.
"I told you so" to AD by lance with a - ! - because monte was on his way as DC but AD "done what he do-ed" to quote Johnnie Lee Higgins...
Heartland Raider fan........Your a putz plain and simple.....Keep drinking the coolaid brutha.....The Raider Nation is made up of many different types of fans.....I always get a kick out of fans that call out the "bandwagon" fans.....Its comical.....Like you, who think that anyone who does not bow to Mt.Davis is somehow less of a fan.....This Blog has always been tops for the more cerebral fan...The fan that sees the big picture.....knows football and how winning teams stay that way.....
Please don't let the door hit you in the ASS on the way out of RT.....We will not notice the lack of narrow mindedness here because this is a place where ALL fans are welcome.....
Perhaps you should get in your 4x4 and drive to Alameda for a game our two....
Trip....500.00
tickets..200.00 (if you can sell enough cans)
Raiders losing and you PISSED....Priceless
Listen hayseed.....Pay some money to see this shit for 6 seasons in a row, let alone blog your heart out for hours each week and then tell me about it.....
I suggest you become a Chiefs fan....It's closer and you can become another toothless wonder......What a Moron.......
By the way, if you want to hear this kind of take on the Raiders....Raider Nation Podcast will be sure to raise your blood pressure....Oh and by the way I think we need to FLUSH this staff and start over....No more Basic Cable....
Raider Greg
Great post Raider Greg!
Enough of the squirt gun drive byes.
Bottom Line: Painting Raider fans with broad, ignorant brush strokes serves no purpose.
The reason many of us keep returning to Raider Take is because we can count on hearing a broad spectrum of opinions ... but more importantly we can discuss Raider football not 1st amendment rights, political leanings, or bitter discourse.
Jump on the condiments wagon HRC ... start wearing your ketchup and mustard clothing proudly ... after all "This is a "Free Market" therefore your free to buy the product or choose another.....with absolutely no legal authority (actual or implied)to impose demands on the business creating the product.
Good point, Memdf.
The poll was based on comments I was seeing. I said that Cable needs to go (not from the team, but at least back down to line coach). Yet others were saying they would be for retaining him as head coach if he presided over victory this Sunday. I was surprised by this sentiment, but it was repeated by a few regulars here, so it seemed like an an interesting line of debate. I understood wanting him to go or stay, but was curious by this notion that one game would make the difference, as if Cable's resume would be made or broken in Tampa Bay.
I don't think that the poll precludes or excludes the GM question. Obviously, as someone in the #3 camp, I'm anxious for a GM who will have the authority to make, or have serious input, in big decisions (ie: head coach).
For those in the #1 or #2 camp, it's a legitimate questions: do you want a GM and, if so, do you want the head coach dictated to this new GM?
Raider Greg and Calico Jack: priceless.
RaiderTake,
it's not so much that the tampa game would make the difference as far as cable returning.
i'm trying to look at the big, realistic, picture here.
the jets OT win. the domination of the donks in denver. the domination of the texans, and, if it happens, a win over a playoff hungry tampa on the road.
that is why i liken this game to the 1999 chefs game.
it's quite possible that if the raiders would have lost that game, gruden might have been fired.
so yeah, one game can have much riding on it.
would i prefer a Gm, who goes out and hires bill cowher ? of course.
but since i don't think there's a snowball's chance in hell of it happening, i will deal with our al davis reality.
our choices are really this,
young bright coach that al davis comes to despise after a few months.
retread alley, where the likes of jim fassel go along with everything al wants..."your hired jim, but rob ryan & james lofton are part of your sfaff. PERIOD!!".
or, raiders beat tampa, and tom cable is retained. of the 3 choices, i'm pulling for this one.
like i said, this is our al davis, reality.
we do not have a coaching problem or an owner problem. We have overpaid babies on the field who take no pride in their craft and it's sad. I don't even care aboout the NFL anymore. Bunch of babies, like, well, most raider fans... click.
While Cable may make a good coach at this point he reminds me of the 1st coach for the "SeaBirds"....Jack Patera...He would have a lead and make an on-side-kick that failed and allowed the other team to score....This week it worked but as we remember it fail in weeks past like that pitch to Jano...
PantyRaider....Not Sure!!!/_
PS...It must be very difficult for Hate-land-Insecurity being a "Double Loser" just prior to the the "Rapture 0f 09" (January 20th Eviction of the W From the WhiteHouse)....I mean loosing on the Grid-Iron and in the political arena all in the same year could turn anyone into a "Tub-o-Tear"s....Oh! The Horror! The Horror!...
Unfortunately, there is only one man steering the ship and, even though it's gone far off course, there's no sign he will give up the wheel. Davis is determined to make the demise of the Raiders part of his legacy... full circle.
Remember, he still expects two more SBs. How can he accomplish that with somebody else making even the smallest decission without his input?
My guess is that Al Davis will hire a new exec., but not before he extends Ryan's contract and hires a new head coach, upon whom he will force most of the coaching staff. Then Davis will orchestrate the draft and free agency.
Honestly, why should we expect anything else?
>>>>
the jets OT win. the domination of the donks in denver. the domination of the texans, and, if it happens, a win over a playoff hungry tampa on the road.
>>>>
Thats a good point... in 9 games, Cable HAS had two of the most dominating wins in the last 6 years, something all the other coaches didn't accomplish in all their games combined. Sure he's had some embarrassing losses also, but he is replacing a popular coach fired mid-season. Obviously there would be times he is tuned out.
>>>
that is why i liken this game to the 1999 chefs game.
it's quite possible that if the raiders would have lost that game, gruden might have been fired.
>>>>
That game was a franchise-changer, no doubt.
I still remember Al's ear to ear grin after the game.
I can imagine he will be just as pleased with a win over Chucky... and perhaps give Cable the same latitude he gave Chucky with a win.
I like retaining Cable a lot better than Fossell, and that is prolly our only two choices.
And as to politics, I don't start the conversations, but I sure as hell will try to end them.
Please, lets leave it out of this blog. puuuleeeeeease?
BTW, JRuss also had his two best performances hands down with Cable as coach... it may be a coincidence, but if Russell likes Cable, is that really something we should mess with?
I'd like to hear what Russell has to say about this after the season.
The franchise still rests on his shoulders, at least as much as any coach.
couldn't help but notice a very bitter and angry man in here, Eric 10:45, who likens all NFL players to babies. hmmmmm, Eric eh? last name Frampton? lmao, couldn't make the raiders couldn't make the lions squad, that would make any loser who thought he had some skills mad huh....very funny stuff!!!
frkyraider
Calico, it's not that I completely disagree with you, but there's a fly in your ointment. Your process virtually guarantees repeating a season similar to the last six years, balanced against the hope of dramatic improvement by 2010.
While I agree that it's necessary to bring in a GM, if for no other reason than to facilitate organizational communication, if we wait for a GM to pick the new head coach, the best candidates for the job will be already taken. Then, whoever that HC may be, there is going to have to be time for the players to buy into his program. The losing culture will remain unchanged until the new HC can prove he knows how to win. And then by mid season, everyone around here will be griping that Al picked the wrong GM who picked the wrong HC.
Better to keep Cable in place. Let him pick his own DC, OL coach,OC and QC. Davis can hire a GM who will then decide on Cable's performance after 2009. If by mid season, it doesn't appear that Cable has this team on track, then the new GM can begin reviewing potential candidates to replace Cable immediately after the season.
The problem with trying to do everything at once is that you don't have the time to do it.
Added:
As Cable said, when he took over as HC, he thought the losing culture was a mouse, even though he'd already been with the team for more than a year. As HC, he learned that the losing culture was actually an elephant.
I we wind up not getting a new HC until late February, early March, no matter the quality of that HC, he's not going to understand the dynamics of the losing culture until he's actually worked with these players through games and practices. Watching film isn't going to get the job done.
If the new HC doesn't really know what he actually has until after the season starts, we can't expect any kind of a logical draft. There will be no basis of understanding the team needs, only players who look good, but might wind up proving to be bad for the mix.
I'm not persuaded, BlandaRocked. The Falcons and Dolphins cleaned house top to bottom after last season, and they apparently did a good job of it. The Falcons were in even worse shape by this time last year, with no franchise QB in addition to an interim coach and a GM problem, as well as two scandals nagging at them (Vick and Petrino).
I'm no longer interested in Al doesn't do this or Al won't do that. What has "Al doesn't" gotten us for the past six years?
What Al won't do has become what Al should do. And what Al should do is find a way to install a GM and a coach and a staff that can immediately change the culture.
We act like this stuff is so hard (finding a good coach, drafting well, having a GM), yet we see other teams do it all the time. Let's stop grading the Raiders on a curve.
Take, every year you point to some team as our model of success, and they wind up sucking eggs the very next season or by the end of the season is question. Anybody can get lucky in the short term - except, apparently, us.
When all of the foreign auto companies were building and designing cars for fuel efficiency, Detroit was building and pushing SUVs. For awhile, it looked like GM was brilliant, building larger and larger SUVs every year, lobbying congress to provide tax breaks for larger vehicles. Then - 2008! Oops.
When you build something, it has to be with time and care. It has to coincide with future planning.
Take, I know you want a pony, but you won't get one this Christmas.
"Take, every year..."
Every year the Raiders lose 11 or more games. And you wonder why I'm repeating myself?
Yes, while we're setting the NFL record for failure (at a time when parity is at an all-time high), you want to compare our failure to other teams? There is no comparison. That's why they call it a record.
You actually underscore my point. Parity is at an all time high. Dynasties are few and far between. It's very difficult to stay on top for long, and accordingly, it's very difficult to stay on the bottom for long.
This is why your "sucking eggs" pets from last year (Jets, Saints) have all rebounded to win eight or more games this year, and why the Falcons and Dolphins have racked up double digits in wins. Boy, I'd hate to be those teams.
But the Raiders, no, we must adhere to the "10-year plan to eight victories" method pioneered by the likes of the Lions. Excuses, excuses.
Take, it's not "every year" the Raider lose 11 games. It's the last six. What we have been doing for the last six years is a major overhaul of the coaching staff every other year. Is the idea of "consistancy" completely lost on you. Or are you stuck on the last six years like a broken record.
What we have RIGHT NOW, that we didn't have for the majority of the last six years is a young nucleus of talented players who want to be a part of changing the culture. Any thing we learned about this team this season will be junked if we start all over again - whether it's Al Davis who starts all over again or a new, unnamed GM.
Also, the Lions were, at one point, an example you provided as a team turning around because they had a fast start last year.
We just set an NFL record for consistency (in the worst way possible), so no, it's not lost on me.
Poll question:
Number 3. With a backdrop of a GM deciding if he wants to Retain Cable.
And speaking of GM's, Since there isn't a GM who will no longer be retained, does anybody know how the GM hunt is going? or is that too sane a question to ask?
Oh, and your assertion that the NFL is now all about parity? Excuse me? What do you base that on? No dynasties? What do you call New England? Last I heard, no team has ever won more than back to back Super Bowls. Are you discounting New England because they haven't won the Super Bowl every year?
What New England has is a little thing called "consistancy." I think the Colts can claim to have a bit of that themselves. But the Falcons have had a dramatic one year turn around! Woo Hoo!
The GM hunt should be in high gear right now.
The Dolphins hired Ireland on Jan 2 last year, and the Falcons hired Dimitrioff on Jan 12 last year. There's no good excuse for not wrapping the position up within the next few weeks so that a proper coaching search can be undertaken.
Shell was re-hired on Feb 11 and Kiffin on Jan 23. There's plenty of time to do it right.
Blanda, iff you are arguing that parity isn't at an all-time high in the NFL, you've truly gone around the bend.
News report published two weeks ago:
"Every year since the NFL switched to an eight-division, 32-team format in 2002, at least one team with five or fewer wins one season has rebounded to reach the playoffs the following season. But never have four such clubs qualified in the same year.
Conversely, three of the four teams in last year's conference championships (San Diego, Green Bay and New England) may fall short of the postseason. Two other 2007 playoff squads — Jacksonville (4-9) and Seattle (2-11) — are already eliminated from contention; Washington (7-6) would be on the outs if the regular season ended today.
The cliché that the NFL is a 'year-to-year' league has never rung truer."
BR:
Please don't act like the hiring of a GM is some difficult, complex, revolutionary, time consuming act. It simply isn't.
Al Davis has had all the time in the world to put together a prospective GM list.
As far as any "set back" with bringing in a GM who hires a HC ... what are you talking about? How much further can we be "set back" than winning 3.9 games per year the past 6 years.
You write, "if we wait for a GM to pick the new head coach, the best candidates for the job will be already taken." Nonsense. Flip your idea on its head ... I sincerely believe that without a GM on board there won't be any viable candidates besides the usual retreads and young upstarts.
* There isn't any logical reason that Davis can't interview and hire a GM by the end of February and possible as early as next month. (Please, no more excuses)
* The newly hired GM can easily hire a HC by Feb/Mar. (What's the problem with that?)
* By hiring a GM first, we would be able to broaden our horizons for recruiting a new HC.
BR, when I read your last few posts, all I see are excuses for why "this shouldn't be done" "this can't be done" "this will cause this" "this won't work" etc. Enough already. Take a step back, take a deep breath and realize that the simple act of hiring a GM isn't rocket science and it doesn't need to wait until mid season, next year, next decade ...
The Dolphins and Falcons had their GMs and head coaches in place in January. Those owners must be rocket scientists.
BR: This is what I wrote on my own blog 7 days ago:
------------------------------
I hate to keep beating the war drums about an obvious solution to the Raiders malaise but ...
I read a very pertinent quote the other day that was in reference to the resignation of Kansas City Chiefs GM Carl Peterson. This quote neatly puts a bow on the essence of the Raiders problems. Most Raider fans are painfully aware of the fact that Al Davis is pulling "double duty" as owner and GM. The downward spiral of the last six years is largely due to Davis being negligent in getting the help he desperately needs to move the franchise forward.
Here's the quote from the Chiefs' chairman in reference to replacing Peterson:
"I want somebody who's a shrewd evaluator of football talent," Hunt said. "His job will be 24/7 to think about the football team. That's the most important quality. Obviously I'm looking for a strong leader, a good communicator, preferably somebody who has experience in building a winning team"
In a nutshell, Davis needs an executive GM leader to shoulder the heavy lifting required to get this team back on the winning track.
The process of hiring a GM should be well underway. The list should already be narrowing. Why is it that I doubt this is happening?
It really isn't rocket science. So much time, yet so little gets done.
Davis has become an enabler of the Raiders futility. January will be a critical month for the Raiders, with inaction as relevant as action. With inaction, we can expect the Raiders problems to continue.
hey, maybe ebenezer al is on his way to visit the ghost of xmas past right now.
maybe tomorrow morning, we will all find a shiny, brand new GM in all our stockings.
probably will just get art shell dressed up like santa instead.
baahhhummmbuggg !!!!!!!
Parcells was who I wanted prior to his going to Dallas.
Once he left Dallas, he top'd my list again.
One look at the 2007 disaster that was Miami under Cam Cameron and what Parcells has put together in 2008 is all it should take to convince that the GM position is vital.
And our Raiders history proves the point:
When Ron Wolfe came back to the Raiders in late 70's, we won SB's 15 and 18. When Wolfe left for Green Bay, we bottomed out.
Once Bruce Allen took over that slot, the Raiders became competitive again. Again, when Allen left for Tampa Bay, we became the NFL whipping boys.
One available guy I see on the horizon these days that I'd like to see on board is past Oilers/Titans GM Floyd Reese. Has a good eye for talent and coaching staffs.
Until that position is filled, it will be more of the same - and all us Raiders fans are skunked.
"Reality Check"...
RT-CalicoJack-NYRaider are all correct in insisting the Raiders become like every other winning franchise in the NFL....
However...You are totally ignoring the reality of this organization which has "NEVER" been run like every other winning franchise in NFL history....
Therefore....BlandaRocked is correct in his forecast regarding the Raiders...The smoothest transition possible will most likely translate into the most wins next season....
Unfortunately the smoothest transition would be keeping Cable as "HC" or Hiring "SOB" of the "BlackBird"s as "HC" and making Cable "OC"-"OLC" in a dual role...As to which one is the better I have no idea....
I do believe "SOB"-Rex would make a good "HC" at some point and a situation where he is coaching with his twin would no doubt be ideal for him and also make the twin "SOB"-Rob more successful...
The unfortunate reality is that "Budy-Ball" was not a winning situation....While he was responsible for some really fine "D"s he was also responsible for the kind of stupidity that got him run out of a job..."Split-Personality"....
It appears that "SOB"-Rob ended up with the (-) value of that personality while "SOB"-Rex got all the (+)'s...Maybe together they could make one complete whole....
As for the record....Don't put much value in how the NFL and the "Mediot"s put their spin on the Raiders losing ways...Why take a record for only 6 seasons and hold it up as living prove that the Raiders are the worst team in the history of the freakin NFL...Even during that 6 year span we were the worst only once and got the 1st pick in the draft as a result...So please take a good look at teams like Detroit-Cinn-SadFran-Etc-Etc-Etc over time and compair that to the Raiders for the same period and we are clearly NOT the worst by any stretch of the imagination...For example just take this century....The past 9 seasons and compare....Now where do we stand...
PantyRaider....Record Nonsense!!!!/_
A record-setting streak of losing is our current context. I'm glad it hasn't always been this way, but it's this way now, so we need to deal with it. No excuses. My blog posts are dated 2008, not 2002.
As for Mr. Davis and the organization never doing this or never doing that, well, maybe it's time they did this or that, eh?
I don't want this blog to be about "they will never do this because they've never done it that way before, end of discussion," because this blog is all about discussion.
To suggest that the Raiders and Mr. Davis are truly incapable of change is ultimately disrespectful to them, in my humble opinion.
I disagree with the idea that the Raiders have never been run like other successful franchises.
In my mind all successful franchises have similarities:
Good ownership that lets good managers hire good coaches that pick good players to perform on the field.
Its not about having the best athletes - it's about putting the best T E A M on the field. Nobody's ever going to convince me that the great dynasties had all the best players - they all had good players that came together as the best team.
I'm hopeful that Davis' remarks earlier in the year show that he is leaning towards replicating the Owner/GM/Coach/Player top down driven type of organization.
Thats the model he used to make the Raiders the Team of the Decades.
It's not a new concept to Davis.
One name I never see in these discussions (like Take, that what I prefer on this blog) is how the passing of Al Locasale has impacted the Raiders. He was a very knowledgeable football guy that came across as very strong and opinionated.
RT...
OK but please lengthen the 6 years to the last 9 years and see how it comes out...Why would that be difficult....Infant wouldn't it make more sense to talk about a "Decade" instead of a 6 season span....So let's take a look at 1999-to-2008....Now how do we look....
I was NOT trying to limit the discussion...I was stating why I was siding with BlandaRocked's position as opposed to others...."Reality-Check"...Believe me I would love to see "MrD" step aside and follow your advise but I just don't see it happening...NOT YET...
WR Ashley Lelie Placed on Injured Reserve.
Looking ahead at Sunday the #'s on the 2 "QB" are fairly even...."JRus"-n-Garcia are almost in a dead-heat....
Also the running backs are very close...The problem is we can't stop the run...
A look at last weeks game...I felt there were some bad calls and no calls but we won so it did not seam so important at the time...But sense we are talking about Cable as "HC" it should be looked at...
On the rushing "TD" by the Texans as the Raiders were making a goal-line-stand it appeared his knee was down before he lunged the ball across the line...The flag was never sent forth for a challenge which could have made it 4th-n-Goal instead of a "TD"....
On a Raider drive that resulted in a field-goal a pass went into the end-zone on 3rd-down as Higgins was knocked out of the play by their "D"....This was clearly pass-interference or holding but not called....
Kubiak is a very stupid "HC"....On 3rd-n-4th downs on the Raiders 5yd-line against the second worse rushing-"D" in the NFL he elected to go play-action and throw into the strength of the Raiders "D" with a short field to protect....Coming away without points at this point sealed their loss....
Sunday's game will be interesting to watch and I will hold off on picking Cable as "HC" until after I see the game...
PantyRaider....Interesting Conclusions!!!/_
First off, over my last several posts I never said one word about what Davis will do and what he won't - so don't impute strawmen arguments to me that I'm not making.
Who would ever assert that Davis will never hire a GM? The fact is that he's employed several over his ownership (whether they've actually been given the title or not). Ron Wolf and Bruce Allen to name but two.
Calico, point out where I said that the Raiders won't hire a GM. Seems to me that a month into the season Davis specifically said that he's going to bring in a GM. Whether or not the Raiders hire a GM isn't the argument I'm making. And whether or not I've said it yet, this much is true - that GM will not be given exclusive control over the entire team. If you're waiting for Al Davis to simply go away, go ahead - argue until you're blue, but I'd advise you not to hold your breath.
Seems to me that a lot of folks here said prior to the season that they'd be convinced the team was turning around this year if we managed 6 wins. I called 6 wins no improvement. Contending for the playoffs is improvement.
However, in view of what we went through in the opening month of the season, when Kiffin was fired, I didn't expect a year any better than 2006. We could very easily have 5 wins this season in spite of the turmoil.
Through that time Cable has shown at least one thing. When this team gets it on game day they win. The object with this group is simply to make them get it and KEEP it. There is enough talent currently on this team to win by single-mindedly covering their assignments. A new HC is NOT going to understand that, and neither is a new GM. We'll go right back to square one.
Over the last six seasons, Cable is the only HC that I've seen actually come to grips with what he is dealing with.
Now, you don't have to agree with me about Cable. But RT, you asked for an opinion. If you just wanted me to regurgetate yours back to you, why did you ask?
As for a GM, I guess we could follow the Miami design and hire Bill Parcells to be our GM - oh, wait, that would be tampering. As for Atlanta, the jury is still out. One good season does not a turnaround make. Parcells is the only person I can think of with a consistant record for improving the teams he works for. Many here have called for Jimmy Johnson. Jimmy Johnson is 50-50. He had several great years with the most talented football team in the country (at the time), the Cowboys, but didn't fair so well in Miami.
Hiring a GM is NOT the magic elixer of life.
Blanda, you say that "Over my last several posts I never said one word about what Davis will do and what he won't - so don't impute strawmen arguments to me that I'm not making."
Right below that, you say, "This much is true - that GM will NOT be given exclusive control over the entire team. If you're waiting for Al Davis to simply go away, go ahead - argue until you're blue, but I'd advise you not to hold your breath."
Sounds like you're saying won't do something? I never said Mr. Davis is going away. However, I do give him the respect that he can do whatever he wants--which can include radical change, can it not?
I don't have an issue with your opinion regarding Cable. I took issue with your assertion that hiring a GM and allowing him say in the coaching hire would cause harmful delay (despite other teams wrapping both positions up well before we've even hired coaches in the past), and that parity is not at an all-time high in the NFL. Please re-read my comments.
Blanda, please don't mistake my comments for trying to shut down your opinion. I respect that fact that you have strong one and that you can handle intelligent debate and can talk about football (unlike our dear departed friend from the heartland).
I was done with heartland on his first pass through these pages.
Actually, RT, I'd never think you were trying to shut me up. You're too good of a webmaster for that.
But my point, because I don't think it is yet entirely understood, is that bringing in a GM is fine. And giving him a say in the next hiring of an HC is fine. My argument is that that hiring should not occur this year, before Cable has had the legitimate opportunity to prove himself under the same circumstances that would be presented to an incoming HC.
Cable seems to be a pretty straight up guy. That's why the players respect him. I believe him when he says that he discovered that the losing culture was the unseen elephant in the room, and that losing culture is in the minds of the players. In essence, getting the players to think about team first instead of "me first" is the key to making this team at least competitive.
I've been saying that since 2005. It's the first time I've heard a Raiders' HC say it back to me. If I didn't agree with it now, that would be kind of hypicritcal, don't you think.
One last thing, saying that Davis will not wash his hands of the Raiders until he's carried out of the Alemeda HQ feet first is a no brainer. It deminishes discussion no more than saying the sun will rise tomorrow. If either assertion becomes untrue, the world simply comes to an end, and there is no further discussion about anything.
Perhaps the "Culture-0-Losing" is affecting the fan base more than we realize...Are we so dissatisfied with the product on the field and so use to losing that we now become a bit "Snippy" with each other....
Just imagine if you will how it must feel to the players who are actually in the locker-room....Just as with some of us who spitefully make little attacks at the management or Mis-Management of the team....Is this the same kind of atmosphere that exist in the locker-room that identifies it-self as the "Culture-o-Losing"....
If the "Mediot""s were to tune into this site and read what impression would they get of the "Raider Nation"....
Malcontent....
Dysfunctional..
Cultural Problems...
Inmates Running the Asylum...
So when they report in a slanted why what they here from many of the players are they not just viewing "Natural" feelings of defeat...
I played several sports and was unfortunate enough to play on several losing teams to which I no doubt contributed...From my experience it was those emotional outburst that helped many of us put the losses behind us and get up for the next competition...We fed off of the dismay and celebrated anything that could give us the slightest personal satisfaction...Sometimes that may only be a hit that was put on another player or something that was said...So hearing laughter in a losing locker-room without knowing the context of the laughter is nothing at all...
"Mediot"s will draw the conclusions that support what they personally desire to write...Unfortunately we are not allowed our own reporters who can give us a reliable report of things behind closed doors....So while we hear many negative reports about the ownership of the team we do NOT know the full story or the context of any situation....
Former insiders like Sapp do give us some insight but limited at best...All we have is the final out-put of the team on the score-board and the stats + or -....I do believe there is sufficient evidence to call for "MrD" to please step aside....But I do not believe he has lost it entirely or that the franchise is as bad off as the "Mediot"s and the NFL would like us to believe...
PantyRaider...2 0r 3 Cents Worth!!!!/_
Won't be by until after the weekend, but before I leave for the day I wanted to wish everyone here in Raider Nation and beyond, and to all of your families, the very best that the holiday season can provide. May you all fair well, may the Earth rise to meet your feet, and may the wind be always at your backs.
A small sugestion....
Here is one "Rockey" insider who has his own active blog and let's us in on a few things inside the locker-room....My "Wish-List" Player from the "08" Draft...."McFabulas"....
http://www.yardbarker.com/users/DarrenMcFadden/
activity
PantyRaider....Still Pimping!!!/_
I think any discussion regarding Cable has to include the development of the team as much as the record. Russell has taken his lumps, but he is farther ahead than he would have been throwing the ball a dozen times a game under Kiffin. He needed that more than most due to the fewer number of starts he had in college. When you compare Russell, a 2 year starter who came out early, against Cutler, who had around 40 college starts, or Ryan, a fifth year senior, it's obvious that was needed for his development. I compare against those two, as they've had the most success as young QBs, but popular thought is that more college experience equals greater chance of pro success. While Russell has had some atrocious games, he is better for it, and whatever success he has will come quicker as a result.
Henderson is now starting as well, and the lack of penalties and the increased number of catches for Miller indicate that he is starting to become effective. Higgins has also shown big play ability as a receiver, which is also a function of having Russell throw more.
I don't know how much input he had on it, but Hall was released after Cable took the reins as well.
He has had failures, but I think those are somewhat understandable. McFadden's injury, along with the need to develop Russell, limited his availability, and Cable was a couple of games late in increasing his workload. The fake field goal call against KC was foolish and unnecessary. I don't think the McFadden thing was costly, as we KNOW what we have there. With so few leaders on the team, you have to respect guys like Fargas, who play the game the right way. I think you have to allow him to start and play as an example to the younger guys on the team. Although I disagree with the KC call, I can see the gadget plays as ways to inspire the team, for the coach to show confidence, and for the players to gain confidence in themselves.
The defense has been horrible - no doubt - but I don't know how much we can pin on Cable. Poor offensive performance and Ryan's coaching are surely a factor there.
We shouldn't discount the loyalty factor either. Having a coach who wants to be here, and who is willing to work with Davis, should not be quickly discounted. I agree he likely would not get a head coaching gig in the NFL should we dump him, but that shouldn't be the question. "Can he develop the talent" and "can he change the culture" are the two most important things at this time. Any GM that comes in (which we do need) will need to assess the situation and prioritize changes. Cable could easily be part of that equation.
If we beat Tampa Bay we'll have two December wins, and back-to-back wins, which hasn't happened in a long time. If they play that effectively Cable warrants a shot. It may be that the start of the "forceful change" happened a couple of months ago, and we won't see the benefits until next season. The offseason starts Sunday!
BR: You are right. You didn't specifically say whether or not Davis will hire a GM. However your post gave the impression that you thought it would be difficult to hire a GM immediately following the season. You also implied that it is 'ok' for a GM to come on board later rather than sooner.
You wrote, "this much is true - that GM will not be given exclusive control over the entire team. "
I agree. What I've been suggesting for quite a long time now is that a newly hired GM and HC need to form a true partnership with Davis.
Each leader has different roles to play but collectively and collaboratively, these 3 leaders exert their influence to (a) rebuild the team (b) change the culture of the team.
To insist that it is the players' lack of accountability as the root cause for the losing culture is complete rubbish and you know it.
The players should be held accountable by their respective position coaches and HC. If the player is unproductive, has a bad attitude, a poor work ethic ... the player should be shown the door.
Accountability is maintained through a chain of command or hiearchy of leaders.
If you believe that the hiring of a GM is a "radical change" ... you might be partially true when it comes to the Raiders. This in itself makes it crystal clear just how dysfunctional the organization has been the last few years.
Think about it ...
Having an executive GM as one of the key leaders of an NFL organization is the norm for the other 31 teams. Yet we are here discussing it like it is a "radical" idea ... debating it's importance; discussing if/when the GM should come on board; talking about the vacancy like it is no big deal.
BR: The notion that a newly hired GM and HC puts us "at square one" is dubious. I'm sick and tired of half baked, half ass, irregular measures to put a band aid on a gaping wound. What I want is "Tangible, forceful change" which to me means hiring a GM to help Davis out and get our house in order ... it means giving the GM real authority to bring in his own HC.
Some of you seem to be grasping for the "stability branch" as a means for justifying keeping Cable as HC. Yes, stability is vital for success. The real solution however would be to allow the new GM to hire his own HC and give this partnership a 3 year plan to rebuild the team into a playoff caliber winner.
Some of you seem to be grasping for the "improvement branch" to justify keeping Cable as HC. This is delusional. All you need to do is carefully examine his 11 games as HC to realize their is no tangible improvement or progress for anything more than 1 game.
Here is a summary:
Cable as HC
L 3 to 34 at NO
W 16 to 13 vs NYJ OT
L 10 to 29 at Balt
L 0 to 24 vs Atl
L 6 to 17 vs Car
L 15 to 17 at Mia
W 31 to 10 at Den
L 13 to 20 vs KC
L 7 to 34 at SD
L 26 to 49 vs NE
W 27 to 16 vs Hou
We were blown out by NO, Balt, Atl, SD, and NE by margins of 31, 19, 24, 27, 23. That is 5 major blow outs in 11 games under Cable.
We have had 4 game and 3 game losing streaks under Cable. If you were to break up the season into quarters, Cable has a 1 win in each quarter of the season (his 2nd, 7th, and 11th games).
Sorry folks but our nice victory over the Texans followed 2 games in which the game was decided in the 1st quarter (at SD, vs NE). This is not competitive football. Under Cable's leadership the Raiders have shown no consistency from week to week. No victory has been followed with a good performance.
Bottom Line: Cable was an interim HC for a reason. He has not earned the right to come back as HC in 2009. He is a loyal, hard working OLine Coach ... nothing more, nothing less.
StickUm25..........
I enjoyed your comments and if cable can bring home a victory Sunday I am in agreement with your post...
If NOT...I have to reject him and side unfortunately with "Calicojack"....But I would consider Cable for the "OC"-n-"OLC" because he brings the excitement back to Raider football and I think the players enjoy the change of style and aggressiveness in the play book....
CalicoJack....
I would read Cables record just a little different although I did not get to watch those games....
I would say the 1st game was understandable and the second was a fluke win where he got the players up for it....After that reality set in and the team tanked the next 3 weeks...
During this stretch I believe the team started to buy into the hope of a possible play-off because of the poor play in the rest of the AFCW....
L 15 to 17 at Mia
W 31 to 10 at Den
L 13 to 20 vs KC
Now it was back in the tank as the players realized it really was over...
Last weeks game and this Sunday's game are being played without hope of a future reward....They are going out and lying it on the line now for themselves and their coach and that speaks very loud to me...I believe Cable has managed to motivate a losing team to play their hearts out just as if we were still in it....
This is the real meaning of "Pride-n-Poise"...
Now we will have to wait and see Sunday who is correct....But if Cable can pull this off I for one will start addressing him as "Coach Cable" and give him all my personal support....He will have given me something to look forward to in "09"....Hope in the face of complete despair is a very valuable commodity...
PantyRaider...Just Do-It Baby!!!!/_
hey everyone, just want to wish you and yours a very MERRY CHRISTMAS and a HAPPY NEW YEAR! May PEACE be with you all!
Go Raiders!
"The cable guy" is the HC of the fidas future! He's got everything going for himself....He's a certified big al (MR.) davis yes man, he's proven he can have his lips surgically attached to the "genius'" ass, and he has beaten the previously unbeatable TEXANS! I say that makes him prime faida HC matterial! I will tell you that the faidas WILL lose to the BUCS this weekend , so don't get your hearts broken when your faidas go 4-12 AGAIN!!!!!! Just cover your heads and roll up into a ball babies, keep defending the "nation"...
Merry Christmas & Happy Holidays!
Festivities are well under way at the nyraider household, but I thought I'd take a moment to wish my Raider brethren the very best for this holiday season, plus offer this little tidbit:
Todays’ sports section had a little blurb on Mike Singletary and the whiners. Interestingly, Singletary has amassed four wins in his last five games as interim coach for an overall 6-9 record.
According to the Sac B, Singletary acknowledged meeting with the team’s top brass last week to talk about his future. Singletary laid out a plan for the team that wowed the club’s leadership, which will likely announce Singletary’s appointment next week (after the season ends).
Folks, this isn’t rocket science. It’s pretty obvious that the Raiders have no leadership and no direction on any level. I know many of you think wheels are turning behind closed doors; however, I’m afraid the lights are on, but nobody’s home.
Happy Holidays!
Merry Christmas to the entire Raiders family!
---Jeff
All I want for Christmas is a GM and a head coach and a three-year plan built around players of character. Is that too much to ask, Santa?
If so, at least I've still got my Raider Take family.
Merry Christmas to all!
Merry Christmas to all.
I hope all of the RT crew and Raider fans around the world have an amazing new year.
Best Wishes,
Calico Jack
MERRY XMAS TO ALL !!!!!
calico,
sure there have been blowouts, but it's not all cables fault.
the poor man is saddled with the worst DC i can ever remember, rob ryan.
plus, jruss, only in the last few games is coming into his own.
i like what i've seen against denver & tex, but yeah, i need the tamps win to be sold totally.
Wishing everyone at Raider Take a Merry Christmas and A Happy New Year too.
Hopefully Santa will bring us an early gift and get us a new GM and new HC and better players on both sides of the ball.
Hey better yet.....how about a New Owner as well......oh well....at least we can still wish.
Mr. Duva
NYRaider...
Interesting...Good point about no-body home....
CalicoJack....
One more point about the losing streek in the middle of Cable's tenure....
L 10 to 29 at Balt
L 0 to 24 vs Atl
L 6 to 17 vs Car
Correct me if I'm wrong but 2 of these games featured "AW" at "QB"...NOT "JRus"....
I think "JRus" has shown evidence that he is an NFL "QB" but it has not been consistent enough to to sell everyone on him....This week's game is huge for the kid and I hope he shows up to play as well as the rest of the young talent on the team....
On the other hand "AW" has shown he is not even a suitable back-up...
PantyRaider...Beer's To Ya All!!!/_
EXCEPT..."Faida" Boy and his "Shadow"s....
Sitting here drinking a beer and looking at the SF Rag Coaching Prospects....There are a few that seam interesting...
Reportedly Jim Fassel has already made contact with "MrD" asking for the job....
http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders/ci_11295983
PantyRaider...Your Wish-List???/_
Bill Cowher-n-Josh McDaniels would top mine....
After weeks of casual reading, and not a single word typed in reply, I thought I'd break the silence for two reasons.
1) It's Christmas, after all. In this season of peace and good will toward men, I would be remiss to not join my brothers here at RT in wishing all a Merry Christmas.
2) Heartland's initial arguments requires but one reply, in my humble opinion. There isn't a soul here, especially those of us who have been here from the beginning of this community, that isn’t willing to eat the sh*t sandwich that is the 2008 season. But let's be honest. It's a sh*t sandwich. Calling it anything else, or calling us fair weather fans for asking a cold beer to wash it down is simply unfair.
Peace brothers, and as we've said time and time again, it's just a game. May we truly find peace, as the Angels promised. If the Raiders can win a three or more Superbowls along the way, that would be fantastic!
PR:
The point I was trying to make about Cable is that there hasn't been 1 time this year where the Raiders have played well in back to back games.
There has been no level of consistency from week to week. Cable took over in October. He has 1 win in each month (NY Jets Oct; Den in Nov; Hou in Dec).
I was very pleased with the efforts and execution of the young guns last week.
The question is whether Cable is the right guy to get max effort and execution out of our young nucleus on a regular basis.
Progress and tangible improvement has yet to be established under Cable's watch.
In 5 of his 11 games, the Raiders were not even remotely competitive never mind wins and losses.
L 3 to 34 at NO
L 10 to 29 at Balt
L 0 to 24 vs Atl
L 7 to 34 at SD
L 26 to 49 vs NE
In the other 3 losses, the Raiders offense either couldn't move the ball or Cable made a bone head decision.
L 6 to 17 vs Car (no TDs)
L 15 to 17 at Mia (1 ST TD)
L 13 to 20 vs KC (1 TD)
That is 5 blowouts plus 3 games where the offense scored a grand total of 1 TD.
It goes deeper than the final scores. This team has been completely anemic when it comes to first half scoring, which falls on the coaching. A big part of first half scoring includes plays that are scripted by the coaches prior to the game. Essentially, the coaches, given game films and several days of preparation, just can’t get it right, game after game. They haven’t even learned from their own mistakes.
Plus, IMO, key players have been grossly underutilized. For example, Fargas has 1 TD for the entire season, or 1 TD in 212 carries (that’s got to be an NFL low). McFadden has 4 TDs in 112 carries, and could have done so much more if used properly.
Plus, with the receiving skills of MacFadden and Michael Bush, it has been a complete mystery why Fargas remains in on 3rd downs. Fargas has 10 receptions this year, or about 0.62 per game. In limited play (and hardly ever on 3rd down), MacFadden has 27 receptions.
There is so much more to point at, but it falls on Cable to make these corrections, and so far he really hasn’t.
Retaining Cable might bring continuity; but continuity could cost us another lost season next year. It’s time to make a smart choice at head coach.
Cable himself kinda admitted he has to try and get two back to back games put together for a chance to be HC next year. And I agree with NYR that there are lotsa head scratching things about Cable that I just don't get. Fargas is hands down one of the worst 3rd down or goal line RB's I have ever seen, and yet he is always in there. But if it's the choice of someone that at least has shown glimpses of greatness, and another retread, last-gasp former HC like Fossell, I think I would take my chances with Cable.
I've seen too many of the last-gasp coaches do miserably on the Raider sidelines, and I think its because the players know he is only there because he can't get a job anywhere else. I'd rather see another young guy like Kiffin again, or Cable, and I doubt we will see another young guy for awhile after the Great Kiffin/Al meltdown.
Gary....
We are in agreement again....Strange things happening this season....
One young coach (32) who seams interesting is Josh McDaniels "OC" "NE"....
Aside from him Bill Cowher is the only "REAL" coach out there who could come in a make an absolute difference for this team....The problem is he will have several offers on the table and given tremendously more power and a higher salary than he could ever get in OakTown....So we can all scratch that one off the "Wish-List"....
CalicoJack....
I agree consistency is the problem and if he can't show it this week he is off my list of legitimate candidates for "HC"...I believe he understands that also...Will the players show up and play for his job...Critical question....
My wish list after the "HC" is answered....
"WR" Larry Fitzjerald who was franchised last year and on my "Wish-List"...
91-rec 1301-yds 14.3-avg 10-tds
"DT" Albert Hainsworth who was also franchised last year and on my "WishList"....
51-tkls 8-sks 3-fmb rec....
Micheal "DogMan" Vick because he can play and we need a back-up "QB"...He will also serve us as an additional "WR"...."Slash"....
PantyRaider...Sunday Tells It All!!!/_
PS....
If Cable can't get it together and Cowher-n-McDaniels are "NO-Show"s for an interview than my vote has to go for "SOB"-Rex "HC"....
"SOB"-Rob "DC"....
Cable "OLC"-n-Assistant "OC"....
PantyRaider....Re-Treds Available!!!/_
Honestly, there have been plenty of players and coaches alike that were successful on other teams before and after joining the Raiders, but failed miserably while with the Raiders. (It used to be the opposite when the Raiders could take a castoff and make him a star.) Much of this recent phenomenon has to do with a steady and now long-standing deterioration of the Raiders' leadership, ala Al Davis, and the lack of an effective general manager.
As many of you have pointed out, the Raiders most successful runs have come with a GM, or even quasi GM in place.
Sunday's game will be over in just a matter of hours now, as will the Raiders sixth consecutive miserable season. Is there even a whisper that Davis is considering interviewing for a GM?
NYRaider.....
"ScuttleButt" is all we will ever get out of the Raider Organization...Secrecy is the name of the game...."Talk-n-You Walk" should be the slogan but I have never heard it said...."Loyalty" is stated repeatedly but how does that apply to the fans....
At some point I would like a little more open door to the organization for the faithful Fan-Base but "Paranoia" seams to prevail....Don't hold your breath waiting....It will just turn you blue....
PantyRaider...It Is What It Is!!!/_
PantyRaider,
i agree with you.
what secrets do the raiders have worth keeping ?
the secret on how to become the worst team in sports ?
i don't think to many people are sneaking around raiderland, wondering, "just how does al do it ?".
it's crazy. if anything, we should tell our great secrets to all the top teams in league, and watch'em sink like stones.
Agreed. The Raiders can't possibly have any secrets worth keeping. Add to that, their lack of transparency, avoidance of public relations and vindictive behavior, and what has it gotten us?
Kiffin was right about the "whole building."
moshbucket said...
I didn't realize Fitz was a FA. That would be an AWSOME pickup.
We wouldn't have to worry about a WR with an early pick.
If we could get an OT or a DE (not sure what's available) with the first pick, and Caldwell (Center form AL) with the second, that would do me just fine.
Heartland? WTF? Go away. The locals have covered this in depth.
On coaching, I think one of the reason's Al put Cable in as HC is that he was the only guy on staff that would actually accept going back to his original position.
I like Cable. People keep saying "bonehead" calls, but he's just agressive. Sure he's green as hell as a playcaller. I like running the fakes if the oponent is in the correct formation. I still think Seabass makes it on that fake if he executes correctly (he took off to early so the rusher could read it). Don't bother replying to this, I know 90% of you disagree :-)
If we get a new coach, there's no telling. Maybe Cower or Mooch or someone takes it as a challenge, but I have a feeling Al is going to be looking for the next big find.
-moshbucket
I'm sure that Toyota is working overtime to figure out GM's secrets. I hear that Apple's iPod division is trying to solve the incredible mysteries of the Zune. New Belgium Brewing Company is obsessed with discovering Meisterbrau's secret ingredient. Martha Stewart is trying to reverse engineer the recipes of Chef Boyardee. And the Steelers are tapping the phone lines in the Raiders draft room.
Paranoia and bad judgment reared its ugly head last year when Jordan wasn't cut to allow Bush to join the active roster.
When you have been a bottom dwelling team, the last thing you should be worrying about is the possiblility of a division rival scooping up Jordan. Who the F cares?
The only thing that should ever concern the Raiders is getting their own shit together. Stop worrying about things that have zero impact on your own team's fortunes.
Everything should revolve around finding a way to improve and upgrade the support system, the personnel, and the leadership team. Period. Nothing else matters.
When you start to win on a consistent basis, the goals of improving and upgrading the support system, the personnel, and the leadership team continues until you hoist the Lombardi trophy high in the air.
Some folks on this board have implied that "we are not that far off". When your team has not won back to back games 1 single time, has had a 3 game losing streak, a 4 game losing streak, and another 3 game losing streak ... yes, you are that far off. When your team hasn't won more than 5 games in a single frickin' season, you are that far off.
I can't emphasize this enough ... until we have a solid plan in place that includes a new GM and HC, we will continue to struggle to win 5 games.
I wish I believed that Cable was the right guy to put us in the best position to win in 2009 but the fact remains that he has not demonstrated the type of leadership that results in quauntifiable, consistent progress.
It has been 1 step forward and 3 back, 1 step forward and 4 steps back, 1 step forward and 3 steps back.
All the reasons to bring him back are hollow and would not carry any weight whatsoever for any other team in the NFL.
He is a nice guy.
He is a loyal guy.
He gets along with Al.
He is positive with the media.
He is a fan of the Raiders.
Would any of these characteristics get you a HC gig with any other NFL team? No.
What this team requires is a hard charging, strong leader, who is capable and qualified to set a new tone and culture. It will require a guy who won't take "no" as an answer from Al whenever he wants to exert change or his will. Everyone knows full well the history of Raider HCs who have rolled over for Al. As soon as a HC rolls over for AL, you can bank on that HC either (1) being a loser (2) getting canned after 1 season (3) getting no respect from the locker room.
Calico - all excellent points.
While I agree with it, I might take minor exception to this statement... “It will require a guy who won't take "no" as an answer from Al whenever he wants to exert change or his will.”
Isn’t this what got Kiffin fired “for cause”? Davis puts a provision in the HC contract that the HC must answer to the General Partner. On the surface that might make sense, since Al owns the team, but when it interferes with the normal functions of the HC and his ability to successfully perform his job, as it did with Kiffin, then it’s abuse of power.
As for bad decisions, they are endless; and it doesn’t take hindsight to see. Not releasing Jordan to advance the development of Michael Bush was, IMO, a colossal mistake. What’s worse, Michael Bush still isn’t getting playing time. A former Heisman candidate and potential early first round pick before his injury, Bush should be splitting carries with McFadden on a team that’s 4-11. What the F are the Raiders thinking?
That falls on what I said before; even though the Chiefs appear (to some) to be a worse team than the Raiders, the Chiefs are a full year ahead of the Raiders in their development because they understand where they are and they have a plan. The Raiders, conversely, have no clue. Davis probably thinks he can just retool and come back next year and make a run at the playoffs.
Meanwhile, after six horrendous seasons, the Raiders can’t even play competitive football with any consistency. I’m dying to know where we stand in the GM hiring process!!!
NYR: The point I was trying to make with,
"It will require a guy who won't take "no" as an answer from Al whenever he wants to exert change or his will.”
is that what the Raiders really need at HC is a very skilled leader. A leader who is able to use diplomacy, tact, guile, forcefulness, and all the necessary tools as a means to an end.
Kiffin was not a skilled leader especially when it came to tact while Gruden clearly knew it was tricky dealing with Al but he found a way to exert his will.
The difference between the 2 leaders (Kiffin vs. Gruden) among many is that Gruden had a buffer in Allen while Kiffin did not.
CalicoJack....
The only guy out there that fits your description and is available as "HC" is Bill Cowher....Reportedly he will demand extensive power and a very high salary and get it...So right off the bat that leaves us out in the cold again...
Unfortunately and Realistically....
We will have to settle for....
Retread who wants another chance...
Young coach who needs a "Stepping Stone" in the NFL...
Coach on our staff who is promoted...
OR...We go after "SOB"-Rex as "HC" and unite him with his "Twin"....
"Paranoia" is the Plague of the Raider Organization and "Loyalty" otherwise known as "Talk-n-ya-Walk" is evidently the ma-do behind closed doors...."SOB" has proven very loyal threw the years and so survives even though he can't coach a "D" worth fielding...By deduction....If "SOB"-Rob has that character than surely his twin "SOB"-Rex will also....Thus he is the logical choice to come in a take over where NO-one else worthy will...
What do we get out of it....
Immediate help for our disgusting "D" that should now field a top "10" unit and give the "O" a chance to win games....
A "HC" who totally understands "D"s and should also understand how to attack one....
Possibly a Dynamic set of Twins who work well together....
Continuity on the "O" so the specialty players don't have to retrain and learn a new system....
Return of a "ST" unit that played much better than any in the recent past...
Perhaps a "Hard-Ass" "HC" that will demand the players go out and play the damn game for one complete hour on Sundays....
Or perhaps another losing effort by yet another underachieving Raider teams who should never waist our time taking the field...
PantyRaider....Who the Hell Knows!!!/_
Calico, I am not going to judge how far out we are from being a playoff team until I see what actually happens in the off season... and also, to a lesser extent, what happens tomorrow... especially with JRuss. If he plays well tomorrow, or even better, has another career game, I don't think we will be that far off at all.
Were Atlanta and Miami any less further away from being good than we are, at this time last year? I don't think so.
Miami hit the lottery by picking up Pennington off the waiver wire or they would not be anywhere this year, and Atlanta hit the lottery with Matt Ryan.
A good coach and strong GM will do a lot towards next year, but it will all be for naught until we get a consistently good QB.
..to finish... if Jruss has another 10-30 performance and the entire team mails it in again... I'm not so sure anything will matter what we do for coaching/GM next year.
They keep saying that JRuss has turned a corner... I want to see it more than once a month.
Calico - your Kiffin/Gruden analogy is a good one. Clearly, Kiffin lacked the skill he needed to effectively communicate with Davis. Conversely, Gruden had a huge advantage over Kiffin with Allen to act as a buffer.
Gary - Russell has the tools. He just needs to refine them.
Honestly, I'm not expecting too much tomorrow. The Bucs will be fighting for their life, and the Raiders can either show up or not show up. Either way, what we do Sunday should have little or no impact on next year (we've already buried that bone).
What we need is a little pride and poise to get us through tomorrow.
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO DAVIS HIRES AS HC, IT WILL BE THE SAME BS. THIS CRAP HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR THE PAST 35 YEARS, IT'S NEVER GOING TO CHANGE, AS LONG AS DAVIS IS STILL ALIVE. SATAN, PLEASE TAKE THIS OLD BASTARD AWAY, FOR GOOD!!!!!!!
NY, Russells game tomorrow is only important in that he needs to develop consistency before he is anywhere close to being a person that can change this franchise.
He played great last week, not so bad vs NE, medicre vs SD.
Going out with a horrible game might indicate last week was a fluke, and set his confidence back again... two great games in a row, especially in a winning effort could set this franchise in the right direction! TWO WINS IN A ROW WITH TWO GREAT QB EFFORTS! When is the last time we have done that? Last year we lost 4 in row to end the season... the years before 8 in a row, 6 in a row, 2 in a row, 2 in a row.
We've averaged 4 losses in a row to finish every season since the SB... winning two in a row isn't important right now?
BEAT CHUCKY DAMMITALLL!!!
I have no doubt in my mind that Russell has started to turn the corner.
The real question is whether or not Davis turns the corner this off season by making the type of management decisions that will support Russell in particular and the team in general.
If I'm the owner making the calls, after today's game I...
-Show Ryan the door.
-Hire a qualified GM and allow him to pick his own staff.
-Have the GM interview and hire a HC.
-Make sure the HC is allowed to pick his own staff.
I might discuss with my new GM my desire to release some dead weight on the player roster and possibly trade Fargas, but leave these moves and all other player personnel moves up to the GM and his HC.
Then, as owner, I would focus on the upcoming stadium lease expiration and the possible renewal of that lease or relocation of the team. Also, work with the other owners on collective bargaining issues. I will leave the football operations to my qualified hires. However, I would like a ringside seat for the draft, while providing little to zero input on draft selections.
After all, the stadium lease and collective bargaining are full-time work for any normal owner and his/her team of lawyers.
PS I neglected to mention to have my GM make a priority out of signing Shane Lechler and Nnamdi Asomugha. Apparently, both players have cleaned out their lockers prior to the Bucs game, so perhaps neither expects to come back to Oakland. Can't hardly blame them, after all the drama and BS they've been subjected to....
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I have no doubt in my mind that Russell has started to turn the corner.
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Holy crap... CJ is more optimistic than I am?
Ok, this pumps me up! Go Raiders!!!
Well....1st quarter is a very conservative one....Seems both coaches are worried about their jobs "09"....Let the other team make the mistakes....Raiders "D" is playing well so far but don't hold your breath....
PantyRaider....Conservatives????/_
"TD"-"TD"-"TD" Raiders....
Finally Bush get's in the game and just look at what he can do....."Brain-Dead" NOT to play him a long olng time ago....What could we have been...Posibly a "Play-Off" contender had we been coached to win...
So as to how far off we are as a good team....That will depend entirerly on the front office and the coaches...The players can do it....
PantyRaider Why So Late!!!/_
I've never understood the Fargas obsession. He rarely scores touchdowns, and never scores them the way Bush just did.
Fargas has seven CAREER touchdowns. Dominic Rhodes has six this year alone for the Colts, yet he couldn't even get touches in Oakland until everyone was hurt.
Well like I said...Don't hold your breath...That "D" will fail....
Thanks "SOB"...You "SUCK"...
PantyRaider...7-7
2:00 Warning......7-7....
What are they warning about...You coaches will both lose your jobs....
PantyRaider....Hope So!!!'_
"TD"..."TD"...."TD"...Raiders....
Now if we only had a "D"....
PantyRaider....Excited Again!!!/_
I don't believe I have said one good thing about Al Davis this year, that's about to change.
Hiring Lofton to be the wide recievers coach was a good decision. The young wide receivers are starting to come on. That has to speak to a years worth of coaching.
Great game so far, but can someone tell me: why does Cable keep calling short-yardage plays on third and long against a quick defense?
"O" That "D" "SUCK"s...
Should have been an "INT" and NO "TD"....
24-14....The "Melt-Down" has begun...
So much for hope...."SOB" must go...
2 "Int"s in a row by the rookie "QB" who feels he must carry he team when he is NOT yet ready....
PantyRaider...Nest Year Baby!!!/_
I don't know if I believe this...My Raiders have fought back and scored on "O" and the "D" made the "INT" to take the ball back....Can this really be my Raiders doing this...
Someone must have spiked my beer I'm "Hallucinating"...
PantyRaider...Reality????/_
2:00 Warning...28-24 3rd-n-Goal...
"Chucky" go look for a new job....Your finished...
PantyRaider...Celebration Time????/_
Can you believe this shit...We won....We won against the #9 "D" we won....
Where the hell is that fat little "FaidaBoy"...Crying in the corner...
PantyRaider....Celebration....We have hope!!!/_
PantyRaider, you're friggin' killin'!
LOL
---Jeff
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