Priceless
Seeing Jon Gruden's and Monte Kiffin's faces at the end of this game was priceless. Bravo to the Raiders offense, and even to Caveman Ryan and crew for a largely stout performance on defense.
Perhaps Michael Bush will finally get some carries in 2009? Bush now has three touchdowns on 95 career carries, very few of which have come near the goal line. Meanwhile, Fargas has just seven touchdowns on 700 career carries.
With a smart draft, solid executive and coaching hires, and an avoidance of boneheaded free agent signings (in the vein of DeAngelo Hall and Javon Walker), we just might be able to do something with this end-of-season momentum.
posted by Raider Take at 1:11 PM
276 Comments:
I just hope we can build on this during the offseason.
Out-friggin'-standing win!
---Jeff
When was the last time the Raiders had a 4th quarter come from behind win? Awesome!
By the way, just got home from holiday travels and wanted to comment on last weeks home win. Was at the game and had a great time. Compared with the game I went to last year (against KC), the Raiders showed a lot more energy. Raider fans are great, I've never seen such a happy crowd of people.
This is a team we can build on, as long as someone does not screw it up!
JF
What can we say....
What could this team have been with coaching to win from the beginning....Bush in the game instead of on the bench...
At 5-11 we are only 3 games out of 1st place....With the right coaching I have NO reason to believe this team could not have been at least 8-8 and hope for the Play-Offs....
So how far from being a winning franchise are we as asked this week....Damn Close I would say if we can get this team coached to win...
So for now I will hope for "SD" to knock off the "Donko"s and hope all the AFCW coaches get run...NO more "ShanaRat"-Turner-Edwards....With all the other teams in a coaching turmoil the Raiders could be in a position to come out on top....
We have the talent to win in this league...But we desperately need "Coaching-to-Win" in OakTown...
What is the answer...Frankly I don't know...But at this point I know there is hope....And Hope is a very valuable commodity to hold onto at this low point in Raider history....
Beers to ya and here's looking forward to "09"...And looking back to what could and should have been...
PantyRaider....Exuberant at the End!!!/_....
I've been wondering all season why they don't get Bush more touches. McFadden is explosive in the Reggie Bush mold, but looking at all the injuries this season I'm not sure he can be the every-down back. Maybe if he can stay healthy. Fargas runs hard, but Bush runs hard AND OVER people. We'll need a good OC to fully utilize their talents.
Schilens and Higgins have stepped up big time, almost to the point where WR may not be such a glaring need in the draft. Do we keep Walker and hope for improvement, or do we cut our losses and take the cap hit?
If these last two games are indicative of what we can look forward to next season, we can finally address OL, DL, and maybe even snag Maualuga at LB. I'd hate to see him playing for San Diego and pounding on us.
I still want a GM. I'm also hoping that Asomugha and Lechler will be inclined to stay with the team finishing strong to close out the season. All things being relative finishing 5-11.
Twos the eve before breakfast when all threw his house
the maggots were stirring while eating a mouse…
Amused with excitement while pissing his pants
“FaidaBoy” proceeds to publish his childish rants….
“Mama! Mama!” Exclaimed the fat roly-poly
“Tis the season fat boys be jolly”
Sadistic Clause with his night flying flock
gifted to “FaidaBoy” a stained yellow jock
Now draped across his filthy fat chin
the cup covers his disgusting grin
“Mama! Mama!” Exclaims the fat little chump
“Chin strap -n- nose guard Super Bowl champ”
While dancing and prancing threw the open door
left foot entangled he thumps to the floor
KerrrrSmash! goes his head like a sack of old bricks
the mildewed pine planks now swarming with ticks
“Waaa! Waaa!” cries the fat boy with a nose full of puss
it covers his keyboard when speaking to us
His diaper is twisted and sagging and wet
pooh-pooh boy wearing a jock full of sweat
Blood now mixes with green yellow snought
the colors of Christmas these are not
He wipes his fat face with the back of his hand
and sits down in front of a computer stand
The shitty black ooze upon his computer bench
invades cyberspace with a disgusting stench
He wipes across his old monitor screen
Leaving behind the worst smear ever seen
“PantySmella” he begins to write
“FaidaBoy” squirming and gleaming in delight
He reaches down and scratches a baby boy sack
pretending as a man ready to attack
The gooey black ooze that now covers his hand
will stick to the keys leading to computer land
Upset and in terror that the Raiders might win
he sits there wearing a shit eating grin
Now trying to hang out with the “Men in Black”
a childish weak little mind tries to attack
Dreaming of being in “Cubical Heaven”
“FaidaBoy” desperately tries to get even……
PantyRaider....Up Your Ass AnoAss!!!/_
Very nice win today! Hands down. I haven't watched a single game in weeks because I couldn't bare the sight of what has become of our storied franchise.
Hopefully we can build upon this going into the off season and add to what was displayed on the field today.
Two wins in a row, played good football, solid play on all sides of the ball, kicked the Bucs out of their playoff hopes, and Al gets to smile sticking it right where he wants to in the Bucs rear end.
A lot of changes must happen this off season. A new GM has to #1 in my book. And a solid HC. Now that being said, I do like Cable and would like to see some continuity with this organization. But does Al want to keep him? That's the real question. I believe Al may again look for someone young. Either the Pat's OC or Jim Harbaugh.
But then again who's crazy enough to want to coach for the Raiders?
Maybe Cable does stay.
But before anything else happens. A GM is the # 1 priority, everything is secondary because without a competent GM we will have more losses next year.
Mr. Duva
One other positive in the last few games of this season (including a couple of losses) is that the penalty numbers are much lower. Discipline was an issue underlying much of the Raider's woes since 2002 and it's nice to see that, win or lose, it's not because the team is being foolish and killing themselves with 100+ penalty yards a game.
I hope Bush wasn't on display for trade bait. Poor guy went out exhausted (perhaps injured) and the Raiders took a TO and brought him back in. Why weren't Fargas and McFadden playing?
Trade Fargas!
I'm not ready to jump on the Cable bandwagon, and hope that Ryan didn't do enough in this game to fulfill his destiny to wipe Al's but for life.
I am disappointed in Russell, who seems to have a ball slip out of his hands in every game (The Dante Culpepper syndrome). Otherwise, the intentional grounding was major bonehead play, and the interception was awful, but kudos to the big man for making that tackle (and putting a hurt on the Bucs player).
The other Russell issue is minor, but a vet QB would have quick-snapped the play before Gruden challenged the interception. I've seen Farve and P Manning do that plenty of times.
Otherwise, back-to-back victories feels good. First road win in Dec since like 1920. This win will taste even better if Dallas loses.
I don't think I have to look it up to figure out that our "feature back" all season will end up third of our RB's in YPC... WTF??? Where was Bush all season? Saving him for game 16? Do I have to look it up to see if Fargas has ever had a 180 yard, 2 TD performance in his career? Nope... we all know it has never happened.
Kinda aggravating that people have to get injured in order for our best players to be on the field.
Other than that, I guess I think Cable should get rehired again... I like his play calling for the most part (unlike "BUY A BLITZ ON 3RD DOWN, SOB") and he has JRuss playing pretty well.
This team has hope!!
Great win Raiders!!!
If Asum and Lechler bolt I hope its to overrated teams that are on their way DOWN!!! I wouldn't bolt this team right now if I were them!!!
>>>
Why weren't Fargas and McFadden playing?
>>>
Both injured.
Luckily for the Raiders actually... he might have been cut to make room for our All-pro, premier RB Fargas next year.
Early 2009 Wish List:
GM: Fassel
HC: Cable
DC: Anyone other than Rob Ryan.
OT: Gross (Carolina) or Tausher (GB) or BOTH
WR: Crabbtree (TTU)
And this goes without saying, keep Nnamdi, Lechler, & Bush.
Very satisfying end to an otherwise miserable season.
This was "Statement Game" win. Nothing, really, to play for except pride and a job next year.
The last such statement game that comes to mind was the 1999 season finale v the Chiefs. Chiefs win and they win the AFC West. Raiders win and Chiefs are out and Seahawks win AFC West.
Gruden had a hand in that one also - as the winning coach. It was the start of the fabolous 3 year run of AFC West Titles.
Keep Cable guy? I'd be ok with that.
But SOB simply has to go.
RT: you run the best blog in the NFL world - I for one hope you continue to bring your unique and honest perpesctive to us Raider fans.
I must say, outstanding job by our young receivers (and not just today). These guys, namely Schilens and Higgins, make fools of our vets, Walker and Curry... both of whom should be shown the door.
Next year we can sign Carter again (he said wants to come back) and add one or two WRs through the draft and FA.
Also, another great performance by both Higgins and Miller in returns.
Jerry McDonald makes a strong case to hire Cable.
http://tinyurl.com/8oryx4
The continuity factor and keeping players like Nnamdi Asomugha and Shane Lechler on board may be worth a try.
The key, as Jerry points out, will be swift action by Al Davis. Not sure how a GM factors into Jerry's plan, but we may be wasting our time and typing with any notion that Davis will hire a GM anyway.
I'm not sure what happened different to this team the last 2 weeks but I gotta say I'm really happy about it. Alot of the credit has to go to Cable and I think Al wood be foolish to disregard this progress and change directions again. Gotta forget the KC debacle and chalk it up to a learning experience.I really respect most of the opinions and the general football knowledge in this site, however can the Fargas bashing please stop. The guy has about 2000 yards rushing the last 2 seasons with lousy teams and himself only playing about 12 games a season. I agree Bush and McFadden gotta get the bulk of the touches now. But this guy Fargas has been a true Raider. Playing hard all the time with injuries and managing to get results. I know he's not Bo Jackson or Marcus Allen (he's not a glamour guy) but Jesus he has played his ass off the last 2 seasons. So lets just tip our hat to the guy and I'm sure the rest will take care of itself as far as playing time and touches. Afterall there's people alot more deserving of our anger the last 2 seasons.
RaiderMike
Personally, I wouldn't say a word about Fargas if we didn't have BOTH Bush and McF on roster. My problem isn't with Fargas, I agree, he plays hard, works hard, and is loyal... but this is STILL a business, and the business is to win football games, not reward hard work and loyalty with starting jobs and carries when he is the THIRD best RB on the roster.
How many 180 yard games did we have on the bench while Fargas worked his ass off for 80 and no TD's?
I have nothing against Fargas, just the people that take carries away from players that are obviously better than him.
Three more well placed wins might make us watching tonight's game to see if we are in the playoffs or not. Thats not loyalty, thats stupidity.
So Gary you're just gonna dismiss almost 2000 yards rushing in 24 games as a bad personnel decision and that it probably could have been 3000 yards if it was someone else playing? Please stop. Like I said just tip your hat to the guy and lets move forward.
Raiderike
By the way anybody notice Mario Henderson? Do we still need a left tackle? What the hell were we saving this guy for? Oh yeah I forgot- Kwame (never heard a snap count I liked) Harris.
RaiderMike
Gary....
Very well said...Fargas is a Raider but so are "McFab"-n-Bush and appear to be just as loyal and hard working as Fargas....
Just give them the damn ball....
One other point long forgotten....
We lost both our "FB"s early on....This no doubt hurt the running game and limited the play calling....With their return and "McFab"-n-Bush and Miller and Higgins-n-Schilens and "JRus"....We now almost have a "Full-House" Back-Field....
Add the #1 "WR" and we are set with one of the best young Back-Fields in the NFL....Won't that be nice...
Now...What to do about that "D"....
PantyRaider....Hope is Cool!!!/_
RaiderMike...
Last year Fargas was needed as the feature back....What did we have...An injured Bush and a malcontent Jordan....So now if you only count this season which is what were talking about...
Fargas has 815yds on 218 carries 3.9yd avg...
Darren McFadden 113 for 499yds 4.4yd avg....
Michael Bush 95 for 421yds 4.4yd avg...
That's 1/2yd per carry more....How many 1st downs could that have given us....Also Fargas has 1 "TD" while "McFab"-n-Bush combine for 7...
Those were the same arguments being made when we had "Bo" and Allan....Some did not like Allan being demoted to the #2 "RB" and 3rd dns but that was smart football than and would be again now...
PantyRaider....Stats Man!!!/_
I'm not dismissing Fargas' contributions to the Raiders... he's a fine RB.
Just that's he no Bush or McF. We needed something spectacular, not meat and potato's.
I'm pretty sure if Fargas hadn't gotten injured today we would be tipping our hat at his 85 yards, no TD's, and our 4-12 season.
RaiderMike - Nothing against Mr. Fargas. He is a class act, and a 110% player. He's also a viable commodity in the trade market when you have the luxury of a Michael Bush and Darren McFadden on your team.
There is no shorter football career position than RB. The time is ripe to move forward with our young backs and get value for a quality player. Plus, Fargas' salary is very manageable for virtually any team in need of a RB.
This move also allows us to promote L. Rankin, who showed considerable promise in pre-season.
We can be the "new Denver Broncos" when it comes to farming RBs. They brought up some great ones, and knew when to get rid of them, i.e., when their value was high. Isn't time for us to be smart?
Just finished watching the game, had to go to a wedding so the game was recorded.
Cable did something I have always thought some teams should do. Late in the game, go ahead and take the delay of game when the five yards are meaningless.
I said last week I was looking to see if the light went on in that game. It appears it might have. 17 unanswered points in the last 8 minutes and the team, the entire team never quit playing hard. Offense, defense and special teams. Not to mention the two minute offense to take a lead going into halftime.
The last six games I saw this team be more prepared and play more like a team than I have the last six seasons.
Yes, I realize we got blown out by the Dolts and the Patsies. But, I saw a team playing to win. Not playing to not lose. Cable has earned my respect. He walked into a no win situation, took on a team that appeared to be clueless and turned them into something respectable. Penalties during that stretch were 10, 5, 6, 7, 2 and 6. A far cry from the near 10average we were running up.
Now as for Fargas, he should stay. I don't think he will be the starter, but he has busted his ass for this team. And remember, McFaden has missed about the same number of games as Fargas this season. He should be brought into camp, but I feel he will drop to 3 on the depth chart.
This just in, Geldings lose.
Cable has made his case. If he stays I will not be disappointed.
If he stays, at a minimum Brian Schneider should stay as Special Teams coach and Tom Rathman as RB coach.
The way Schilens and Higgins have come on, Lofton should stay also.
With the Rooney Rule Al can't remove the "interim" tag without interviewing at least one minority candidate. Even if he had won all 12 games. The Whiners didn't have to interview anyone. Stupid rule. I can understand it if you are doing a full blown search after fireing the HC when the season ends, but if cable had won 10 games and the Raiders made the playoffs Davis couldn't remove the designation without doing the interview.
H
H,
no problem, al can interview lofton, and retain cable as HC.
cable has earned it. as i sais all week, win in tampa, and cable returns.
it's a no brainer.
harbough = starting over again
fassell= going backwards
cable = moving ahead.
Why can't the Raiders have a west coast version of the GMen's "Earth (Jacobs), Wind (Ward), and Fire (Bradshaw)" with Bush, McFadden, and Fargas? Call it "Rock, Slice and Hammer"
There are about 60 to 65 offensive snaps per game.
There are games when 1 of 3 RBs is knicked up.
There are games when there is a "hot" back.
There are games where the opponent and game situations dictates the RB rotation.
Think of all the possibilities with these 3 RBs ...
A single backfield with Bush or Fargas with McFadden in the slot.
A backfield with Bush at FB and Fargas at TB.
A backfield with McFadden and Bush both at RB split wide.
Short yardage packages with Bush.
Red Zone packages with Bush and McFadden.
The point being that it is up to the HC to utilize the 3 RBs to their strenghts and game plan accordingly.
I personally don't think Fargas has as much trade value as some of you are implying. His value to the team goes beyond yards and TDs. He is a 2 time "Committment to Excellence" awardee, a leader by example, and the ultimate team player and warrior. I respect everything Fargas stands for ... a loyal, dedicated, passionate football player who brings it every Sunday.
I don't think Fargas performed poorly at all. The first part of his season was spent under the 3 yards and a cloud of dust offense that was Kiffin's. He spent a lot of time going against defensive fronts geared to stop the run because Russell wasn't allowed to throw the ball. He also was the primary ball carrier when Kwame was playing tackle, which was no help.
The lack of touchdowns was a team-wide drought for the last few years. I don't know that he can be singled out for it.
As poorly as the offense played for that stretch in the middle of the season, I don't know that giving Bush more carries would have helped - the team was simply not ready to give the type of effort we saw today. Russell may have taken a few more shots - Bush had several whiffs in pass protection today.
In terms of pure running ability I'd agree that Fargas has the least ability of the three. However, if you combine it with leadership, blocking, and toughness, he's a guy who has earned his playing time.
Next year I would expect McFadden to beat him out, and for Bush to get some of the backup carries as well. The offense today looks like we hoped it would at the start of the season. However if McFadden gets dinged again next year, I would have no problem with Fargas splitting time with Bush.
Gary, you're right. Fargas has never had a 180yd 2td game.
However, he's had a 179yd HALF.
Last year vs Dolphins.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/09/30/SP7BSHD6K.DTL
He doesn't go off much, but when he does, WOW.
---Jeff
Oops. Sorry.
172yd half. 179yd game.
My bad.
---Jeff
Not to be a wet blanket because I do see the importance of this win but...
It seems the only reason why Higgins, Schillens and Bush got any time was because of injuries, not because they were assessed as being better.
If lelie, carter and walker were healthy and playing as poorly as they were, with nothing to lose, would cable have said, "We need to see what we have here, let's let Schillens and Higgins start." No way
because carter lelie, and walker were AD's guys.
Cable was also married to harris at tackle and the only reason Henderson played is because there was no one else. He also seemed content with the sob no blitz D.
I am not convinced cable is the answer because of the AD influence or the lack of talent assessment, whichever the reason for not looking deeper into the roster.
At this point I think we're stuck with cable but If sob stays I quit for real.
And let us not forget the one thing this team has been lacking tremendously the last 6 years is Veteran Leadership. Nothing, nada. If we jettison Fargas and Curry which we may very well do they better bring in some veteran guys who can lead on the field. I say without that I don't care how much talent you have you are doomed to failure. The Dolphins success wasn't because Pennington is a great QB but rather a great leader. Joey Porter stepped up to lead the D this year rather than be a quiet participant. You see Raider players performing extremely well all over the league (when placed on teams with adequate leadership). That was the whole thing with Moss and Jordan. This more than any other issue needs to be addressed in the off-season. And if Al thinks players like Javon and Hall are the answer he's not only lost touch he's lost his mind.
RaiderMike
I stand corrected about Fargas, Jeff.
And the rumor is that the first thing NE is going to do in the offseason is trade Casell. The difference between them and most other teams in the NFL is they understand that this is a business FIRST... and getting the best players on the field at any cost is the only thing that matters. The only person that is untouchable on that team is Brady, and that is how it should be.
That is actually one of Al's ACTUAL faults, where he deems loyalty over talent. If some moron offered Al a first rounder for Fargas, he'd prolly turn it down because Fargas is such a Raider-guy. In the old days when we always had all the best players anyway, he could get away with this... this doesn't work any more.
Gary, you and I are on the same page here. Why keep Fargas and demote him to #3? That makes no sense. And if he splits carries with McFadden, then Bush (who is a far better receiver than Fargas) is again the odd man out.
Personally, I'd like to see more of Michael Bush, but I'm afraid that simply won't happen if Justin Fargas remains. Plus, that leaves out Louis Rankin, a player the Raiders protected from other teams late in the season by signing him to the roster.
Fargas is a workhorse who leads by example, but I believe his leadership qualities end there. We need a vocal team leader who will stand up during a game and bring out the best of the players around him. I don't see Fargas in that role, and certainly not Curry.
Curry's claim to fame was a one-handed grab in Denver, which briefly placed him on a pedestal. He was at one time a strong possession WR, but his lack of production and numerous drops this year speaks volumes. It's time to move on.
I agree with Memdf, if the primary WRs were not injured, we wouldn't have seen Higgins or Schilens at WR. It’s the same mentality that's kept Bush off the field. In the two games this year that Michael Bush was given significant carries, he exploded on big runs in both games. How many of you think Justin Fargas could have carried R. Barber the last 7 yards into the end zone? That’s what I thought.
Folks, if you want to win more than 5 games in a season, you better start thinking change. Don’t let this two-game win streak create delusions of grandeur.
Since the start of 2003, the Raider are 24-72 for a .250 winning percentage... the worst in the NFL (even counting Detroit’s 0-16 season!). It’s time for smart, calculated change.
H - a large part of the mystery behind a drop in penalties is removing Harris from the field. That was worth 3-4 per game. Gallery, to his credit, only has about 3 total for the year, or about Harris' game average.
2009 opponents (outside division):
Home: Redskins, Eagles, Bengals, Ravens
Away: Cowboys, Giants, Steelers, Browns
Take a look at this group and guess how many games we could win with the status quo of Fargas, Curry, Walker, et al.
The mere fact that we have to remove Fargas and bring in McFadden when we need a receiver out of the backfield isn’t going to fool anybody. Conversely, having both McFadden and Bush interchanging will keep teams scratching their collective heads and open our play book up tremendously. Think wildcat, halfback options, screens, McFadden in the slot, etc.... Now is NOT the time to rest on loyalties and/or scholarships.
Cable stays. Rathman stays. Lofton stays. Special Teams coach stays. I'm not as determined to remove Ryan as most here, but the choice should be Cable's. Ultimately, Al will make the decision.
Bush was being given video time, because it looked to me that both Fargas and McFadden could have played if it became necessary. While I would have loved to have seen Bush turn into a FB in the mold of Marcus Allen (with McFadden in the role of Bo Jackson), Bush resists the move. This performance will get the Raiders a solid WR or extra draft picks. Maybe both.
Calico, answering a previous post, I also didn't say that hiring a GM would take that long a time simply on its face. What I was saying is that Al indicated that he had a candidate for the post, but that he couldn't reveal who that was because the person was currently under contract elsewhere. If that is so, one might expect those contract issues will need to be resolved, and we don't know when that will be. This candidate may not be available to us until the middle of February. Then he would have to either come in and consider the Raiders circumstances before interviewing the right candidates or shoot from the hip and make a selection that might not pan out any better than what we have.
What I see in Cable is a man who has earned the respect of the players, the media and, by and large, the NFL. I have never seen a man more determined to find the answer to turn this team around. Over the last six weeks, it looks very clearly that Cable has at least gotten the attention of the players. The players know what to expect from Tom Cable, and they'll come to the facility understanding what is expected of them. They won't have to go through the process of trying to figure the new guy out first.
Bottom line - I think if Cable remains, we fair no worse than 9-7 with exactly the same team in place. With improvements, sanctioned by Cable, we do better than that.
One last thing. It is said that O-Linemen never want to hear their name publicly because anouncers only say their name when they have allowed a sack or been penalized.
Well, I seem to be hearing one of our O-Linemen's name repeatedly. But usually when I hear it, it's accompanied by the words "key block." I'm talking about Robert Gallery.
We used to hear his name five times a game attached to the words "got beat," "false start," or "holding." But now we seem to be finding the ancor to our O-Line.
Here's a life lesson. Don't ever write anybody off - ever.
Regardless of who stays, the GM-type role is the key. Davis has had plenty of time to consider it, and it sounded like he already had someone in mind earlier this year. Because he mentioned it already I doubt it would be someone attached to another team.
I believe Al is planning on having this person work more as a personnel-type guy. I would expect them to help manage the cap, track free agents, contribute to the draft - those types of things. I'm doubtful that this person would make coaching hires, as there is nothing in the history from Allen back to Wolf to indicate this.
Regardless, the role would still be critical to resolve the Asamougha and Lechler contracts, as well as figuring out how to dump Walker or any of the other highly paid dead weight. We'll need another draft class along the lines of last year - Miller, Higgins, Bush, Henderson, O' Neal, and Richardson to go along with Russell - as well as some vets with a few good years left. A veteran QB, a savvy linebacker, an experienced OL, etc, would all be better than a couple of highly-priced free agents. That, as much as the talent need, would help this young team build off of these last few weeks. The 3-3 finish should help pull in those players.
And yet one more thing...
If Davis retains Cable, it's not going to happen quickly, and for good reason. Davis makes it his habbit (and the habit is a good one) to interview as many people as possible when he needs to interview for head coaches. He does this for tha chance to meet up and comers. He interviews people he would never curretly hire, but might in the near future. We got Jon Gruden that way. Gruden was interviewed when Davis hired Bugel. Bugel didn't pan out, so Davis came right back with Gruden. Davis should continue this process and not just ask James Lofton to stop by for a cup of coffee. Davis has already interview Lofton on several occasions. On this occasion he will interview a minority coach who is still fairly obscure.
Blanda - not sure where you estimate a 9-7 record with the status quo and some tweaking by Cable. Take a look at my earlier post with 2009 teams listed. Under the conditions described, we would be lucky to win two of those games, namely against the Browns and Bengals.
We had a perfect opportunity to make an impact this year with a weak schedule and a division that was championed by an 8-8 record.
I just can't shut up today.
Re Cable. Many would like to see Cable gone because he is an integral part of the last six years. Those people would like the reminders of the past to be swept away, players, executives, coaches - everything. Start fresh. Build anew. Kind of like building a franchise team that you hope will begin to win in three years or so.
In the Raiders' case, it is better to use the rubble of the last six years as our building material. There is an old saying. "If it doesn't kill me, it will make me stronger." The survivors of the last six years are our building blocks.
Like you Blanda, I can't seem to shut up today.
A huge albatross weighs heavily on this team until we can get a bonafide GM.
It’s ok for an owner to show up at 3pm, as Al Davis is reported by the media to do, but it’s completely unfathomable that a GM would show up to work at 3pm.
I work with a business proprietor that does this. When he arrives, he is inundated with issues from the morning (or day before), administration, client messages, emails, etc. Essentially, he is overwhelmed and can never catch up.
Compounding this is an owner/GM who spends his time copying transparencies for overhead projectors and the occasional obscure press conference.
A GM is desperately needed to provide effective communication between Davis and the head coach, as well as manage the needs of a head coach.
We witnessed no greater breakdown of this communication process than the premeditated demise of Lane Kiffin. Jerry McDonald recently stated he believed Davis and Kiffin were equally to blame. I couldn’t disagree more. Davis is the owner and GM, thus, the onus is on him to communicate effectively with his subordinates. No excuses and exceptions. His letter and projector display did not demonstrate effective communication, IMHO.
Maybe Cable and Davis think they have this worked out, but that hardly discounts the need for a GM.
Just for Laughs...Moss-n-Jordan did NOT make the Post-Season....Reason to celebrate "08"-"09"...We don't have to watch or listen to all the "CRAP" about how the Raiders could not utilize these 2 "DumbAsses" properly....
As to the AFCW....There may be a complete "HC" turn-over except in OakTown if we keep Cable....Rumors out of the "MuleValley" have "ShanaRat" going if they miss the "Play-Off" again....Turner is out if he can't win in the Post-Season...."KC" is done with Herm Edwards...Therefore...Our West oponets may be on the "Schide" and ripe for the "Slaughter"....Now more than ever is the time for "Continuity" on the Raiders....Keep the momentum and build upon it...
What did we see yesterday….
The thought to be dead or terminally ill Raiders go down to Tampa and kick the holy shit out of a band of “CutThroat”s who had everything to live for while we had NOTHING to fight for except life itself….”The Game”….But we sunk their god damn ship….”Yo-Ho-Ho Mattes“…We are alive….
So it began 7 seasons ago against this same band of “CutThroat”s while on our western seaboard….They cut our throats and left us for dead…One year later they finished the job in their home territory breaking our neck sending us into a “Coma” where we have been the past 6 seasons….So how appropriate that now it is this same band of “CutThroat”s that gives us a new hope of life….There is a heart-beat and the patient has awakened from out of that cold dense deep “BlackHole” of an Abyss where we have been dwelling for so long…
But now the challenge is to keep the patient alive and breathing and not allow us to slip back into a “Coma”….
A Plan…That’s the huge question…Is there one…
While it’s been stressed that we can not survive without a “GM” in place I personally feel otherwise…It would be beneficial no doubt but there is still hope without it….But if it happens a man like Tom Flores get’s my personal vote…He has experience and he is an insider who knows how to deal with “MrD” and above all else…He has proven himself loyal….”Paranoia Strikes Deep” so we need to stop the patient from dieing of “Fright”….Trauma…
“HC” is an absolute need and sooner rather than later…See if McDaniels will interview for the job…If not….We either bring in “SOB”-Rex or make Cable’s promotion to the position permanent…In which case “SOB-Rob is shown the door immediately and a new “DC“ must be secured that can bring stability to that side of the body…The need for continuity has been duly noted so what ever happens must insure that the patient is not allowed to slip back into a “Coma”….
It was previously thought that we needed to swap so many “Body-Parts” that we would essentially be a “Frankenstein Monster” full of “Stitches-n-Screws”….Now I see otherwise…The “Body-Parts” shopping list has narrowed considerably…
1st and foremost we must keep the “CB”s intact…”MrD” you had every opportunity to settle this situation early on but failed to do so….So today…NOT tomorrow…Get on the wire and secure that position…He has earned every penny you are paying him…“Just Get It Done Baby”….
Next we need a “DT” like Hainsworth to come in and stop the bleeding that is killing us….”The Run”….Add to that a “LB” who is strong in run support and has the ability to fall back in coverage…The “D” should get healthy and help maintain the life of the patient…
The “O” needs the #1 “WR” to complete the Back-Field and our “FB”s to return healthy….Next to that we need some help on the “OL” but NOT the complete “Make-Over” previously diagnosed…
The “ST” unit must be kept intact…Lecler is a vital part of that unit and should be Franchised if we can sign “Awesome” to a new contract…This would be the cheapest Franchising in the NFL….How much does a Punter earn…The “ST” coach needs to be secured also…
The key to all of this is the Front Office and Coaching Staff…Without the “Brain” functioning properly and the “Heart-n-Lungs” keeping the patient stable we will no doubt slip back into a “Coma” and our terminally ill condition will most likely result in complete irreversible Cardiac-Arrest and Death…”The End
PantyRaider....Personnel take!!!/_
"08" Raider Report Card....
What to like about our team and the rest "NI"...(Needs Improvement)
"D"...
Pass-#10
Receiving-#10
INT's-#10
Tackles-#10
Sacks-#13
"O"...
Rush-#10
"ST"....
Punting-#1
Kicking-#7
Returns-#17
But the rest of the stats do not even get "Honorable Mention"....
PantyRaider....Lots Left To Do!!!/_
Vote for "Bush"...
Rusher of the week....
http://www.nfl.com/partner?partnerType=
players-air-and-ground
If Al is going to trade away Bush, he sure as hell better get at least as much as Detroit got for Roy Frigging Williams.
It might not be a horrible move, because he isn't doing us any good on our bench.
Myth or Fiction...
Possible????...
http://www.insidebayarea.com/
raiders/ci_11326316
PantyRaider....Futures!!!/_
NYRaider, from my point of view, Kiffin decided not to attempt to communicate with Davis and to run all of his communications through the media. In other words, he acted like an unprofessional ass. While Davis is at fault for not dealing with the situation in the off season, also understand that Kiffin during the off season was barely heard from. It is apparent that that silence was a result of Davis communicating quite adequately - "Shut the hell up."
I believe that continuity was what Davis desired, and tried to see if Kiffin would develope. But continuity in the wrong direction doesn't get you where you want to go.
Apparently Kiffin was upset because Davis refused to tamper with Monte's TB contract, so Kiffin decided that all of the Raider woes were on Davis.
Last season Kiffin won four games out of 16. He had three veteran QBs, one with a winning track record, got to pick mostly his own coaching staff, and had three capable runners for the backfield. He had two strong corners in Nhamdi and Washington.
Cable won four games out of 12. He played ever game with a rookie QB, and while he still had three strong runners for the backfield, two of them were rookies. Cable was without our number 1 and 2 FB. Our two off season WR acquisitions went down with season ending injuries. Hall replacing Washington turned out to be a disaster.
Cable took no part in picking his staff, and when he was suddenly thrust into a job that he did not lobby for, he had evaluate every unit other than the O-Line for the first time. The man left in charge of the O-Line turned out to be a Kiffin loyalist simply waiting to join Kiffin at his next job.
Cable opened up the playbook for Russell, causing Russell to make more mistakes but also caused him to progress at a faster pace.
And at the end of the season, the players feel they were abandoned by Kiffin and owe their loyalty to Cable.
After Kiffin's 4-12 season we all demanded that Kiffin be brought back to continue his work. And that he did - beginning the season at 1-3, barely even preparing for the season opener against a division rival.
After Tom Cable's 4-8 stint in a "no-win" situation, with all of the national controversey covering his initiation, Cable has earned a vote of confidence from the nation after beating the man (Gruden) who started our demise.
Most impressively, over the previous five years this team hasn't won a game in the last month of the season. Players have been making their holiday and post season plans. Cable had this team practice on Christmas Day and won the last two games of the season.
The last two weeks were a positive ending to ANOTHER horrible season. But nothing changes until Al, decides to take a step back from the team and gives the reins to a GM. I don't see this happening anytime soon.
Roy
My point regarding a GM hire would be this. Al doesn't need to step back, he needs help. Beyond that, he needs quality help, not gofers. He needs people who can be trusted with making some key decisions and providing highly knowledgable insites.
We don't need Al to simply go away, nor should we ever expect him to. Any GM who comes in here is going to have to understand that he will constantly have a voice in his ear. That voice will be coming from over fifty years of professional football experience, three world championships, five Super Bowls, and a very large number of divisional championships. That voice will be coming from the Hall of Fame and a man who created the very image of the NFL as we know it today, and the only man to actually take an upstart football league and beat the vaunted NFL in their own game - forcing a merger.
Any GM so insecure as to shun that voice or to disrespect it, doesn't deserve to be a GM in the first place.
Blanda - Kiffin handled the situation very poorly, but it was up to Davis to handle it properly, e.g., effectively communicate with his coach and/or fire him in a timely fashion as to put the Raiders in the best possible position to be successful. Instead he allowed Kiffin to avoid direct communication and spent his spare time making overhead projector transparencies.
It seems to me there is way too much at stake to allow personal vendettas to cloud good judgement and proper management.
At the end of the day, Kiffin doesn't own a 3/4 billion dollar franchise, Davis does. Unfortunatly, his actions are in no way indicative of that fact.
Blanda,
Al stated in his Kiffin Conference that he had someone in mind but couldn't say anything due to tampering rules. So, even that person doesn't know yet unless he is with a team whose season ended on Sunday also.
I don't think Bush was just getting trade bait time. He was the only healthy back left. Cable wanted to win, but he also didn't want to injure Fargas or McFadden any further. Besides, he could fill in as "emergency" quarterback ala Tom Matte (that's a reference for you really old guys).
Schilens and Higgins get playing time due to injuries - so what. They got their time and came through. Michael Turner had to leave the Dolts to get more playing time, worked out pretty good for him.
Higgins became a better receiver after Miller took over kick returns. More time to concentrate on receiving in practice.
Besides, Higgins and Schilens are more Al's guys than Walker or Lelie. They are late rounders with great 40 times. They seem to have adjusted to the speed with which Russell's passes arrive. Both went up and pulled down passes and took hits over the middle and held on. If Schilens works hard on his route running during the off season, the could develope into that threat that stretches the field with a 4.38 40 time.
In the introductory news conference Davis said he thought Cable had a personality that could dominate the locker room. That may have happened. Nnamdi recommended he be kept. Maybe even he thinks the corner has been turned (pun intended).
H
Blanda,
Yes, Al is one of the most accomplished people ever associated with the NFL, but the game has passed him bye. So yes, he does need to take a step back and hire a GM to run the team. Alas, he won't and nothing will change. Next year we will be arguing over the same thing.
PS I desperately hope I am wrong, but I don't see anything to warrant that I am.
Roy
I posted this a little earlier and asked "Fact-or-Fiction"....But is it possible...
Regarding the "Tuna" having a "Release-Clause" in his contract that would allow him to join the Raiders staff in the off-season...Seems that the "Fish" are for sale and the offer has already been made so.....
What do you think....Could this be the "Hidden Jewel" we have been waiting for and the one to whom "MrD" was referring...
Also of note...."MrD" was absent from the game Sunday under doctor orders due to his health problems...It may be that now more than ever he realizes the need for help with "HIS" team...
http://www.insidebayarea.com/
raiders/ci_11326316
PantyRaider....Long Live "MrD"!!!/_
Roy, I haven't seen one thing that indicates to me that Al Davis no longer understands the NFL and NFL football. However, I have seen every indication that at the age of 79 (next year he'll be 80) that he no longer has the stamina necessary to run the team the way he's used to running it.
To run the team the way he's used to running it requires that he is everywhere at once - on the practice field, in the meetings, in the office, and constantly on the phones. Then in his copious spare time, he'd spend it at NFL headquarters dealing with their problems.
He no longer has the energy for the practice field, the meetings, the travel and, to a large degree, the office.
To my of thinking, if Davis can find a GM with great ideas and drive, and who can infuse a shot of youthful presence to the practice field and meetings, we'll get the best of what Al Davis has left.
Many here would disregard that, and throw it away. I'd consider that really stupid.
I don't understand those who say the game has passed Al by, and that he must step aside. Look at the 2007 draft. Either Kiffin made the selections - Russell, Miller, Higgins, Bush, Henderson, O'Neal, & Richardson - in which case Al did give him control. Or, if he handles everything, then those picks were his, and that's a better than average draft class.
Personally, I think it was a collaboration. Al definitely needs help, and looks to be trying to find a way to work with others, but it's gotta be both ways. If I go to work acting like a jerk my boss might let me stay on if I produce, and might give me enough rope to hang myself, but I am under no illusion that the CEO is going to humble himself before me.
Roy, I disagree. I don't think the game has passed him by. I just think it's a matter of age and physical ability. He no longer has the stamina to do the job, and I think he realizes it.
But, the person he wants is unavaliable at the moment. And, it has to be someone who would be comfortable with keeping Cable if Al decides to do it before making an offer to the candidate.
In 1970 it was written that the game had passed Bear Bryant by. That team went 6-5-1. The rest of the 70's he went 97-11-0 and won back to back national championships.
It was written that the game had passed Bill Parcells by. Don't think so. It was also written about Al Davis before he brought in Gruden. Tom Coghlin was considered too "old school" to succeed in New York.
And, don't hold his stint at Idaho against Cable. No one wins there.
H
StickUm25 said "...I am under no illusion that the CEO is going to humble himself before me."
Nor should he, but he should be prepared to force effective communication and/or institute immediate change, and not allow lingering insubordination.
The communication breakdowns between Kiffin and Davis began last year, so this problem didn't exactly catch Davis by surprise. However, instead of effectively handling the situation... well you know the rest; overhead transparencies and rants of "for cause". No need to beat a dead horse.
It would be a MAJOR mistake to trade Bush.
Bush is a critical playmaker and bargain basement offensive piece to the offense.
In the 1 game where he got significant snaps (by accident not planning), he had the best day of rushing of any Raider back in 2008.
I blame Cable for not incorporating Bush into the playbook sooner and more often. The thought that only 2 RBs can get significant playing time in a game is rubbish.
60 offensive snaps per game can easily be divided up between Fargas, McFadden, and Bush especially when you consider all of the mix and matching variations.
Another Cable coaching error that defies all common sense is how McFadden was so under utilized from Weeks 10 through 14 when he was 100% healthy.
How is it possible that one of your most versatile, explosive playmakers is sitting idle on 3rd downs? In the 1st quarter? In red zone packages? Makes no sense.
When you take a step back, you will realize that the vast majority of positive outcomes concerning our younger players developing and proving their worth was the result of misfortune (injuries) or putrid play (Henderson in for Harris).
It was not because of Cable's insight or his forward thinking. Would we know today how great a back Bush could become if McFadden and Fargas weren't injured vs. TBay? Probably not.
Until a GM is brought on board, the pool of viable, top HC candidates will always be limited.
Does anyone think it is prudent to put all of eggs in the Cable basket? I would love to see Cable succeed but at what expense? All that I'm really suggesting is that the organization needs to explore all possible avenues and not just "settle" on Cable because the pool is slim pickings. The pool is slim pickings quite frankly because we don't have a functional front office.
It really is a chicken before the egg type debate. From my perspective you need to get a capable GM first and let the GM decide who is the most worthy candidate. Without the GM, the pool of candidates will be limited.
One plausible scenario for 2009:
Cable is rehired as HC. A GM is brought on board later If there is significant progress, Cable is retained for 2010 (and beyond). If the team continues to flounder at 2,4,5,6 wins ... the GM actively recruits and selects a new HC for 2010.
BTW, from the Kiffin PC, Davis hinted at a possible GM with Bay Area ties. If it is a 49er (McCloughlen or Gamble), Davis should be busy interviewing the GM this week not next month or in March.
I also think it is ass backwards that Davis is in the process of considering Cable and Gilbride before a GM is interviewed/brought on board. The new GM should at the very least have significant input on who the HC should be. If a GM isn't directly involved in the hiring of the HC then he really is no more than a "consultant".
If anyone can name one team where the GM hasn't carried MAJOR weight in the selection of the HC, I'm all ears. Sure there are GMs who are hired where there is already a well established, successful HC in place ... but if and when that team hires a new HC, the GM is the one shaping the selection process.
In the words of the late Darrell Russell, "we goin' home... they goin' home"... that was really sweet.
Calico, if I had my druthers I would trade Fargas and keep McF and Bush, but I don't think anyone will want Fargas because they see what we see.
If we had a great deep team, my second choice would be to keep all three... but who's kidding whom? We have more needs than three RB's.
So in order to improve the team overall, what should we do? I'd seek a trade with our most valuable commodity at a positon we are deepest at... that position is RB and Bush.
I'm sure Dallas would have preferred to keep Herschel Walker at the time they traded.. need I say more?
If there is a team that thinks they are a RB away from a trophy... the time is now to move.
That said, if we don't get at least a first rounder +... keep him.
BTW.. the person Al was hinting about to be GM is Parcells. You heard it here first [smile]
Gary....
Go back just a few post and you will see I pointed it out twice...
4:57 PM...
1:06 PM...
Beat ya to it Bro....
CalicoJack....
Good arguments BUT....
"SD" had a "GM" who could not get along with the very capable coach who was in place...Therefore after a 13-3 record and a return to the Post-Season the "HC" was fired at the demands of that "GM" and his new one was put in place.....
Can you say "MISTAKE"...
"MartyBall" is gone and "Turnerites" sets in....
So all I'm saying is be careful what you wish for....A "GM" may or may NOT be the answer to the Raiders Woes....He could be the foot that kicks us completely over the edge....
"Better Safe Than Sorry" may apply here...At the moment we know what we have in Cable and he has motivated a very lazy group of players to Over-Achieve themselves at the end when there was nothing to gain...That speaks very loud to me...
We could end up with another Lam-Bar-Dee...."Tattle-Tail" to the "Gossip Rag"...
And remember Bruce Allan Jumped-Ship with "Grud-Dumb" to "TB"....NO loyalty there...
And I'm NOT at all interested in anything coming to us from across the Bay these days...Mike Signatary is the only positive in site and he came from da Bears....Just look at their recent history...Their choices at "QB" and Coaches are disgusting and a failure...How the hell does that help the Raiders get healthy...
PantyRaider...Tough Decisions!!!/_
it seems to me that curry was benched, and schillens given a starting wr spot. so he was not an injury replacement.
the running backs i cannot explain. mcfadden & bush were totally misused, while fargas was the golden boy.
kwame harris i also cannot explain.
he played, and played badly. the worse he played, the more he played. unbelievable.
at least, finally, commom sense prevailed. better late than never.
mangini, marinelli, and crennel are out there for DC consideration. WAKE UP AL.
The day Parcells becomes GM of the Raiders is the day pigs fly out of the Alameda building [smiles :)]
The main reason we need to keep the 3 headed monster in tact for 2009 is that it is one of our biggest strengths. A solid running game that moves the chains AND has the ability for explosive plays should be the bread and butter of the offense. It makes everything work better ... TOP to keep the D off the field and play action pass effectiveness for Russell.
Does anyone honestly believe we can get a 2nd rounder or better for Bush or Fargas? I don't. Geting a 3rd rounder or worse would be fools gold.
Gary, we ain't getting a first rounder for Fargas.
Calico, the ankle injury Sunday was a reinjury. McFadden had problems with turf toe and his ankle this year. He was not 100% healthy 10-14. I remember the reports that said he did not practice or was limited in practice.
When Cable took over he could not make wholesale changes at first. And, I'm sure, he had his own offensive philosophy to incorporate. Gannon said he simplified the playbook for Russell, but I disagree. I think he slowly opened things up and began putting the onus on the younger players since they are the future of the franchise.
Did he make mistakes, yes especially right after he started calling plays. But he learned from them and won the last two games as underdogs.
Harris was a guy he initially wanted and Henderson was developing slowly. Maybe the light finally went on for Mario, we shall see.
After a rough start, four of the last six games were well played three of them victories. Something to build on.
Some of the biggest failures are those who come in and totally make things over or force people into a system they are not built for. Just look at Michigan this year.
John Madden said they always altered the system to fit the players, not the other way around.
More coaches would stay long term if they took that approach. That may have been what Cable did over his first six weeks.
Having said that, my gut feeling is it's less that 50-50 he will stay, but if the does I can live with that.
H
Calico - this is one of the few times you and I disagree.
I believe it's time to move past Justin Fargas, and thank him for his outstanding service and community work. It’s time to promote a quality RB in Louis Rankin, rookie out of Washington, and simply set the dogs loose in Bush and McFadden.
I don't see demoting Fargas to 3rd string, and I wouldn't want to see Fargas share equal time with McFadden and Bush, both of whom I believe have insane upside potential. Conversely, we've seen the best of Fargas.
It’s an incredible luxury to have a quality player like Fargas expendable, but the risk we run in keeping him is that his presence will continue to stagnate the use and development of two very high quality RBs in Bush and McFadden. That scares the hell out of me. I certainly wouldn’t assume that Cable or any other coach could or will use all three players effectively, as you suggest. We just suffered an entire season of the exact opposite.
I don't expect to get top value in a trade, and wouldn't specifically look for a draft pick. Maybe trade for a serviceable veteran WR or other position of need.
Having said that, I totally agree that a GM be hired before a coach. The chemistry between these two is critical. Hiring a coach first is a cart-before-the-horse problem that only Al Davis would perpetrate.
Too little too late once again, in my opinion. I'm not getting hyped this year over a couple of late wins.
Sure it was nice to see things open up with JaMarcus looking good and the Bucs getting knocked out. But this is just rediculous. We should've been playing like that all season! I mean, what the fuck is so wrong with this team that they can't seem to pull their heads out of their asses until late December? Every year!
We all see the potential. We all see the positives, yada yada. But it seems to me like the only time we live up to that potential is when jobs and paychecks are on the line.
Maybe next year we should fine players AND position coaches for penalties, dropped balls, missed routes, lack of effort, missed tackles etc... And players/position coaches are both FIRED for 3rd offenses on any one particular mistake. Maybe THEN we'll have diecent football played in Oakland.
Is seems to me like every win we get is not really a team effort, but a lucky collection of good individual efforts that happen to string together into a win.
Psycho
Roger that, Gary. I totally agree with you, though, that Fargas is a #3 back. He's inspirational as hell, but he has nowhere near the skill set of Bush or DMac.
Psycho, we've not played like this at the end of the season in a long time. We've usually mailed it in by the time we get to December.
I'm getting my hopes up. I do it every offseason. Sure, maybe they'll be dashed just like they have for the last six years, but that doesn't stop me from being an optimist. I refuse to allow myself to be a doom-and-gloom kinda' dude--it's just too depressing.
JMHO
---Jeff
With all due respect to Al, and I will always love Al because he is THE Raider, the game has passed him by. Is our 2007 draft class looking good? Yes, although I think 3-4 good games is hardly enough to begin voting Henderson, Richardson and O'Neil to the pro bowl.
Take a look at our 2008 free agency class, Hall, Walker and Kwame. This is classic Al Davis. He is still trying to assemble a group of renegades, give them enough rope to hang themselves and only ask they show up on Sunday. This does not work.
In the 70's the game was not a year round 24/7 business. We need foot ball players who are true professionals, not head case athletes. We need a team of executives focused on building a winning franchise. NO one person has enough energy to run an entire franchise by himself.
It takes an entire front office. Simply hiring one GM won't do it, the game has passed Al by. This does not mean he has nothing to contribute, it means he should not be making day-to-day decisions on player personnel, contract negotiations, game planning or coaching.
Roy
Calico, are you telling me that Jerry Jones doesn't pick the HCs? It also seems to me that John York picked the HCs.
Also, folks might be missing something regarding trading Fargas or Bush. What makes you think it isn't McFadden on the block? Bush showed he can fill the job if we get a WR in here, and we have Rankin in the wings. I'm not advocating it - just sayin'.
One more thing, some have compared Al to a CEO. The job of a CEO is to set the vision, culture and leadership of a company. The job of a CEO of a $500 million dollar company is NOT to run every aspect of the business. If Al really was the CEO the board would have dismissed his ass a long time ago. As I said earlier, this is not a one man (or woman) job. Al needs to hire an entire front office of executives and allow them to do their job. He won't.
Roy
Psycho, to quote you properly you said
"I mean, what the fuck is so wrong with this team that they can't seem to pull their heads out of their asses until late December? Every year!"
Since our trip to the Super Bowl our December record has been:
1-3 2003
1-3 2004
0-4 2005
0-4 2006
0-4 2007
Total of 2-18 or 10%
That's worse than our overall record for that time.
Now, I'm not ready to do backflips yet (I'd be in the hospital if I'd tried anyway), but the previous five years December was mailed in. For the last two weeks of those seasons we were a perfect 0-10.
Now this is not a ringing endorsement of Cable, but in those two games it was a complete effort by the team. Offense, defense and special teams. When was the last time that happened for even one game much less two in a row and three of six, two of the three wins on the road.
As a team they were more consistant the last six weeks than the previous five years. Even with the two blow outs. The team kept playing.
I'm not saying I want Cable, but I believe he has made a reasonable case for staying.
Recent report says Al Davis will begin interviews this week as he is required to by the league. Candidates inclued Kevin Gilbride (who will probably be punched by SOB), Paul Hackett, Jim Harbaugh and Tom Cable plus one minority candidate.
H
Grove on the coaching situation:
"When Lane quit on this team at about Week 1, and for him to come in and set a standard and hold us to that. ... I'd love to see him here as coach."
So, Kiffin did check out and want to be fired so he could keep the money.
H
Blanda, I'm pretty sure McF has tons of guaranteed money that would be cap suicide for him to be traded.
Also, I agree with whoever said it is not the CEO's job to get along with the manager(s), its the other way around for the most part. Ideally its a two-way street, but if I were a CEO and I had an insubordinate manager that was backstabbing me and the other managers, that wouldn't me my fault under any circumstances. The manager either wants to get fired, or he is insane. Kiffin WANTED to get fired.
>>>
Calico Jack said...
The day Parcells becomes GM of the Raiders is the day pigs fly out of the Alameda building [smiles :)]
>>>>
Do you think Bill Gates would turn over Microsoft to some snot-nosed underling fresh out of Harvard or someone much like himself at the top of the business world?
Al missed his first game because of his own health EVER last Sunday... and the losing has to be destroying him. If he doesn't think he can get the job done anymore because of his health, whom do you think he is going to turn to?
Seriously... its his ego that is keeping him from naming any GM after Lombardi back-stabbed him, so who is he going to get that he knows will turn the franchise around, and that he trusts?
I am playing a hunch here... but I don't see Al turning the team over to anyone BESIDES someone like Parcells.
>>>>
Does anyone honestly believe we can get a 2nd rounder or better for Bush or Fargas? I don't. Geting a 3rd rounder or worse would be fools gold.
>>>>
A first, third, 6th, and 7th was garnered for an underachieving WR just a month ago CJ.
According to ESPN (insert laughter here), Parcells has an out clause if the team is sold. Wayne Huizenga is looking to sell 95% of the team before the proposed capital gains increases are passed. This would effectively trigger the out clause.
One of the teams high on Parcells list is the Raiders. Once again according to ESPN (Chris Mortensen).
Al Davis' son is not the football man Al is and I think both know it. Parcells and Davis have been buds for a long time. If Parcells leaves, he immediately becomes the top football mind on the market. I do believe Davis finally realizes he can no longer do the job physically. It's a hard realization, I know from personal experience.
Is Parcells the guy he was aluding to in the news conference? Who knows, like I said ESPN.
H
I know that many in the media were telling us that McFadden was 100% healthy at times when he wasn't. The key is that McFadden was held out of practices the previous week, that's how you know. Someone like McFadden does not get to sit out practices when he's 100%healthy.
The press is rarely, these days, a source of reliable information. But since the meme that Al is a crazy old coot without two clues to rub together has caught on nationally...
In fact, both Fargas and McFadden have been dinged up all season. This season, in spite of a broken leg that kept him out for two seasons, Bush has always been ready to go at the buzzer.
I don't know what goes on in practice or in front office meetings (yes, Roy, there is a front office staff in place, and the Raiders roster of executives and staff is quite large - Al doesn't sit there with a Napoleon hat on and diddle himself) but I can see the potential for Cable and Davis deciding that Bush is the real anchor and Fargas should be the change of pace for late quarter ball control, while fitting Rankin in the mix. McFadden would be trade bate gold, and any financial issues could be worked out in the trade.
Blanda, a front office does not mean simply having bodies in the building. It means having executives that are actually in charge of their respective area's of work. For example, some one in charge of player personnel, someone in charge of scouting, someone in charge of contracts, someone in charge of coaching. In Raider land, Al is in charge of all this and rules the Raiders like a dictator.
And stop all of the talk about trading McFadden, not only is it not going to happen, it would be STUPID, to trade a player with his talent coming off such a bad year. Buy low, sell high. Not the opposite.
Roy
BlandaRocked....
Cease and Desist...Stop the "McFab" Trade Crap immediately...I could NOT stand the pain of having my friend who I pimped into the #1 choice for the Raiders to go anywhere except if he is traveling with this team...Just stop immediately...You are scarring the hell out of me man....Ha! Ha! Ha!....I don't believe it for a second....
Gary-n-Friends....
Remember you heard it here first....(Smile)...
The "GM" to whom Al referred to who has connections to the Bay Area is NOT anyone with a recent history here...
He was connected to Bill Walsh and split to "GB" as "HC" and took them to the "SB"....
He than split for Seattle as "HC" but eventually became "GM" and also took them to a "SB"....He is retiring from that position but said he may still want to work....
Now do I need to try to spell his name....
How do you feel about having him as "GM" in OakTown if indeed it happens....
On the (-) side....Just as it has been noted that our shopping list for "HC"s is short because NO-Body wants to work for "MrD"....So to would our list of "GM" candidates be a shot list....How many highly qualified and productive "GM"s would want to come in and put their Name-n-Reputation on the Raiders....
There are 31 teams with "GM"s and yet there are only a small hand-full who are productive and have their teams in the Post-Season consistently in this century....
"NE"....
"Pitt"s...
"Indy"....
Did I miss someone...
There are others who are periodically successful....
"SD"...
"Miami" Now...
"Jet"s Now....
Baltimore...
Tenn...
Seattle...
St Luis...
"AZ" Now...
Giants...
Philly...
Dallas...
"GB"....
Minn...
da Bears....
Did I miss somebody....That totals 17 who are "So-So" and leaves 14 who are complete failures....So Raider Fans...Unless a "GM" who has ties to "MrD" is willing to come in and work under him we will be stuck with the lower level of that list and chances are "Not So Good"....
Our short list of possible "Friends-o-Al" are....
Flores...
"Tuna"...
Holmgren....
Without one of these we are without hope and better off without one at all....
PantyRaider....Cristal Ball of da "DarkSide"!!!/_
Blanda - first you said Bush would be traded, now McFadden?
Even if Al could pull off a Hershel Walker-type blockbuster deal, he'd still need to use the picks wisely. I don't like our chances.
Remember, a McFadden in hand is better than two in the Bush. Careful what you wish for....
>>>
McFadden would be trade bate gold, and any financial issues could be worked out in the trade.
>>>
It doesn't work that way unless McF wants to give his signing bonus back.. and I doubt the players union would even let him.
It was 26 million, six year contract. Thus any trade would cost us 22 million in cap space.
Not happening.
BlandaRocked...
Are you stirring the pot or what...
Note to readers...
Raising a possibility does not indicate an advocacy or a prediction. Discussing something does not destin it to happen.
By raising the possibility of a McFadden trade, I don't necessarily endorse it. By raising the possibility of a Bush trade, I don't necessarily endorse that. See how that works?
However, one should not assume that I'd be outraged by the occurance of either possibility. I simply raise them as potential strategies to balance the Raider offense, or improve the defense. I am definately on board with finding a way to do both of those things.
Gary, bonus money doesn't count against the cap, only guaranteed money and there's a difference.
One other thing about the cap. Don't forget that the system is currently in flux until it gets renegotiated, upon which there is some doubt we will have a cap with a similar structure - or even a cap at all.
Let's put it this way...
If 0-16 Detroit offered us a 1st and 3rd round pick (#1 on both rounds) and a proven O-Lineman for McFadden, knowing what we have in Bush, Fargas and Rankin, would you say, "Get out of town!"?
BlandaRocked....
We regret to inform you that your recently submitted application for our vacant "GM" position has been "Terminated"....File "13" Bradah....
How dare you attempt to trade away the heart of our running game....How dare he!!!!/_
PantyRaider....My Attempt at "GM" Forthcoming!!!!/_
PS-Just for humor of course....
>>>
Gary, bonus money doesn't count against the cap, only guaranteed money and there's a difference.
>>>
Ok, who are you and why are posting as "Blanda?"
Signing bonus's count against the cap over the course of the contract.. hence McF's 26 million dollar bonus only counted for 4.3 million against the cap this year (plus his yearly salary (around 6 mill a year)) and 4.3 million every year after that until the contract expires. It accelerates if he is traded, thus all but this years 4.3 mill would count against next years cap... that is why JRuss and McF will be a Raider almost until their contract expires... they both singed long term deals with large signing bonuses. Thats how ALL top ten rookies get signed under the cap... because that's the only way the players can get guaranteed money. Otherwise not a dime of his salary is guaranteed... and Al could cut him and save 50 mil and McF would have to negotiate a new deal with a new team... it helps both sides out.
Oh, and while that deal might sound like a good one, I'm also aware of the Raider luck since 1995 on such deals. Here's how it would come out if your luck continues on the same course.
Detroit would trade McFadden to donkeys. The WR that Detroit received in return would get them to the play offs. McFadden would routinely run up 170 yards a game against us. The proven O-lineman would go down with a career ending knee injury in training camp, and our number 1 overall pick, spent on a can't miss DT is wasted because the DT died of a mysterious and unknown heart condition in his hotel room a week before the first pre season game. Our third round pick would be spent on a speedy DB with potential (that never really materializes). So the Raiders would wind up with a benched DB for McFadden.
Here it is if you don't believe me:
Say, for example, a player wants a seven-year, $60-million contract. Let's say that the owner decides to give that player an $11-million signing bonus, which is all paid out in the first year but gets factored into the cap as prorated over the course of the seven-year contract ($11-million / 7 years = $1.57-million per year). Most NFL contracts are "back-ended" -- most of the base salary is located in the last two or three years of the contract. If we suppose that our player's contract is structured so that he has a base salary of $2-million the first year, with higher base salaries in the final two years of the contract, the $13-million (base salary + signing bonus) paid out in the first year appears as $3.57-million to the cap! The advantage of signing bonuses for the owner is that he now has more money to spend under the cap. This is how the Washington Redskins ran up a total payroll of $92.41-million in the 2000 season when the cap was $67-million. The advantage for the player is that all signing-bonus money is guaranteed to be paid, whereas an NFL contract is not guaranteed.
http://tinyurl.com/axr9g2
Shanahan just got fired.
ESPN story about Shanahan firing.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3800768
SHANA-RAT OUT OF DENVER!!! YESSSSSSSSS THE RAT IS DEAD....COACH SHANAHAN FIRED THIS MORNING FROM THE DENVER BRONC-HOES!!! I LOVE IT!!
WITH HIM OUT AND NORVEL STILL IN CHARGLESS LAND WE SURE HAVE A NICE LOOK AT THE DIVISION NEXT YEAR.....ON THAT NOTE IT LOOKS LIKE OLD AL DAIVS IS NOT GOING THE GM ROUT AS PROMISED. HE HAS STARTED THE INTERVIEW PROSESS WITHOUT GETTING A GM....LOOKS LIKE OVERPRICED LOSERS AND POOR CAP MANAGEMENT AGAIN. LOOK FOR HIM TO LOSE LECHLER AND ASOMOUGH ...THANKS AL..WAY TO GO...JUST KEEP TAKEING THE PROZAC AND THINGS WILL LOOK FINE. HERE WE GO AGAIN WITH LOFTON AND CREW......KEEP CABLE FOR GOD SAKE....AT LEAST HE HAS A HISTORY WITH THE TEAM....SAME OLD AL.......SORRY NATION...
RAIDER GREG
Adam Schefter and Terrell Davis are practically throwing a wake for Shanahan. I guess they didn't notice that the papers and blogs in Denver have been saying "What has he done for us since Elway retired?"
Wouldn't it be great if there was a network dedicated to coverage of the NFL that provided on-the-mark analysis, helped fans learn more about the game and did it without all the cover-my-buddy's-rear-end cronyism? I know, I know, when pigs fly.
Gary, I believe you but that's not my point. There are always ways to avoid the cap for two motivated teams who wish to make a big trade. The Vikings avoided one when they sent Randy Moss in trade to the Raiders.
See this...
http://football.calsci.com/SalaryCap2.html
Moshbucket said...
Ding-Dong..the witch is dead!!!
Think Al will let Shanarat try out?
Trade Darren for picks?? Give me a F-ing break!
A good o-lineman? Does Detroit have any?
Darren is now a known commodity. Sure he wasn't as explosive as he could have been, but he had turf-toe on both feet at one point.
You don't just suddenly get to 100%, but I'm sure he will be by training camp.
The draft is pissing in the wind. Sure, you might end up with 3 blue-chippers, but I seriously doubt it.
PLUS, I'm sick of top 5 picks because they cost so f-ing much.
On the GM front, I sure hope the dolphins sale goes through next month, because that will allow the big tuna to get out of his contract. This would by far be our best bet. Not just because of miami, my feelings were exactly the same about the tuna before he got the miami gig. But he's going to want total control, and I"m not sure Al will give it.l
Mike Martz is out in SF. Keep in mind SF is #27 in rushing this year and they've got Frank Gore. They're ranked #13 in passing.
Raider Greg:
First off, no need to yell. We hear you.
Second, the Raiders have a one week window to interview Gilbride, after which they have to wait until after the Super Bowl. It might be just a wee bit difficult to get a GM and interview Gilbride in that one week window - don't you think.
Third, I'm not sure that Davis promised that a new GM would hire the next Raider coach. Remind me.
Fourth, what's your problem with Lofton? I see the developement of Higgins and Schillens this year and I'm fairly impressed. Seems to me that I heard Lofton was brought on board because of the poor job developing Higgins last year. Seems to me he's done what was asked of him.
"If only I had a brain"..."GM" for a day...
1st...Bring in Coach Cable for a conference....
You took over for us at a very difficult time and made some mistakes along the way as you learned but in the end you motivated the players and did very well for which we are deeply grateful and want you to understand you are on our very short list of candidates for the "HC" position....However we want an opportunity to explore other possibilities....Our question now is if in the event we go with an outside coach would you be willing to remain with the team in the capacity of "Assistant HC-O" and continue calling plays and working with the "OL" with the pay raise that you have earned of course...Continuity is very very important at this critical point in our history...
Answer...Yes..I'm a Raider Fan and want to be here and appreciate the opportunity I was given to coach this team thru this difficult time...
That is precisely the answer we were hoping to hear from you coach...
2nd....Call Cowher-n-McDaniels and ask if they would be interested in interviewing for our vacant "HC" position....
Bill Cowher rejects us the same way he did "The Mistake on the Lake"....
McDaniels stats he is interested only in event he can bring his "QB" with him as the starter and he has the authority to name his entire coaching staff from top to bottom....
Sorry coach but we need continuity here now more than ever and we are NOT in a position to allow a young yet unproven coach come in and make wholesale changes to our entire coaching staff and schemes...Thanks for you quick response but No Thanks...
3rd...On the phone to "SOB"-Rex....Would you please come in and interview for our vacant "HC" position....
"SOB"-Rex...Yes....I would love to have the opportunity to work with my twin...
"SOB-Rex....We have an "O" that is on the verge of greatness and we desperately need to maintain stability there...Continuity is very important at this critical time....But we would be willing to allow you complete authority on the "D" coaching staff to name you entire staff while making "SOB"-Rob "Assistant HC-D"....Also our "ST" unit is working well and we don't want to upset the boat there....Would you be willing to accept the position under those circumstances understanding that at some later date when there is stability changes would be allowed to be made....
"SOB"-Rex....Yes....That would be a great opportunity for myself and my brother to work with...
Done Deal....(If not we promote Cable and look for a new "DC")...
4th...On the phone to "CB" Awesome....Name your terms....We desperately need you to return and regret the way your contract was handles the past season...."HC"-Rex has plans for you and he will be bringing in help from his unit in Baltimore....."FA"s....
Aweoume....OK here's what I want....Let's negotiate...
5th...On the phone to Leclerc....You are "Franchised"...We need you here and "Jano" needs you so let's sit down and talk contract....
6th...
"FA" Signings....
"DT" Hainsworth....
2-3 players from the Baltimore "D"...
"WR" Fitzgerald...
Micheal "DogMan" Vick is signed cheep as Back-Up "QB" and "Slash" player to expand the creative possibilities of the "O"....
Trades net a 2nd and 2-3rd rd picks...From what I don't know but I want them....
7th....
Draft...
"OL"...."C" 0r "OT"...
"LB"....
"WR"....
"DT"....
"DE"....
I don't know in what order and it depends upon who we can get from Baltimore...
NOW....Keep quiet and let the coaches-n-players do their jobs...My job is to take the "Crap" slug at me from "MrD" and try to stop it from undermining the progress of the team....
Outcome....AFCW Champs by Default as the rest of the West sink into that "BlackHole" of an Abyss from which we have ascended...
Top 10 "D"...
Top 10 "O"...
Top 10 "ST"...
PantyRaider....Dreams Baby!!!/_
"RT"...That is great news....Now for "KC"-n-"SD" to go the same rout and the West is totally up for grabs....
Now more than ever we need stability and continuity in our ranks....
PantyRaider....The MuleHead is Dead...HEE! HA!...HE! HA!...
Now that ShanaRat is out a job, you think he'll approach Davis for that back pay he's owed?
The AFC West landscape is definitely changing.
Keep Bush/McFadden! They'll make you proud someday.
The way some talk about Davis here, I'm surprised the Tuna idea gets any traction at all. Tuna has repeatedly said that Al Davis is the man he respects most in the NFL, and when Davis talks, he listens. Seems to me that should immediately disqualify him.
Prefered should be someone like Shanahan who shares your Al Davis views.
The Rat is gone. And, six games ago we helped start the process. It's only proper since two of the early victories were gifts from the refs. The gifts would have continued if not for 3/4 of the league saying "What the hell is going on here?"
If something happens in SD and KC, Cable could be the "Senior" HC in the AFCW.
Here's a scenerio for you. SD looses to INDY. Norv is fired. Shannarat is hired in SD. We'd still have to look at that face twice a year.
H
I remember reading a quote from Grove after the game on Sunday. Grove, and I think he was backed up by Nhamdi, said that Kiffin quit on the team after the first week of the season. Kiffin wasn't fired until after week four.
So for three weeks, during the formational part of the season, the Raiders were simply twisting in the wind without any direction at all. This is what Cable was asked to rectify without the benefit of the slightest amount of preparation.
Still, with all of that, Cable got as many wins in 12 games as Kiffin got in 16, and he got the team to take shape by the 10th week - going 3-3 over the final six, and winning both of the final games of the season where we hadn't won either in five years.
What mental effect do you think it might have on team that's struggling to find a winning formula to have their HC quit on them after the first week of the season? What did Cable have to rebuild in Henderson after Kiffin called him wothless?
"ShanaRat"....
Anyone taking odds on where he ends up....
"GB" is my guess sense he runs that "Bill Walsh" WCO that they also love to play....
Cleveland-Jets-Detroit....Anywhere as long as it's outside the AFCW....Don't end up in "SD" if they make a switch or likewise in "KC"....That would suck the big one...
Well it's a good thing "SadFran" already named their "HC" so he does NOT end up back there....
"GM"...
I would love to have the "Tuna" come in as "GM" but with the understanding he has NO sticking power....He is looking for his next opportunity when he signs a contract...Bets are he had knowledge of the possible sale of the "Fish" prior to coming there....He make them a winning team and the price goes up and he gets the 9mil and off he goes...Sounds like a plan...
So here's a dreadful thought...."MrD" wants to sell the team and retire for health considerations....In comes the "Tuna" to turn things around and raise the price of the franchise with the escape Claus if the team is sold...The plan works and the team is sold to a "LA" grope who plan to move the team south to "LA"....
Woops!....Sorry....That was a dreadful speculation and I don't want to start any terrible rumors....Just Kidding!....Just Kidding!....It can't really happen!....
Holmgren has sticking power and so does Flores so they get my vote also....
PantyRaider...Dreadful..Just Dreadful!!!/_
BR: Regarding your 2 examples of the Jones and York 'picking' their HCs.
Jones son is the VP/Pres/GM ... so yes, Jerry Jones and his son pick the Head Coach. Guess what, the Cowboys have not won a playoff game since 1997 or 1996.
As for as the Niners, they have a Player Personnel Director and GM and Presiden (Gamble, McCloughlan, and York's son). For all practical purposes, the senior York does next to nothing.
Look, you can slice and dice and spin this anyway you want but there is no getting around the fact that a FUNCTIONAL front office includes a GM. Period.
To act like Davis is capable of filling the complex, time consuming, demanding roles of Owner and GM at age 79 is ridiculous.
The talk about the Raiders trading (pick one) Fargas, Bush, McFadden is pointless. How many times have the Raiders made a trade? You've got the Moss trade and the Chuck trade and I can't think of any other significant trade in the last 20 years. This isn't rotesserie baseball. Trades rarely happen in the NFL. The most likely trade to happen in the upcoming offseason involves Asomugha.
for those still waiting for al to hire a GM, while visions of sugarplum faries dance in their heads....FORGET IT !!!
word is davis is already lining up interviews for HC spot.
the 3 rumored candidates, gilbride, hackett, & harbough, are from the offensive side....SOUND FAMILIAR ??
dopey rob ryan, or someone just like him, will probably continue to run the defense...INTO THE GROUND.
same old, same old...AND THE BEAT GOES ON...
H,
When I went on a rant about our late wins being too little too late, I wasn't really talking in terms of wins/losses. It just seems to me like every year we suck, suck, suck, and then towards the very end we show flashes of what we'd all been expecting to show up through the whole year.
For example last year they finally let JaMarcus throw the ball in the last few games and he looked good.
We're constantly teased with some flashes of solid play right before the off-season, and then it all goes to shit somehow and that momentum is lost during the off-season.
My point is I get hyped up every off-season after these flashes and they always disappoint.
This is the "Show Me" year, personally.
Psycho
I view the two wins at the end of the season as a consolation prize to an otherwise horrendous, wasted season in which the team was provided no direction or leadership. Davis didn’t even talk to his coach during the off-season and for the first four weeks of the season.
Those two wins are even more meaningless if Cable is not brought back (and I'm not saying he should be).
Maybe Kiffin did mail in his firing and maybe he quit on the team, but that doesn't excuse Al Davis for his absentee performance as owner and GM. Davis and Kiffin spent the whole off-season barricaded in their offices while contemplating how they could screw each other.
Meanwhile, we complained of the Raiders’ lack of transparency, not having a clue how pathetic the whole owner/coach charade had really become. When we finally heard from Davis, the charade became reality, in what may have been nothing more than an old man’s display of clinical paranoia.
I have no doubt that Davis offers a wealth of knowledge, but at this stage of his career it’s the kind of knowledge (or advice) that you warmly accept from a family elder during the holiday season. While he did so for many years, recent evidence suggests he no longer has the faculty to micro-manage the Raider organization.
His ass-backwards approach of hiring a HC before a GM is typical Davis, but without an effective GM in place next year, we will almost certainly continue to spiral.
Calico, we traded for Hall. If history holds true, we could do something really stupid like trade with Cinncy for Cinco Chinco, or whatever his name is now.
The Parcells thing is interesting. I'd trust him with the keys to the pirate ship. He might be the only guy on earth who Al might trust too. Hopefully it all comes together and we get the Tuna.
If not there is always Shannahan. I hear Shittenheimer is still available. LOL
Psycho
wouldn't THAT be a hoot? shitenheimer to coach the D, shanarat to coach the O - and matt millen co-starring as the GM!
Here is my take on some of the recent NFL happenings:
Shanahan will end up in KC after Herm is fired next week.
Shottenheimer may be the "rat's" replacement in Denver.
Mangini will be coach of the Browns, and he will quickly gobble up Caveman from the Raiders (before he's offered a contract from the old man).
The Lions, who wants the Lions? Jason Garrett? Probably not.
If Turner is fired by San Diego, he may move to a division he can handle, like the Jets (or even as Cowboys OC).
Now on to the Raiders. Cable will be the Head Coach (Martz maybe the outside possibility), James Lofton or Tom Ratham the OC, Greg Knapp moves to Seattle as OC, and Wille Brown or Don Martindale the DC. Cable will bring someone in to coach the O-Line.
As for GM, who knows what is in store there?
Psycho,
It was your "Every Year" sentence that got me going. My point is if you look at the previous five seasons, we would be teased early, e.g 2-2 last year, and totally fall apart down the stretch.
I think everyone would agree the the stretch is the last six games. Instead of regressing over the last six, we showed marked improvment on offense and special teams with a bit of a roller coaster on defense (Dolts and Patsies). Even so, for the first time in recent memory the defense stopped an attempt to tie or win the game by our opponents in the last two minutes last Sunday.
Three of our wins kept teams from going to the playoffs (Geldings, Biplanes and Suckneers). They went 2-4, 2-4 and 1-5 down the stretch respectivly. We went 3-3 and played better as a team than at any time since 2002.
But, then again, I'm the glass half full guy. I look for positives.
H
Take a pill and try to relax just a little before ya all pop vessels in your necks...
We all want "MrD" to act quickly and hire a "HC" while one is still available...Remember there are already 4 other teams looking and posibly more on the way but very few qualified "HC"s on the street...
Perhaps the man in mind for the "GM" position has already given Al a "Short-List" of candidates and Al is simply fallowing up on that list until the man is actually free to take over...Tampering is a problem but communication can be made threw a 3rd party like their wives talking or something like that...Ya all know Al is just a little bit "Shady"...
Sheesh!!!...Talk about "Paranioa"...It seams to live in the Raider Nation also...
PantyRaider...Let The Chips Fall!!!/_
Here are some words from a Rookie "HC" that the rest need to understand...Hope we can find a fire like this guy..
"I've never believed in rebuilding, only building," Harbaugh said. "Look at the Patriots. They lost Tom Brady and kept building it, building it this season and had an impressive year that nearly got them in. I am not a big believer in fortune. I believe in providence. Providence in football, in life and in everything else."
"There are parallels," he said. "Everything we are doing, everybody is doing some of the same in their jobs and working like crazy. Black and white is what people think and sometimes see but it is much more complicated, sometimes more subtle. There is more gray in there than people realize. It's so competitive in this league. And that drives the changes. It's a game. Just a game. It's recreation and exciting and fun. But for some fans, it's their lives. For the people in the game, it is their lives."
"At some point, you think about that," Harbaugh said. "All things come to an end for a coach. There is a time in this league where you move on to the next thing in life. But it's all about what you do in the interim and the relationships you build. And you have to do it the right way and help people grow and know they have value. You can't worry about extending as a coach. What do you do as a coach with the time you have?
"I think coaches who survive a long time face down adversity. They understand fighting no matter the circumstances. It's about doing something meaningful with players and getting them to look inside themselves and sometimes find something they didn't even know was there."
When I walked through the door here, I had a bunch of tough, competitive guys who like football and love to play it. And that was a great place to start. We built from there."
PantyRaider....Is There Hope!!!/_
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Blogger BlandaRocked said...
Gary, I believe you but that's not my point. There are always ways to avoid the cap for two motivated teams who wish to make a big trade. The Vikings avoided one when they sent Randy Moss in trade to the Raiders.
See this...
http://football.calsci.com/SalaryCap2.html
>>>
Moss was at the end of his contact though, IIRC. McF is at the beginning.
Kinda hard to hide 22 million dollars.
Keven Freekin Gilbride.......4-12 and 5-11 as HC....Is that what Al thinks will bring this team back??? Oh yea Blanda Rocked....Your lack of vision is obvious bro! Why labor the point of waiting until the season is over to make a move.....You need a reminder, The last 6 seasons have been plagued by lack of urgency...
In the office and the field! Late coaching hires have put the entire team in no position to win. The fact that the GM issue is the 500lb Gorrila in the room kills me. I guess you want to wait and see what Al does.....Typical......Nice move Blanda...Lets all wait to hire a coach until April....Like I said before...Same old Al.....But I guess We should just wait.....Funny, there not late to send out the Season Ticket Bill.........NOPE! Thats NEVER late......
Raider Greg
RaiderGreg,
you are right. it's the same crap all over again.
notice how all the rumored HC candidates are from offensive side of ball.
same old, typical al davis garbage that has led to bottom of toilet in the first place.
if GOD were a defensive coach, al would not hire GOD to coach the raiders.
that is how stuck in his losing ways al davis has become.
al davis is just downright sad.
Al will never hire a defensive minded coach, since that would mean that Al would have to give up some control of the defense. We all know how Al loves to play defensive coordinator with that boring, outdated defense from the 1970's that he still runs.
The only way to expand the pool of viable top flight HC candidates is to hire a GM first. Another way to expand the pool is to consider HC candidates from the defensive side of the ball (Frazier, Mangini, R.Ryan, etc.) Neither 2 means to an end are going to happen.
The only current Raider coach under contract going into 2009 is Lofton. Needless to say, there needs to be a sense of urgency and a comprehensive plan to bolster the front office and put together the coaching staff.
Hey RT, your favorite electronic gadget had a bad New Year's Eve:
http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20081231/ap_on_hi_te/tec_zunes_zapped
Hope you had a happy New Year!
I agree with anon 2:44. Al will never consider a defense-minded HC because he wants to keep a stranglehold on the defense. Only "yes-men" need apply. Enter Rob Ryan, who's bound to get a new contract from Al, and probably before a HC is hired.
It's ironic that the Raiders already feel the need to squelch rumors of HC interviewees and correct the media in such a trivial report; but last season when the media reported the Raiders were in complete and utter turmoil, not a word from the Raiders... not even to the players.
Perhaps the current overture to the media is a sign that things will improve this off-season, or perhaps it’s just indicative of how screwed up things are still.
Panty - I think a little paranoia on our part is more than justified after enduring six consecutive seasons of record-breaking losing which stems from poor decisions (hindsight can be an amazing tool). I’m still waiting for any sign that the Raiders' failed process has changed. So far, nothing.
If you want to rest our hopes on our recent high draft picks (which we will get another this year) and the late season wins, it’s likely the team will get better, but 6 or 7 wins a year isn’t much better than 4 or 5. It’s time for real change and it begins with effective organizational leadership.
Thanks for the link, RaiderRealist, most excellent. Unfortunately, the Raiders have become the Zune of the NFL, clunky and prone to malfunctioning. iPods have GMs. Zunes don't.
i'm one for hiring cable as the coach. stability is the key here but...
i have a question(s)...
if davis REALLY wants to hire a GM, what's the point of hiring cable as the coach especially if that GM wants his own coach?
would a legit and reputable GM take on a coach he doesn't want? he'd be walking into a losing situation anyway you look at it!
Most teams start with a GM. We start with a defensive coordinator. The new coach always inherits Rob Ryan, and now the GM (if we get one) will inherit a new coach.
Try telling Bill Cowher he can't bring in his own coordinator, or Scott Pioli he has no say in the head coaching hire. The elite don't work this way.
All the Raiders (and Al Davis) have done recently -- in the words of their punch-happy executive, John Herrera -- is throw pie against the wall to see if it sticks. That's the mentality that's carried this franchise through the worst run in the history of the NFL. Yet, they're still operating under this same process. Brilliant!
NTRaider...."Paranoia"...
Bro...Please don't let my "Sarcasm" strike you personally...
I was just sitting here watching all the "Pie"s flying back and forth and trying to duck out of the way...."Hiring Wars"...Who begets who and who should be before who...But we all want the decisions quickly and know if we wait the "HC"s will all be gone as will also the "GM"s...
Perplexing...If the "GM" comes second to the "HC" how will they work together but if we wait until a "GM" can view the landscape and decide who to interview the "HC"s will are be swallowed-up...
So what are we to do....
My suggestion was that if indeed "MrD" has his eye on a "GM" who is currently under contract and therefore unavailable to approach that....(And this is total speculation)....odds are they have already sent "Secret Coded Messages" threw some "PipeLine" like their "Wives" and thus a "Short-List" of "HC" candidates that the perspective new "GM" would be willing to work with has already been delivered to da "Owner" and he is merely following up on that "List-o-Request" while time is available prior to the announcement the the "Secret" "GM" has been secured for the job....
It's not too difficult to imagine that despite "MrD"s occasional episodes of "Drooling on the Remote" that he is still a "Sneaky Bastard" and inventive enough to to be able to figure out a way to carry out his "Secret Mission" without the NFL "SpY" Force catching sent of the operation....
"Paranoia"....Shhhhh...Anyboby listening....Not a Word...."Talk-n-ya-Walk"....
PantyRaider...Sense-o-Humor Don't Wake-Up Without It!!!!/_
for those who still dream that al davis would ever hand the raider keys over to bill parcells, wake up.
al davis believes that parcells is not fit to run an nfl franchise because he is from the defensive side of ball.
this goes for bill cowher as well. cowher is a former defensive coach, and al davis knows he can never succeed in the nfl.
bill bellichek ? how the hell does he still have a HC job ? hasn't the league figured out what the great al davis already knows ?
bellichek will never win a super bowl because he is a former defensive Co.
i really feel sorry for these stumble bums running these other nfl teams.
they know so little about football, it's amazing.
thank GOD we raider fans have the great al davis running the show.
al knows that if it comes down to art shell or bill parcells, shell, being a former offensive coach, is obviously the better of the two.
it's so simple really, and you don't have to believe me. just ask al davis.
raider00 -
ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!
you're too funny!
I can sense a little frustration in your tone.
relax! uncle al's gonna make everything great again!
psych!
>>>
al davis believes that parcells is not fit to run an nfl franchise because he is from the defensive side of ball.
>>>>
Nice try. Madden was a linebackers coach.
If you want to get a sense of how a functional front office operates with urgency, just look at the Donkeys.
ShanaRat was fired on Tuesday (3 days ago). It is already reported that owner Bowlen has done the following in less than 3 days:
* Made contact with Bob Stoops (Oklahoma HC, #1 team in the country)
* Lined up interviews next week with DC Raheem Morris (Bucs) and OC Jason Garrett (Cowgirls).
* Contacted and making arrangements to meet with DC Spagnuolo (GMen) and OC Josh McDaniel.
That is 5, high profile candidates in a matter of 3 days.
The primary qualifications of a Head Coach should be leadership, communication skills, football knowledge, and performance with their respective units.
It shouldn't matter if the candidate has made his mark from the defensive side of the ball, offensive side of the ball, or special teams (ie. John Harbaugh).
What galls me is how the Raider hiring process is conducted. It seems to me that the Raiders are always dragging their feet and limiting the number of candidates to consider/inteview.
The idea of finding the best candidate is a process whereby you start off with a relatively large list of viable candidates. A staff member gathers up all the contact information for this list. The large list is whittled down by due dilligence.
For example, how difficult and time consuming is it to make a simple phone call to say a guy like Josh McDaniel or his agent and ask "Would Josh be interested in interviewing for the Head Coach of the Oakland Raiders?" Sure, many candidates will say "Thanks but no thanks" but the point is there is no downside to tossing out a wide net of prospective candidates to try to catch the best possible fish. After the list has been whittled down, the interviewing should start promptly.
The Raiders will probably interview a few candidates with Raider ties (Fassell, Robiski), a few other marginal candidates (Gilbride, Hue Jackson), and Cable and call it a day.
Even if Cable is ultimately selected, there needs to be a competitive edge to the recruitment and hiring process. It should be "we found the best guy available not ... we settled on Cable out of convenience".
I have been a corporate recruiter for almost 20 years. It is my job to find as many high qualified and viable candidates for the hiring executive. In all my years of recruiting I have never heard an executive complain that he had too many good candidates to choose from. If there is 1 opening, the executive should have at least 3 candidates that he is excited about joining the firm.
>>>>
Raider Take said...
Most teams start with a GM. We start with a defensive coordinator.
>>>
When did we hire a DC?
We settled on Art Shell Part Deux because we ran out of options.
I believe Al Davis is so hung up on not being rejected (particularly through the press) that he's afraid to invite the top prospects.
At this point, Cable is our coach. Honestly, he's the only one who wants the job. I also expect Davis to invite SOB back; however, I think Ryan might, to his credit, go elsewhere.
Gary,
al hired madden as HC in 1969. bit of a while ago, wouldn't ya say ?
since that time, it's been all offense coaches.
sure flores was great, and gruden was very good.
but my point is that al has changed. he has a very narrow viewpoint that does not include defensive coaches. NEVER.
why would someone intelligent automatically eliminate all defensive coaches for consideration as HC ?
i don't know the answer, but that is what al has done/does.
it makes little sense to me.
Gary, we hired a DC five years, four head coaches and one GM ago. His name is Rob Ryan. Where have you been?
>>>>
Raider Take said...
Gary, we hired a DC five years, four head coaches and one GM ago. His name is Rob Ryan. Where have you been?
>>>
I dunno... I don't have ADDS (Al Davis Derangement Syndrome) so I thought we were dealing in the here and now. I was away and thought maybe he hired a DC or something... because as far as I know SOB's contract has expired.
Carry on...
>>>>
but my point is that al has changed. he has a very narrow viewpoint that does not include defensive coaches. NEVER.
>>>>
Without ADDS, I didn't realize "NEVER" doesn't include 1969. My bad.
Carry on...
Gary:
The here and now is we have 1 coach under contract ... James Lofton.
The here and now is that other NFL teams with HC vacancies are dilligently and actively contacting and interviewing candidates while we are idlying sucking our thumb.
The here and now is that our DC was able to keep his job in spite of 5 years of piss poor performance by his unit. What makes you think he is going anywhere?
The here and now is that we've had a vacancy at GM for a few years which is the biggest sign of dysfuction in the NFL.
The here and now is you can talk about 1969, 1979, 1989, 1999 but what I'm most concerned about is 2009.
Gary, you don't need no ADDS. it's easy.
al has CHANGED. he has NEVER hired a defensive coach as Hc since 1969...LONG TIME AGO.
look, you can cut it any way you want. the idea that al will hire an offensive minded HC, and that al will hand pick his DC for him is a documented fact.
it is also a fact that it has been huge failure for davis and the raiders.
Breaking News***
Art Shell has been named HC of the Oakland Raiders! The fans rejoice.
Psycho
CJ said: "
ShanaRat was fired on Tuesday (3 days ago). It is already reported that owner Bowlen has done the following in less than 3 days:
* Made contact with Bob Stoops (Oklahoma HC, #1 team in the country)
* Lined up interviews next week with DC Raheem Morris (Bucs) and OC Jason Garrett (Cowgirls).
* Contacted and making arrangements to meet with DC Spagnuolo (GMen) and OC Josh McDaniel.
That is 5, high profile candidates in a matter of 3 days. "
OH, SNAP! You mean he did all of that without a GM? Kinda' got the cart before the horse, doncha' think?
No offense, bro, but no matter what Al does, he'll get criticism. If he hires a HC right now, he'll get the mud slung at him for not getting a GM first. If he hires a GM, he will have waited too long to hire a HC.
We need to chill.
JMHO
---Jeff
So what. We expect Davis to hire a coach before a GM, and he probably won't hire a GM at all. That said, where are we in the coach hiring process? (cue the crickets.)
Why aren’t the top HC prospects on the Raiders' list? Because, clearly, they are not.
The reasons are endless... no GM to break the communication barrier that obviously exists between the owner and the coach (see Kiffin); can't work for Davis; Davis won’t hire a defense-minded HC; the Raiders reek of dysfunction; coaches want to choose their own staff; Davis simply won't pay market salary to a good coach (but he will grossly overpay for a player); and my personal favorite, prospects afraid of coach-bashing overhead transparency displays during mid-season press conference to name a few.
Ideally, Cable should only be a HC candidate, competing with a pool of viable options. Instead, Davis will comply with the Rooney Rule and Cable will be hired. Done. There, that was easy.
Regarding item #1 from my list above, Davis is not qualified to be the Raiders’ GM. He lacks the most fundamental criterion there is, communication skills. Because if he had any, he would have handled the Kiffin problem in a much more concise, expeditious and effective manner.
Al will NOT hire a GM.
He will hire an "Assistant to the Managing General Body of Controlling Interested Party", or whatever that title is ;-)
-moshbucket
PS: Someone mentioned RayRay. Is he FA again this year? He'll probably resign and retire in Baltimore, but I sure would LOVE to pick him up (always have). The idea of getting him and drafting the USC LB is GOLDEN. Everyone blames the tackles for the bad run game, I think we need to ML, with the lawfirm in either end.
Jeff...
Good post and I support that 100%..."ShanaRat" had taken over as "HC"-n-"GM" and was totally responsible for the teams woe's...When they fired the "HC" the "GM" was also gone...
NYRaider...
Please...NOT Qualified...I can see he has lost something but to speak so disparigingly about a man who has done more (In the Past) for the NFL than any other man currently alive is just "Al-Bashing"...He has been "GM"-"MGP" for half a century and has had a great history of success...
Raider00...
Just a few small points...
#1...Al Davis was a "TE" Coach for the LA Chargers prior to being a "HC" Coach for the Raiders and eventual Managing General Partner....He was "OL" Coach for a few college teams including USC and "HC" for Army...So he comes from the "O" side of the ball...
#2...Although John Madden was an "OL"man he coached the "LB"s prior to being named "HC" for the Raiders....SO...He was a "D" coach...
#3...Several "D" coaches have interviewed for the "HC" position but an "O" coach has won out as in the case with Gruden and Bill Belichick....In hind site Gruden's history is no where near that of Belichick's but at the time it appeared Al made the smart choice...Belichick had a losing record in 5 seasons with Cleveland prior to beginning his winning record sense "2000" with the "Pats"...I don't think any body wanted him here at the time...Do you....
#4...Al has hired mostly "OL"-n-"QB"s as "HC"s....Floes-n-Gruden being the "QB"s...
PantyRaider...Ancient History Still Lives!!!/_
There will not be a GM hired in Oakland this offseason. That, I can guarantee you. But hey, Scott Pioli has an interview Monday in Kansas City. Its nice to see our divisional rivals trying to bring some competent football minds in. Our wonderful GM/Owner trades for DeAngelo Hall, and cuts him after 8 games. Got to love that.
Jeff:
You write: "No offense, bro, but no matter what Al does, he'll get criticism. If he hires a HC right now, he'll get the mud slung at him for not getting a GM first. If he hires a GM, he will have waited too long to hire a HC.
================================
Don't get things twisted, "bro".
The "mud slung" is more a product of the process and results.
Over the past 6 years, the process of finding the best HC has been slow with limited and marginal candidates. The results have been
5 HCs in 6 years plus a 23% winning percentage.
My complaint (if you bothered to read my post) is that the process is a joke.
Ideally, a GM should be on board before the HC. It is quite obvious that Davis is going to hire a HC first. Since this is the case, I would like to see as many good candidates interviewed as possible.
This notion that "If he hires a GM, he will have waited too long to hire a HC" is ridiculous. You mean to tell me that if Al interviewed and hired a GM this week or next week that it would be too late to bring in HC? Yeah, right.
Well the playoff games have now started. Is it just me or do these playoffs get more hollow every season without the Raiders in them? It is hard to believe that it has been six straight seasons now with no playoffs. Something is not right about that.
GatorRaider
PantyRaider - not so disparaging as you think. I based my “Davis is unqualified to be GM” comment strictly on one critical criterion, communication. Conversely, can you demonstrate to me, after watching his week-4 press conference, that Al Davis did everything he could to communicate with Lane Kiffin - during the off-season and up to that point in time - to prevent the epic communication breakdown which occurred this year, and that Davis handled the situation in the best possible way and in the best interest of the Raiders? I know Davis thinks he did, but do any of us, really?
Honestly, I have tremendous respect for Al Davis and what he’s done for the Raiders and the NFL. However, that’s based on history.
Right now, and for the last six years, I am growing increasingly more impatient with the status quo. Even Pavlov’s Dog learned the correct responses after repeating the wrong actions without receiving reward. Yet, Al Davis keeps repeating the same failed process over and over.
And in my growing bitterness toward the man (which hurts me to say, but the truth sometimes hurts), I also feel embarrassment for him and the Raiders team/organization which has become the laughingstock of the NFL... in the same vein as the Lions (who own a better record than the Raiders since the beginning of 2003 despite going 0-16 this year!).
Disparaging? Nah. I’m just trying to keep it in perspective, while clinging to my own sanity as a diehard Raiders fan.
Matt Ryan looks like the 60-million dollar QB that so far Russell does not.
Jerry McDonald had stated that Russell's work ethic could be better (actually, I think that comes right from Cable). Russell should drop 10-20 pounds and spend every waking moment of the off-season being a better student of the game. That's what's expected of you when you're a franchise QB and you get paid tens of millions of dollars.
>>>>
The here and now is that other NFL teams with HC vacancies are dilligently and actively contacting and interviewing candidates while we are idlying sucking our thumb.
>>>>
Considering we are fans of the most secretive team in the NFL, I am not as sure of this.
But as long as we are making wild guesses here, I will toss my two cents in... I think Al has already made up his mind who his HC is (Cable) and might already have his GM (or gm-like) person in line.
The only major thing left would be DC, and I could already hear the ADDSers heads explode if he was talking about THAT right now.
Although I agree with Hiring a GM 1st would make the most sense. But this is the Raiders were talking about.
Al Davis never believes in order or structure. And Blanda I know you may think either wise. But Davis does not believe in structure just look at our team the last 6 years.
That's all the evidence I need to see Change Needs To Happen Soon!!!!
For those of you who have not seen the lastest.
http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/
I don't want Kevin Gilbride. What does he have? Not a damn thing. I don't want him at all. But as usual we'll wait until like March to name Lofton HC.
Mr. Duva
>>>
al has CHANGED. he has NEVER hired a defensive coach as Hc since 1969...LONG TIME AGO.
>>>>
Not sure why you are even worried about hiring a defensive HC in the first place... Besides Dungy, most of the other recent SB coaches I can think of came from the offensive side.
Are there a long line of successful defensive minded HC's that I am missing or something???
I honestly could only think of one off the top of my head.
BTW... Bellicheat started off as a WR's and ST's coach. I just looked it up lol
Gary,
Billicheat made his mark as DC under Parcells.
Don Shula, DB, DC, HC and winningest coach in NFL histroy.
Cowher did pretty good with the Squealers.
John Fox has done fairly well with the Carolina Kitty Cats, he went to the Super Bowl.
Oh yeah, that Dungy fellow you mentioned.
Tom Landry in charge of the defense with the Giants before the position DC was invented. I think he did reasonably well also.
There was a guy named Chuck Noll who had a fair to middling career as a head coach.
Brian Billick may have been offensive minded but his teams in Baltimore won on defense. As a head coach he was, at best, mediocre.
Lovie Smith took Da Bears to the SB.
A head coach should understand both sides of the ball. It's his philosophy that defines his winning strategy. Mike Ditka was a tight end, but his philosophy was defense first.
H
Ok H... I knew there were more. Just couldn't think of them... thanx.
So lets say there are ten firm HC's that came from defense... doesn't that make most of the rest that won SB's offensive guys?
Seems clear there were more offensive guys... maybe with Cower/Billicheat/Dungy people think thats the only way to win these days?
Al likes to have his HC call the offensive plays like Gruden did, I think thats what he wants now... whats wrong with that?
NYRaider....
I was in Cambodia and never got to see anything that was going on with the team...I learned about the firing one month after it happened when comments I saw on this board caused me to go look it up....Totally in the Dark...
Your follow-up comments make it clear what your position is and I have to share some of that same pain...I also think the time has come for change but just can't bring myself to the point of making distasteful comments about a man whom I have loved-n-respected for so long....
PantyRaider....Is There a Future!!!/_
CJ wrote:
Over the past 6 years, the process of finding the best HC has been slow with limited and marginal candidates. The results have been
5 HCs in 6 years plus a 23% winning percentage.
My complaint (if you bothered to read my post) is that the process is a joke.
Ideally, a GM should be on board before the HC. It is quite obvious that Davis is going to hire a HC first. Since this is the case, I would like to see as many good candidates interviewed as possible.
This notion that "If he hires a GM, he will have waited too long to hire a HC" is ridiculous. You mean to tell me that if Al interviewed and hired a GM this week or next week that it would be too late to bring in HC? Yeah, right.
=========
I completely concur that Al's waiting game at hiring the HC has historically been a major issue. You're not getting an argument from me there. However, I think that there is the possibility that Al is waiting for the Tuna or for Holmgren. I'm guessing that would push the HC interview process out to February or so.
So, if he gets one of those two as a GM, should he get ripped for not having had his HC named yet? That's what I'm getting at, CJ.
There's also the very strong possibility that Gary alluded to, which is that Al might already have Cable picked as his HC and just hasn't announced it pending the Rooney Rule.
In all of this, keep in mind that I'm not trying to attack you personally. My sarcasm might come off that way, and if so, I apologize, "bro." ;^)
---Jeff
Gary,
my point is not that al davis should run out and hire the first DC he see's.
my point is, why does he rule them all out in the first place ?
my point is, how has al davis come to exist in his own little world of absolutes ?
al does not believe in hiring defensive guys as HC.
al does not believe in letting his HC pick his whole staff.
al does not believe in hiring DC's who like to blitz.
on, and on, and on it goes, right to the bottom of the nfl toilet.
all i am saying is, maybe it's time for al to try a different approach.
maybe finding 5 new Db's is not the raiders most pressing need this off season.
but that won't stop al, our dynamic owner, Gm, and coach, all rolled into one.
Seems like many of you guys are resting your hopes that Al Davis has:
A) already picked his coach (Cable) and he’s waiting to comply with the Rooney Rule; or
B) picked his GM and is waiting to comply with league rules regarding contracts.
“A” provides Davis with no insight regarding viable HC options, and “B” is a big fat "if" based on our shared experience the past six years, wouldn't you say?
Davis should be giving a hard look at Steve Spagnuolo, DC for the Giants. This guy will be a head coach next year and is on the list of every team looking for a HC except the Raiders. Why? The G-Men have a pretty good D, and they don’t blitz much.
Meanwhile, Al Davis is more culpable for our miserable D than Rob Ryan because he’s either charted this horrendous defense or he’s allowed Ryan to fail as DC for five years (well, except for the B&B year).
BTW, if the Raiders don't re-sign Chris Johnson, I expect them to draft at least 3 DBs this year... forgetting of course that we still have Randy Moss' compensation (John "David" Bowie) coming off IR.
Poole can be perceived as a hater but that is because he tells the truth...
http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders/ci_11365435
Jeff wrote:
"I think that there is the possibility that Al is waiting for the Tuna or for Holmgren"
Jeff, no offense, but the possibility of Davis hiring Tuna or Holmgren is VERY slim. I will gladly eat a large serving of humble pie and applaud Al if this happens. I'm not holding my breath.
(1) Do you honestly think Al wants to hire headstrong personalities like Parcells or Holmgren who would garner all the attention?
(2) Do you honestly think Parcell or Holmgren would want to join an organization where they have a HC and DC shoved down their throat?
The type of GM that Al would hire is someone who you would hardly see or hear from ... a behind the scenes type GM.
memdf is right. Anyone who tells the truth and calls it like they wee it when it comes to the Raiders is labled a "hater". What makes me laugh is how everyone calls Rich Gannon a hater when he says bad things about the Raiders. Never mind what he says is true, he is a hater! lol
GatorRaider
Jeff,
mike holmgren,=west coast offense. i don't think al will go there again.
bill parcells,=defense. we all know al places little value in defense. have you seen our defense ?
if some unlucky fool is named raiders GM, he better bring a mop and broom with him.
he will probably only be allowed to clean up around the place.
oh yes, he will collect a nice paycheck.
which is the main reason most golddiggers come to work for al davis anymore.
CJ, #1 I don't know about, but that may be Al's plan.
#2, however, is an option if Al's hiring them with the intent of *them* doing the hiring like we've been talking about. That was kind of my point. If Al's hiring a GM first, we'll be waiting a while for the naming of a HC. That's all I was trying to say about that.
JMHO
---Jeff
Well, raider00, we had a WC offense with Gruden/Callahan/Gannon. And Holmgren is being talked about as a GM, not a coach.
Also, we've talked about Parcells as a GM, not a coach.
I'm pretty sure we can leave out those distictions until we're talking about the HC instead of the GM.
JMHO
---Jeff
>>>>
(1) Do you honestly think Al wants to hire headstrong personalities like Parcells or Holmgren who would garner all the attention?
>>>
Only if he thinks his time on earth is short, which in case I would be surprised he DIDNT hire someone like Parcells.
If he thinks his health is fine, I suspect he will hire someone to do cap management much like Bruce Allen. Everyone acted like he was a strong GM, but I think there was a reason he was referred to as a "capologist." He mostly just worked with negotiating contracts and such.
The reason the ADDSers want Allen to be a strong GM is so they can avoid giving Al any credit at all during our recent championship seasons.
>>>
my point is, why does he rule them all out in the first place ?
>>>>
He had recent success with Gruden calling all his own plays, thus that is now his preference... he said that when he hired Kiffin.
Good gawd... there's plenty of ammunition to attack Al as it is, but this is so far down in the pickle barrel your whole friggin body is stuck in it.
Gary,
i do not believe ruling out the likes of steve spagnuolo, bill cowher, rex ryan, and all other defensive minded coaches, as HC candidates, is a little deal.
i think it's a BIG deal.
2008 Matt Ryan
TDs INTs YDs QBRTG FUM
16 11 3,440 87.7 6
2008 JaMarcus Russell
TDs INTs YDs QBRTG FUM
13 8 2,423 77.1 12
Factor in that Ryan had the benefit of:
-Running the same offense he ran in college.
-Stable coaching situation.
-Great rushing attack with Michael Turner(#2 in the league vs #10 for OAK).
-Playmakers at WR with Roddy White and Michael Jenkins vs Javon Walker and whoever was healthy.
-Better line protection(17 sacks allowed vs 31 for OAK.
-Solid playcalling vs 3 in-season changes of Kiffin, Knapp, Cable.
The only advantage Russell had was at TE with Zack Miller. Yet the numbers are still comparable. Russell definitely needs to work on the fumbling, but Ryan wasn't perfect either.
Ryan had a great year, no doubt, but let's not get it twisted. He had a far better SITUATION to play in vs the drama that was OAK this year. Does anyone seriously think Ryan would have had the same year if he had played here in OAK?
Ok Raider00, fair enough. Now we have to get into the nasty little part about how you know Al has even ruled anyone out because they are DC's in the first place.
What is your source?
I'd bet good money that if any of the people you mentioned expressed interest in the Raiders.. Al would be interested and give them an interview.
So prove me wrong.
Or is this the spot where people presuppose (or make up) information and then get angry about it???
Raider Realist... interesting stuff about Ryan. Thanx.
I'd add that Ryan also benefited from having the number 5 defense so he wasn't constantly playing from behind.
Gary:
Name the last defensive HC candidate Davis interviewed since Bilicek in 1998? (crickets)
Name any HC candidate who Davis is currently considering? (crickets)
Source? Are you talkin' source? Source? Who needs a source?
Watching the game vs. TB as I was on vacation while it
Was being played. It is clear that the most important off season addition, even more important than a GM, is a screen pass coach!
Something else about Ryan. His head coach didn't spend the first four games trying to get fired. I'm really interested to see how the Kiffin's do against Mark Richt, Urban Meyer, Nick Saban and Steve Spurrier on a yearly basis. At least four of those are in the top ten college coaches in the nation
Calico, technically he interviewed SOB, before hiring Kiffin. But I really don't count that one.
Remember, Belicheat had a losing record in Cleveland and no one wanted him. You are not always successful your first time around. Sometimes you get fired at one place and win a Super Bowl somewhere else (NE, NYG, Indy).
And, just because you are a great DC doesn't translate into great HC. Just look at Marvin Lewis. But, we shouldn't hold that against him. If he does leave the Kittens, we should get him for DC.
PantyRaider, no disrespect, but if you were GM you would bring in Mike Vick? That would destroy the locker room. He and Hall were a two man wrecking crew in Atlanta. Two of the most self centered players in football. If Vick goofed up it was always someone elses fault. And, I don't think prison will have changed him.
Personally, I'm going to take a breath, consume the remainder of my latest batch of beer and see what happens. In a lot of ways I would like to see Cable come back.
If you cut his reign in two he went 1-5 then 3-3 in what was probably the meat of the schedule. Texas won 5 of their last six and the Suckneers were looking to step on us on their way into the playoffs, as was the Geldings.
Russell began looking like a QB and the young players, Henderson, Higgins and Schilens started looking like keepers.
All in all, not bad. The best December since '02.
Also, the media is floating rumors that a "Mystery" team is looking at Cable. Since when do the Media hide the name of a team? If it were the Raiders interested in someone it would be in the column heading in six inch letters. But, you all know how I feel about the media, a necessary evil.
H
if davis sent one of his yes men and his yes helmet shiner it must be true!
http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_11365993?nclick_check=1
Memdef:
Nice piece by poole but it ain't gonna happen!
well there goes THAT idea!
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3809823
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Name the last defensive HC candidate Davis interviewed since Bilicek in 1998? (crickets)
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STOMPING ON CRICKETS... Rob Ryan.
Anything else? lol
I'm thinking we are in a better situation than normal here... the only good thing to come out of the Kiffin fiasco. With Cable getting the team playing so well at the end, we are at least in a worst case scenario of just keeping him. Thats a hell of a lot better than grabbing a last gasp coach that nobody else wants. The Raiders are floating that Gilbride contacted the Raiders about the job, not the other way around, and that Al interviewed him for 90 minutes over the phone... so if true, we have a few eggs in our basket. Plus it looks better for Cable in the eyes of his players if it looks like he won a (kinda) coveted job rather than simply handing it to him.
As long as Al stays away from coaches desperate for a job like Fossell, I will be happy.
The thing that scares me about Cable is some of his boneheaded decisions like the Jani-play and burying Bush on the bench. But he IS the first coach to get the team playing consistently at the end of a otherwise dismal season... so who knows here?
Sorry Realist, I can't resist... "Does anyone seriously think (Matt) Ryan would have had the same year if he had played here in OAK?"
Well, that's kind of the point now isn't it? Nobody seems capable of playing their best while with the Raiders... it seems to be a common thread with this team, players and coaches alike. I wonder, why is that exactly?
We could single out any player or coach in the organization and say, "it's not really their fault." So I guess the real problem isn't that obvious. Or, is it?
This team has no stability, continuity, leadership or direction, and that's only touching the surface.
How exactly did the Falcons go from complete bust with a fleeing coach and a flea-ridden QB to playoff contenders? Was it a total accident?
And some of you guys blaming Kiffin for the Raiders' problems is a complete joke, when the truth is now obvious that Kiffin should have been fired months before that ridiculous press conference.
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scorpio said...
if davis sent one of his yes men and his yes helmet shiner it must be true!
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The URL doesn't work so I have no idea what you are talking about
you are all getting way too excited. unbelieveable. when we are 4-4 then we can apply some logical fervor. til then, I will enjoy watching my beloved raidahs learn discipline the hard way. they should start by running back to the huddle. I am out.
NyRaider,
you make an excellent point.
let's consider that fabian washington is staring for the ravens.
cris clemons is starting for the eagles.
even tyler brayton is starting for the panthers.
those are three pretty good defenses right there.
why are they able to excel for others, but struggled with the raiders ?
well, maybe because defense is actually considered important by other teams.
good call nyraider.
Gary said:
"STOMPING ON CRICKETS... Rob Ryan.
Anything else? lol"
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*keyboard*
That was friggin' classic.
---Jeff
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why are they able to excel for others, but struggled with the raiders ?
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Rob Ryan.
And yes Al deserves a shit-pile of blame for not firing him at least last year.
Thanks Gary for showing your true colors as being a true blue, Davis apologist.
Naming Ryan as example of a defensive HC candidate that Davis interviewed for HC is foolhardy for 2 simple reasons:
#1 He was alradey on the Raiders staff already. Was it a "courtesy" interview? Did Davis honestly believe he was a worthy candidate?
#2 The fact that he was even considered for HC in itself shows you the glaring flaws in the selection process.
Need I remind you how poorly the Raiders D has performed the past 5 seasons under Ryan's watch?
Only in a flawed process would a DC who failed miserably be considered for a promotion. Yikes!
Here's a few stats on the D the last 2 years:
2008
Scoring 24.2 (24)
Yards per Game 360.9 (27)
Rushing yards per game 159.7 (31)
2007
Scoring 24.9 (26)
Yards per Game 341.6 (31)
Rushing yards per game 145.9 (31)
Bottom third in scoring, yards per game, and rushing D. OK ... let's promote Ryan!
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Calico Jack said...
Thanks Gary for showing your true colors as being a true blue, Davis apologist.
>>>>
You asked me a simple question, so I gave you a simple answer.
Sorry you didn't like the answer.
And BTW, I already posted all of SOB's stats pointing out how horrible he is... funny how my role as a Al Apologist (AA?) I would post such embarrassing stuff.
I guess I have latent ADDS or something? lol
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#1 He was alradey on the Raiders staff already. Was it a "courtesy" interview?
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Kinda funny way for a CEO to show courtesy... interviewing someone for a promotion knowing that you are going to hire someone out of company, and the new guy would end up working above him.
I guess that proves it! Al is crazy!
“Herrera said the conversation between Davis and Gilbride wasn't necessarily an interview.” Reportedly, it was out of courtesy because Gilbride contacted Davis.
Does Davis plan on interviewing anyone for HC or GM? So far, it doesn’t appear so. Every other team looking for a HC has contacted and interviewed at least one or two of the top prospects along with other viable candidates.
Meanwhile, Atlanta’s Mike Smith is AP coach of the year, just beating out Miami’s Tony Sparano for the honor. Both coaches were hired last year by then newly hired GMs and together (HC and GM) were able to completely turn around each respective franchise.
What a concept! But that couldn't possibly work for the Raiders. Right?
NY isn't it amazing? davis takes his sweet time hiring a coach. a COACH mind you - NOT a GTM. then claims he found the next 25 year old coaching prodigy while every other team gets their act together doing the right thing.
Don't completely jump on Gary, I said Rob Ryan also, before Gary did.
For the record, the Raiders front office said the phone interview, or talk depending on who you are reading, was because Gilbride's AGENT contacted them with interest. So, since Gilbride is a friend of Al's, and who isn't in the NFL, he did it out of courtesy.
H
H - so, officially, the Raiders have not approached nor spoken to any potential candidates for either the GM or the HC vacancies (Cable is a free man in 8 days!).
Wonder where this is going? Buckle up fellas. Another high-octane off-season of do-nothing except sign overpriced FAs (which we probably can't even do because of the last couple years of spending).
Did anyone here actually believe that Al Davis was going to completely change the way he interviews and make everything public - ultimately submitting a list to fans at Raider Take to vote on? Al is going to conduct interviews the way he always conducts interviews - behind closed doors and without public comment.
As for the misimpression that Al is always late with his hires, that's not true. The only hire I ever remember him being late on (not counting mid season hirings and firings) was Shell II.
Did somebody here think that the day the season ended a Bill Parcels clone was going to step up to the podium and say, "I'm running the Raiders now, and our next coach is... The envelope please..."
And yes, I noticed that Atlanta and Miami were much better this year. I guess that means that we have to copy what they did exactly because they've now proven that their way is the ONLY avenue to success. And, for sure, a couple of new teams will find the ONLY avenue to success next season as well. Perhaps one of them will be the Raiders.
Relax, guys! The playoffs haven't even really gotten underway yet, and ESPN has lots more lies to tell before we're done.
Blanda - IMO, it's a misguided notion to think Al Davis is conducting interviews behind closed doors.
It's not rocket science that a few top notch assistant coaches have been singled out as the leading prospects for vacant head coaching posts. It's also no mystery that the Raiders have not approached any of them and that Davis has not interviewed any of them for his soon-to-be-vacant head coaching slot.
To do so would require permission from teams in the playoffs and would certainly hit mainstream media, as it has for all the other teams now searching for a coach.
Nobody says he has to hire a HC immediately, but the process of due diligence has begun for every other team but the Raiders. IMO, we are presently getting a huge dose of a six-year status quo, and a repeatedly tested and failed process.
Don't get all excited because the Parakeets made the playoffs. I live in Atlanta and I've seen this before. Several times. Some here are calling in saying Matt Ryan is one of the top three QB's in the league after a decent rookie year.
The previous ownership brought in GM's who hired coaches. Never had two consecutive winning seasons. Dan Reeves finally took them to a Super Bowl as coach, but new ownership brought in Rich McCay as GM drafted Michale Vick, fired Reeves, hired Jim Mora, Jr. made the playoffs one year, didn't the next two. Fired him, hired Bobby Petrino. Vick went to prison, Petrino quit with two games left and snuck out of town in the middle of the night. The new GM and HC were not hired until a few weeks after the Super Bowl. And folks here are in some huge hurry?
They may have turned it around, but they have to prove it in more than just one season. It's a franchise that has never, repeat never, had two winning seasons in a row, but has had multiple consecutive losing seasons.
The window to interview folks has basically closed except for those teams eliminated for the playoffs. I'm sure a list has been compiled, and contacts will be made, but very little will be released by the front office. Never has.
I will assume nothing. I will watch the last game in its entirity at least two more times, and await the rumors.
H
Blandarocked,
yes, i actually expected some change from al davis this time.
his secret interviews, gruden aside, have been a total flop. unless you want to go all the way back to tom flores.
i expected, or hoped, al would look into possible GM candidates first, in order to finally help him get the right coach for a change.
and yes, i expected rob ryan would have been fired by now.
even al can see how bad the defense is....or can he ?
Davis may not be looking hard for a new HC because he's determined to retain Cable. A move I'd support. It could also be that he was interviewing Gilbride for a GM type position, and not for HC.
Terry Robiskie has served the last couple of seasons as WR coach for the Falcons. He's up for a new contract, and while there were always rumors that Al didn't like him, I always thought he was a pretty decent OC when he worked for Art Shell. He got them to the playoffs twice. Then Shell fired him for B&B, and we went 9-7. I think Robiski would be a good fit as Cable's OC.
Well, first off, I don't judge any player or coach by just their stats. As has been said many times, stats are losers. The Raiders obtained a large part of their fame because their teams historically had crappy stats, but they won anyway. I try compare individual games, both good and bad.
I don't care what the stats say. When Ryan's players played for him, the defenses worked. Look at the last two games. Ryan's defenses were fine in those games.
The thing about defensive stats is that they relay so heavily on the offense. If the offense is repeatedly giving you poor field position to defend, they are constantly turning the ball over, are failing to move the ball, or if they can't even hold on to the ball long enough to give the defense some rest, your defensive stats are going to suck. And don't tell me about Baltimore. There was nothing wrong with their offense except that they had a marginal QB. But that season he was a mistake free marginal QB.
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