The Stick'Em Pick'Em Draft Challenge
Okay, so now we know: We open the season at home on Monday night against the Chargers. Last time that happened, I was there, and it was akin to washing my eyes out with Clorox and garlic salt.
The season opener on Monday night against the Broncos two years later was equally scandalous and embarassing. Can we finally bring it on an opening Monday night against an AFC West rival? Well, we'll know sooner rather than later.
As for the rest of the schedule, when did the Texans join the AFC West? We play them every year now. I'm sure someone will bark at me about how this makes perfect sense according to the NFL's Pythagorean scheduling theorem. Thanks, but I don't want to hear it. Oh, and the Browns are back, too. At least we had a year off from them.
Meanwhile, when recently asked to compare John Marshall's defense to Rob Ryan's, Cable replied: "There will be a lot of similarity. Hopefully, we'll just be maybe a little more fundamentally sound, a little more structured."
Umm..."Similarity" isn't the word I'm looking for, Tom. We ranked 27th in total defense last year. Can we shoot for dissimilar? And what's with "little more" fundamentally sound? When we last saw your defense, it looked like toddler soccer, so a "little more structured" doesn't quite cut it. How about "a lot more structured?" Is that too much to ask? I didn't think so.
Anyhow, the draft is upon us, and I don't have a clue how it will shake out, which at least puts me on par with the experts in the mainstream media.
To be honest, I don't like college sports that much. March Madness is my annual nightmare, a place where sports talk goes to die for three weeks. In the fall, I'm too busy watching the Raiders during football season to care much about college football.
Then, before I know it, here comes April and the NFL draft and I'm supposed to watch YouTube videos of guys from Boston College and Texas Tech and start figuring out the draft order and predicting how it will unfold right up to the point that Mr. Davis grabs the phone.
Which brings me to my old pal Stick'Em, who sure knew how to Pick'Em. Back in 2006, he not only pegged Michael Huff as the seventh round pick going to the Raiders. He pegged the six picks leading up to the Raiders. I'm not kidding. He even had Mario Williams going to the Texans instead of Reggie Bush. His picks are immortalized in the comments section of this Take, three days before the 2006 draft.
So here we are, with the seventh pick in the draft again...Alas, Stick'Em is on an extended moratorium, so someone else will have to pick up the draft prognosticating slack.
Hence, the honorary Stick'Em Pick'Em draft challenge. Who will the Raiders pick, and how will it happen up to that point? Remember, whom you want the Raiders to pick may be immaterial to whom they will actually pick, as six preceding teams have some say in the matter.
Who will nail the first seven picks in the 2009 Draft? Will it be you? Let your picks rip and we shall see...
posted by Raider Take at 9:30 PM
230 Comments:
As far as having a new defense. It will still be AD's defense that we have seen for so long that other teams know it better than the Raiders do. With Cable's comments, it shows loud and clear that the coach has changed but the scheme won't. Just more proof that we are in for more of the same.
JONES
I will gladly take a stab at this "Stick'Em Draft Challenge:
Detroit: Stafford
St.Louis: Monroe
KC: Jason Smith
Seattle: Sanchez
Cleveland: Crabtree
Cincy: Andre Smith
Oakland: BJ Raji
I like this side of you RT!!!!! I hear ya!! Keep 'em comin'!!!!!
I don't like those comments either really
Jones,
I never said Gruden was actually looking at college positions. I said “his name” was being floated in connection with the positions and that, my friend, is truth. But, like I said, I wasn’t in the room. Your TRUTH thing doesn’t hold up in that case.
Chucky’s face always looked like that. How do you know he wasn’t looking at his family, or someone else in the press box? Maybe some erstwhile Tampa reporter said he was the wrong man for the job and he was looking at him. Just because you imagined he was looking at Al Davis doesn’t make it so.
How do you know Al Davis was desperate when he hired Gruden? It truly amazes me that folks can say with 100% certainty that something they have absolutely zero knowledge of is so. Even when evidence to the contrary is provided.
Also, show me the silence you claimed in your last post. As I look back it appears you have been countered on virtually every post. If we missed one or two, sorry that’s just the way it goes. As far as silence goes, I have asked for proof for your “Truth”. All I have heard thus far is crickets. You said “This is all proven, this is TRUTH, I know you guys don't like it, but that's the TRUTH.” If it’s all proven, just show us the proof, that’s all we ask.
Don’t claim to be the Guru of TRUTH when you can’t, or won’t, back it up. It’s all conjecture on your part and conjecture does not equal truth.
And, please, please show me these insults you are refering to. You were the one throwing around the “Three Stooges” comments. (By the way since I actually have a talking Three Stooges beer opener with Curly's voice on it, I get to be Curly.)
I believe it was Arkansas who asked if YOU could actually post a comment without an insult.
Bama,
Nice try with your last post, but I don’t get angry. It’s a game. I have more important things to waste energy being angry about. And, it appears you will never get this through your head that I, and Blanda, have actually criticized Al Davis on this site. We openly admit we respect the man, yes. What we don’t do is hold our breath and stomp our feet and say it’s all his fault, and when is the bad man going to go away.
Gary,
“Ad Hominem” brushing up on your Latin, good job.
Take,
I love football, college and pro. The lovely Mrs. H and I plan our weekend fall sojourns to the mountains around bye weeks and we gather with another couple to watch Alabama every Saturday. I have to brew extra beer in September. I agree completely with March Maddness. Never have been a basketball fan.
As for the draft, I wouldn’t even go there. It’s all a crap shoot as far as I’m concerned. I watch to see who we got, but that’s as far as it goes. I think Calico’s list is as good as anything I could come up with.
Glad to see you are back in the saddle again on a regular basis.
I also agree with “more structured.” That was one of my complaints about SOB’s defense. Too many people out of position. Currently it’s basically the same personnel so it may be easier to change structure as opposed to completely revamping the scheme, then work in major changes over time.
H
Bama7
Cable announcing the Marshall defense will be similar to what we saw last year is a clue that we're in for more of the same on defense. Not a good sign at all. Let me guess, we're also probably going to trot Sam Williams out at OLB again too.
Kudos to Stick 'em. here's my guess:
Detroit: Stafford
St Louis: Oher
KC: Orakpo
Seattle: Moreno
Cleveland: Maualuga
Cincy: Tyson Jackson
Oakland: I like Peria Jerry or Aaron Curry... but since I have to pick one I'll say Al goes with Jerry. (I like Jasper Brinkley in Rd 2 or 3)
I'll give it a shot...
DET - Stafford
STL - J.Smith
KC - Curry
SEA - Crabtree
CLE - Orakpo
CIN - Monroe
OAK - Michael Johnson, DE
Psycho (No that's not a JAX pick)
H:
It was "leaked" out of Alameda that Gruden was looking for college work, same game that AD used against Kiffin. Many AD lovers have used this as proof that these 2 coaches were insubordinate.
As far as you including yourself in the "3", you want to make it 4?
Gruden was looking up to AD's box, watch the game and know where AD was sitting. You have to be pretty dumb not to see it.
AD hired Gruden at a time when the team and himself were at an alltime low. Up to that point it was all AD's way, when he hired Gruden, he made concessions he had never made before. Like having a QB who wasn't very good at throwing over 20 yrds downfield, having an O that dink and dunk. It was a sign of AD in desperation mode, never in the history of the franchise had he done this. All those who know the Raiders can plainly see that, sorry you can't. It's just like his desperation of hiring Turner and Shell II, are you going to question that as well?
As far as the insults, check out the "3" and their posts to myself, you will clearly see them.
JONES
Yeah, I guess I've had no answer for your insightful comments, Jones. I'll just have to go away now. Maybe you'll have to wish me to the corn field. Never mind. It's an old joke.
Yeah, when Davis hired Gruden he was desperate and HAD to hire Gruden. Never mind that Al had interviewed Gruden for the job the year before, and was about to hire him when the players all said they wanted Bugel. Personally, I felt that Davis should have hired Gruden the year he hired Bugel. I thought that on the day that Bugel was announced.
Why, yes... it's true. I DO occasionally disagree with Al Davis. In regard to Gruden going to Tampa. Davis did the only thing he could do. He asked Gruden if he wanted to remain the Raiders HC. One of the first rules of business is never hire anyone to do a critical job they don't want to do. While I did want Gruden to remain, I didn't think holding him to his contract so he could bolt as soon as it was completed was a good idea.
And it's true. Gruden did say that he didn't pursue any college jobs. He did NOT say that offers weren't coming in and being publicized. But thanks for your strawman, Jones.
Personally, I think there are some changes brewing in Detroit. They seem far more careful than in the past. I'm going to predict that Detroit trades down. And I think we might as well. That's not the money pick, but that's the way I'm leaning.
Man, Jones, where do you get the time to make this crap up? Almost every Raider coach since Flores has been allowed to run his own offense. Shell's was different than Shanahan's, White's was different than Shell's, Bugel's was different from White's, Gruden's was different than Bugel's... oops, Callahan's was the same as Gruden's - until his second year.
Concessions he'd never made before? Eh, Stabler wasn't a strong armed QB. Neither was Marinovich, who he drafted in the first round. Also, Gruden didn't select Gannon. Hackett, who had coached Gannon, brought film to both Davis and Gruden and sold them both. Look around, Jones, Hackett still works for the team. He's currently coaching JaMarcus.
Here's a clue, Jones. Just because you can picture something in your head, that doesn't make it the truth.
Regarding the defense...
Folks can put whatever spin on Cable's comments that they want. But, to me, what he said was that he didn't feel the Raiders problems on defense were scheme, he thought that the problems were fundamentals and structure - which would back up the complaints many had here regarding SOB.
This falls in line with the idea that LBs shouldn't play 10 yards off the line of scrimmage (structure), and players shouldn't leave their attack lanes to free lance (fundamentals). But maybe that's just my infernal optimism.
Here's my stab:
1. Detroit: Mark Sanchez, QB, USC
2. St Louis: Jason Smith, OT, Baylor
3. KC: Michael Crabtree, WR, TXTech
4. Seattle: Matthew Strafford, QB, Georgia
5. Cleveland: Aaroun Curry, OLB, Wake Forest
6. Cincinnati: Michael Oher, OT, Ole Miss
7. Oakland: Alex Mack, C, Cal
8. Jacksonville: Jeremy Maclin, WR, Missouri
9. Green Bay: BJ Raji, DT, BC
10. San Fran: Rey Mauluga, MLB, USC
11. Buffalo: Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas
12. Denver: Clay Matthews, OLB, USC
13. Washington: Eugene Monroe, OT, Virginia
14. New Orleans: Malcom Jenkins, CB, Ohio State
15. Houston: Knowshawn Moreno, RB, Georgia
16. SD: Brian Cushing, OLB, USC
17. New York Jets: Percy Harvin, WR, Florida
18. Denver: Peria Jerry, DT, Miss
19. Tampa: Josh Freeman, QB, Kansas State
20. Detroit: James Larinaitus, LB, Ohio State
21. Philly: Beanie Wells, RB, Ohio State
22. Minnesota: William Beatty, OT, UConn
23. New England: Vontae Davis, CB, Illinois
24. Atlanta: Ron Brace, DT, BC
25. Miami: Darius Butler, CB, UConn
26. Baltimore: Brian Robiskie, WR, Ohio State
27. Indy: Fili Moala, DT, USC
28. Philly: Everette Brown, DE, Fl State
29. New York G-men (Trade with Oakland for 2nd Round pick, and Justin Fargas): Darius Heyward-Bey, WR, Maryland
30. Tennessee: Hakeem Nicks, WR, NC
31. Arizona: Brandon Pettigrew, TE, OK State
32. Pittsburgh: Duke Robinson, OG, Oklahoma
The rest of Oakland's picks:
3rd pick-Nic Harris, S, Oklahoma
4th pick-Pannel Egboh, DE, Penn State
5th pick (2nd 4th Round pick taken from Miami)-Cedric Dockery, OG, Texas
6th pick (6th Round)-Josh Mauga, MLB, Nevada
7th and final pick (7th Round)-Eric Vanden Heuvel, OT, Wisconsin
Nate, wow...
Somebody's been doing a lot of research and thinking. Don't know if that's how it will pan out, but there's nothing there that would surprise me. Very reasonable, both in regard to Davis' own tendencies and team needs.
My one point of disagreement is that I think it more likely for Cable and company to take an OT in the later rounds, and not an OG.
Nate,
Damn guy, I couldn’t even give you 32 names much less the top 32. Good job.
Blanda,
Only after you are turned into a giant Jack-in-the-Box. Damn we’re old.
Jones,
First of all, looking at a video of Gruden standing on the sidelines is not proof. I do not have the floor plan of the stadium, do not know where in the stadium the owners' boxes are, and cannot tell from television camera angles who or what he is looking at. Maybe you are just that much better than the rest of us at analyzing network video. Perhaps you should provide your credentials for this expertise.
Who is your source for Alameda leaking Gruden’s interest in those jobs? And, if up to that point it was all AD’s way, I guess those three Lombardi Trophies were pure accident. (Damn, there I go again living in the past). Speaking of which, Ken Stabler ran the west coast offense before it was called the west coast offense. His top receivers were Casper and Biletnikoff whose 40 could be timed with a calendar.
As for Kiffin, the source reporting to Al Davis that Kiffin was indeed looking into the Arkansas job has been attributed to Jerry Jones, Arkansas graduate, member of the search committee and friend of Al Davis.
You keep claiming truth, but when anyone asks for proof of this truth, you keep repeating the same statements over and over. Repeating a statement 100 times doesn’t make it is true, it makes it repetitive. The crickets are still waiting for your proof.
For someone who throws around insults, you sure are thin skinned. You’ve insinuated in your latest post that I’m dumb and don’t know the Raiders. Personally, I don’t want to “know” the Raiders the way you seem to do. Couldn’t stand to have my colon tied up like that all the time.
And, I believe if you check with Take or Calico, you might find my knowledge of the Raiders is pretty substantial. I would recommend Blanda, but you don’t believe anything he says anyway.
As for me being dumb, well maybe I ain't MESA material, however I will admit when I don’t know something, or I get something wrong. A trait you seem to have trouble with.
These things might be your conclusions, but in a court of law what you are demanding to be accepted as “Truth”, are called rumor and conjecture.
H
You guys are hilarious, when is anything you write able to stand up in court? Where is your proof behind your statements? You guys are so good at pointing the finger but you do the same as what you are pointing at. Stabler did not run the west coast, give me a break. His offense was the same as Flores, the same as Shell's, White's was a variation and Gruden's was completely different.
Don't you remember the 10 step drop, with the o-line holding blocks for 5+ seconds? Kenny throwing deep crossing routes and Branch down the sidelines? RB deep with that LB chasing behind? Don't you remember AD's slogan of "going for the big play, taking what we want"? This is nothing like Gruden's offense, but I know, you guys could make that sq peg fit into that hole because AD can do no wrong.
Gruden was sold on Gannon? Who made the decision to get him in? The HC you dummy. AD hates qb's who can't throw deep, Gruden wanted Gannon because he fit his offense to a TEE. You guys continue to rewrite history to fit your faux reality. Bama was right, you guys are so stuck in your own BS, maybe there is no hope for you.
JONES
Jones, you completely expose your ignorance by suggesting that all of those offenses were the same. That's the lazy media claim, and even Raider fans who hate Al Davis know that much isn't true. The whole rap on Stabler was that he didn't have a big arm, but he made up for it with short and medium range accuracy. Very similar to Gannon.
On one side you'll argue that Davis makes every player selection - but on the other -except for Gannon (the most important position on the field). Gruden, of course, made that selection. I guess the only player selection he was allowed to make, huh?
I get my information from the most unbiased sources I can find. That doesn't include Jim Rome, ESPN, Nancy Gay, Tim Kawakame, and several others. They have proven their Raider hate on a consistant basis. But, Jones, it seems like those are your PRIMARY sources.
Jones,
We don’t profess to be the Truth Guru, and which finger am I pointing. Don’t pull it, might not be pleasant. We disagree with your conclusions. You can’t seem to be able to handle it.
Have you ever talked to Stabler? I have, on two or three occasions. Got a picture of him, me and Daughter of H when she was 4. He describes the offense he ran as a “dink and dunk” offense to set up the deep pass. Then Branch would stretch the field and he would go back to “dink and dunk”. Said it drove the opposing defense crazy. Sounds pretty west coasty to me. It just wasn’t called West Coast. Sure there were some differences in the scheme implemented, but the philosophy was pretty much the same.
No, I don’t remember 10 step drops, I remember 3, 5 and 7 step drops. I don’t believe 10 step drops were in the playbook.
Madden said he would change up the offense and defense to fit the personnel.
In ’76 they changed defenses from a 4-3 to a 3-4 in season because of injuries on the DL. They ran a possession offense. I can’t remember the writer’s name, but one sports writer claimed Stabler was Montana before Montana.
H
Here goes my Sick'Em Pick'Em
Detroit: Matthew Stafford
St. Louis: Jason Smith
KC: Aaron Curry
Seattle: Eugene Monroe
Cleveland: Micahel Crabtree
Cincinnati: B.J. Raji
Oakland: Andre Smith (not who I want, my choice is to trade down, but after Cable's words he looks like the pick - GULP!)
Karma,
Could be a bait and switch. If Smith has cleaned up his act, he's a monster. My preference in your version of the draft would be Oher from Ole Miss.
H
The 1976 Raiders won the franchise’s first Super Bowl – and they did it with the best passing attack in franchise history, averaging a stunning 8.85 yards per attempt. To put that production into perspective, consider that Tom Brady and the record-setting 2007 Patriots averaged 8.28 yards per pass attempt.
The Raiders of 1967 to 1969 dominated the AFL, posting an incredible 37-4-1 record over the three seasons. Each year they were among the dominant passing teams in the league, averaging, respectively, 7.63, 8.06 and 7.69 yards per attempt.
AD's theory of streching the field, remember that? Or how bout the " we take what we want, not what they give us? Freddy B, a possession WR, Avg. over 15 yds/ ctch,Raymond Chester/ over 15yrds/ctch, Casper, over 13/yrds / ctch, Branch and Wells = deep threat.That is not west coast.
Watch and tell me Kenny wasn't throwing DOWNFIELD.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpxqM_8k9pw, doesn't look like Montana and his quick drop and dump does it?
Vertical game....Stretch the field..Take what we want..."can't win if we can't go deep" AD. No, you are wrong, it was the same offense Flores used with Plunkett, deep drops, throw downfield. Same offense Shell II tried to rekindle, you saw the results.
JONES
H
I'm with you on Oher. I think he's got all kinds of "upside" as he is still raw. Smith could be a beast but his act at the combine was shocking. I'm worried that he couldn't get motivated for a job interview with millions at stake and now he is going to be given a phat deal.
But I do think there is some serious "baiting" going on in the draft this yer for sure.
Draft Haiku:
Stick'Em Pick'Em Take.
Aaron Curry falls to sev'
in my pipe dream draft.
Jones... Do you know when Stabler played and when Lamonica played? Do you understand that yards per reception over the course of the season has as much to do with yards gained after the catch as the point of reception? Do you understand that the point of the West Coast offense is to create opportunity for yards gained after the catch?
Nobody said Stabler COULDN'T throw long. Nobody has ever said that Gannon could not throw long. It's just that their best game was medium to short routs. Part of the reason for the West Coast offense is to draw the defense in close so you can have your speed receiver get past the defense so the long bomb doesn't have to be as accurate.
But you're right about '67 - '69, even though it was Lamonica who QBed those teams. Those teams WERE all about deep passing. In fact the whole AFL was pretty much founded on deep passing. That was the hook to draw viewers from the NFL. But after the merger, the Raiders had to go a little more mainstream (I guess Gruden engineered the merger). Lamonica could no longer score inside the red zone because he wasn't accurate on short and medium range passing. That's when Stabler took over and the offense changed as a result. That was Madden's doing.
The offense changed again under Flores when we traded Stabler to Houston and Plunkett ultimately became QB. That's because Plunkett's best game was the deep ball. After that, we never again had a quality QB until Gannon.
There is a much stronger argument to be made that the Raiders' fortunes have always fallen on the quality of their QB, rather than whether or not Al Davis or any of the coaches are responsible for all of the losing. That is why so much is placed on Russell's shoulders. Will he be our next Plunkett or our next Kerry Collins?
Gannon couldn't throw over 20 yrds., 20 yrds and in he was very accurate = Gruden's offense. Stabler was good to avg on deep balls, his strength was med range passing. Lamonica and Stabler played the same offense, same offense that Plunkett played. The first coach to try and change the Raider offense was CANNED = shannyrat. Art brought back the AD Offense. White adjusted the O a little, bugel did what he was told = Jeff George = AD's kind of QB. Gruden came in and COMPLETELY changed the offense, the first time in over 30 yrs. AD wanted it gone when Cally was dumped.
This is when AD wanted the vision of his team, no longer has he gone away from it. Remember when he hired Shell II and AD went on and on about returning to oldtime Raiders and people like you creamed your jeans? Remember how that went? It was so outdated it was shameful. Welcome to the real world.
JONES
Nice rewrite of history, Jones. But Madden made several scheme adjustments over his career on both offense and defense. So did Flores. Further, White's offense was almost pure West Coast. He was a deciple of Bill Walsh for cryin' out loud. Of course, the fact is, Bill Walsh was a deciple of Al Davis. Fact is that White convinced Davis that he needed to fire Shell and copy the West Coast offense like everyone else in the league was doing.
Bugel tried to go back to the early AFL offense the Raiders used in the late 60's. His problem was that he had no ball control offense and no leader at QB. Under Bugel, the Raiders would either get a quick TD or 3 and out. That had the effect of tiring out the defense before the end of the first half.
Shell's problem wasn't the type of offense he chose for his return, his problem was his blind loyalty to a man who hadn't been on a football field in 15 years and the fact that he made horrible selections for his assistant coaches.
the raiders have had a very common sense off season.
so, keeping with the trend, i say the pick will be one of the 0-linemen available at #7.
tom cable is an 0-line coach, so it's common sense again for the raiders.
as far as the comments by cable about the defense.
we can only hope he's lying through his teeth.
otherwise, it's bad news for the defense.
Also, Jones, it wasn't Davis that changed the offense under Callahan. Callahan changed it his second year. I think we're into the internet years here, so you can go back and look for articles reporting on PLAYER complaints that Callahan was insisting on changing the entire offensive scheme because of the Super Bowl loss. Gannon complained about it, Brown complained about it, and several others.
When Turner came in, he did NOT run the old Davis offense from the 60s. He ran Turner's own offense. The same one that keeps getting him hired as OC around the league. Kiffin was allowed his own offense as well. The nonsense about Davis demanding the same offense year after year has been thouroughly debunked.
Now days, because of a statement made by Kiffin, the word is that Davis insists on the same tired defense year after year. You're behind the times, Jones. Time to catch up with current Davis criticism.
"Meanwhile, when recently asked to compare John Marshall's defense to Rob Ryan's, Cable replied: "There will be a lot of similarity. Hopefully, we'll just be maybe a little more fundamentally sound, a little more structured."
Umm..."Similarity" isn't the word I'm looking for, Tom. We ranked 27th in total defense last year. Can we shoot for dissimilar? And what's with "little more" fundamentally sound? When we last saw your defense, it looked like toddler soccer, so a "little more structured" doesn't quite cut it. How about "a lot more structured?" Is that too much to ask? I didn't think so. "
Yeah, I can understand your basic gripe, but it seems like he's trying to be diplomatic and avoid any Callahan-esque moments. Saying we need to be "a little more" fundamentally and structurally sound is just a nice way of saying it. If he answers the question by yelling and screaming about the former staff and pretty much saying "we looked like a bunch of assholes" then he could piss somebody off. I'll bet there's still a lot of players and staff that believe in Rob Ryan's scheme. It's much easier to answer in a fairly milquetoast fashion.
By the way, this JONES fellow is a riot. Is he a Raiders fan? Is he not? We'll never know. Hey, ask him how Norv Turner was able to change the defense to a 3-4 even though we were completely ill-equipped for it if Al Davis is such a tyrant.
Good point, Pat. In fact SOB's first season is when SOB started coverting every D-Lineman in the building to an OLB, destroying a few careers in the process.
But I'm sure that Jones will tell you that's just an Al Davis smoke screen to make SOB fail, so Davis could come in and save the day with his own defense. And even though he wanted SOB to fail, he had to keep him around because Kiffin wanted him to go. And that means that Kiffin wouldn't fail if he got his own way.
God, my head hurts... How do people think up this crap?
Jones... Davis complainers on this site have long given up on the notion that Davis sets out to destroy his team every year for his own agrandizement. That argument never really made sense to anybody.
Folks here have moved to the far more legitimate point of view that Davis has done a very poor job of selecting his head coaches and he has failed to bring in a long term GM to insure the influx of quality personnel. I even agree with a large part of that criticism. I've even argued some of it myself. So has H, and so has Gary. We are all capable of criticising Al if the criticism has merrit.
Regarding Cable's comments on the defense, I don't think it's too risky to send strong signals of substantive change and heightened expectations. He's worried about offending a player or two? It should be the other way around.
Easy for me to say, but here's what I'd like him to say:
The scheme will be similar, because we believe in the scheme. But I'll tell you what, we'll be a lot more disciplined and structured in running it. I believe we're a lot better than 27th in defense. I expect to see a big difference in our defensive performance going forward.
I get totally lost every time I read about multi-year, successive DC's being forced to run AD's defense.
AD wants a couple of things on defense:
1. shut down corners - but, hey, so did Shanahan with Champ and Dre. And nobody ever accused Shanahan of running AD's defense.
2. The Quarterback Must Go Down-hard. Well, hell, Batdude-like thats original. So Tom Coughlin runs AD's defense?
3. No blitzing. Whoa, anybody remember all the corner and safety blitzing done in the glory years. And wasn't it Woodson who knocked the ball lose on a corner blitz in the infamous Tuck Rule game?
I think Davis gets far too much blame in what the defensive schme is.
I simply hated SOB's defense - it was easily the most undisciplined, embarassing effort (for 5 years!) I've ever seen.
Running backs that only their agents knew (ot their mothers) would hit the hole or turn the corner only to find no Raider defender anywhere in sight.
Davis' biggest problem had been in signing the biggest name and then not having that guy fit the Man to Man system: Larry Brown and last year's disaster, DeAngelo Hall.
This year's quiet restocking of depth has me feeling positive about my team.
And I like what I see in Cable. I know the proof is in winning, but so far he reminds me of Madden - an in the trenches, no BS guy that gets his players to play his system - or else.
Take, I understand, but talk is cheap. Remember Bugel was full of that kind of talk and we wound up 4-12.
Wowsa, I thought I would be the only one who thought of Mack and the Raider's pick. Just goes to show...
:-)
I admit to knowing next to nothing about the draft this year, that's what disconnecting satellite tv will do. And it's probably a little high for him, but I think (and yes I'm biased) he's the best OLine in the draft.
I also could see the Raider trying to get Crabtree though.
Oline or WR I'd actually be happy with either position getting the call.
And to add a bit to the din, I think another major mark against the Raiders, and for argument's sake I'm going to say it's in Mr. Davis' court since he's alluded to this, is our weak drafting. I'd say it's the number one reason we've failed so spectacularly over close to a decade. Perhaps bad drafts are an offshoot of having no GM and bad coaches.
Anyway here's to turning the page, may the Raider's turnabout come quickly.
According to PFT, the Philidelphia Turkeys are very interested in Andre Smith. That could be why Cable seemed so high on him in his press conference. Perhaps they (The Fighting Green Turkeys) would be willing to part with their 2 lower first round picks for our #7 and a clear shot at Smith. With two picks in the lower first we could cover two positions of need.
Other than the D-angelo game in Denver, and the meltdown against the Pats, I thought our D played relatively well, and it was usually just a few blown plays that killed us (i.e, overpersute and not maintaining your gap type stuff). And then playing soft when you needed a big play from the D. And even if the D would get completely changed around, Cable would still say the same thing. Let the compitition figure out what changes in our D, don't just tell them.
How do you know Gruds wasn't looking at Jim Otto? I wish Take's Takes wouldn't get hijacked with crap so much.
H,
A-day game is at 2pm (central) on ESPN. If you see a black Stabler jersey in the crowd, it's me. Atleast we know for sure the Tide will win this one :-)
Detroit: Sanchez
St.Louis: Jason Smith
KC: Crabtree
Seattle: Stafford
Cleveland: Curry
Cincy: Crabtree
Oakland: Andre Smith
Man, I don't know. Just pissing in the wind with these guesses.
One thing for sure, there will definately be a few guys worth of the 7th pick, and more than one of them will be a need position for us. I didn't pick Smith because of what Cable said. He played great for Saban (who didn't recruit him), and I think he'll love playing for Cable.
-moshbucket
PS: walterfootball.com has a draft pick contest with $350 prize. no affiliation here.
Jones' pressbox stare theory is the equivalent of the JFK grassy knoll or Kramer's magic looey. It is so ridiculously far fetched that it is amusing.
On my draft picks ...
I think Cleveland will take Crabtree after trading Braylon Edwards to the NY Giants. It would not suprise me in the least if we take one of the following with our #7 pick:
Andre Smith, OT, Alabama
Darius Heyward-Bey, WR, Maryland
Michael Oher, OT, Ole Miss
Alex Mack, C, Cal
BJ Raji, DT, BC
Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas
BTW, RaiderNate, good job on the picks but didn't you leave Andre Smith off? And Eugene Monroe at #13? Do you know something we don't know since Monroe is a sure fire top 3 pick.
As far as the D goes ...
We need some minor adjustments in scheme (LBs closer to the LOS), big improvements in our discipline and technique, and more aggressive playcalling (blitz packages).
The D needs to address some serious shortcomings; lack of depth on DLine, limited pass rush, lack of exotic blitz schemes, questionable (or unproven) play from the safeties, a hard nosed, missle seeking SLB.
The only way this D sees a significant bump in performance is (1) an infusion of talent (2) and if collectively the unit plays in harmony ... where the sum is greater than the parts. The proverbial "everyone is on the same page" as far as responsibilities. DC Marshall needs this unit to have 1 heart beat ... sorry for all the cliches but you get my drift. CJ :D
Oh yeah, as far as the schedule ... I love it.
San Diego Chargers
at Kansas City Chiefs
Denver Broncos
at Houston Texans
at New York Giants
Philadelphia Eagles
New York Jets
at San Diego Chargers
BYE WEEK
Kansas City Chiefs
Cincinnati Bengals
at Dallas Cowboys
at Pittsburgh Steelers
Washington Redskins
at Denver Broncos
at Cleveland Browns
Baltimore Ravens
It doesn't get much better than opening on MNF at home vs. the Chargers and following up that game with our other 2 bitter divisional rivals.
It is great that we have the bye week in week 9. Our season is split exactly in half. No back to back east coast swings either. And last but not least, once again we play the SB Champions. Sweet!
Bama7
Alas, even the wise old Calico dumps on poor Jonesy.
Calico, your passion has been neutered by Blanda and Co.
Jones, I alone feel your pain. True Raider fans have been cheated for twenty years. Jones, you and I rage against the ineptness of our beloved organization and yet others make fun of us for our passion.
H says, "I don’t get angry. It’s a game. I have more important things to waste energy being angry about."
H you aren't me. You obviously weren't the 12 year old kid crying because the Orange Crush beat us in the '77 AFC championship. You obviously weren't the college kid that almost had to be committed because of uncontrolled rage caused by the fact that we couldn't stop Craig James and that weird running play New England kept nailing us with in 1986's playoff game. You obviously weren't the same fan that suffered through the 3-51 Bills beat down that took me 3 weeks to shake. You obviously weren't the married father of two that nearly had a coronary watching as our Raider defense turned to butter, allowing Andre Rison to crush our hearts on MNF in the ninties. You weren't the same fan that watched in horro as Derrick Thomas repeatedly sacked our QB on MNF in KC. What'd he end up with... 8 sacks while we ran the same damn 'drop 7 yards and look for the bomb play' over and over? H, you weren't the fan that nearly had a stroke watching the Chargers absolutely f^%*ing humiliated us on MNF a few years back. You weren't the fan that needed Valium to go to sleep last year when Denver and some clowns named Royal & Cutler did a Montana/Rice impersonation at our expense on MNF.
No, H can take it or leave it. Doesn't bother him at all.
Well it does bother me H. I became cynical. Cynical of an owner that no longer understands the game and is too dang proud to admit it and let others come in and correct things. Then he finally gets a winner (gruden) and destroys it because he's not getting the credit.
It's called having passion for something. Passion for S&B. I wish I could take it and leave it like H can(why even comment religously on a board such as this if it really doesn't matter to you?)
Yeah, I'm unhappy. And spending yet another offseason spinning how I think, maybe, just maybe, possibly, if I wish really hard and distort how things really are, that things are actually changing for the better, just doesn't heal my passion.
>>>
Jones:
As far as the insults, check out the "3" and their posts to myself, you will clearly see them.
>>>
This kinda reminds of a quote from an old Cheech and Chong movie... "Everytime I do cocaine you give me shit about doing cocaine."
Usually the people that post thoughtful, reasonable, and verifiable posts without insults receive the same in return... regardless of which "side" it comes from.
Anyone that makes outrageous OPINION based comments and especially while calling anyone that disbelieves them an idiot is pretty much going to get called out on it here.
Sorry.
A fact is not based on how strongly you state your opinion.
Its kinda crazy actually.
>>>>
RT:
The scheme will be similar, because we believe in the scheme. But I'll tell you what, we'll be a lot more disciplined and structured in running it. I believe we're a lot better than 27th in defense. I expect to see a big difference in our defensive performance going forward.
>>>>
That sounds PERFECT, but WADR, Cable is not the DC.
That is something our DC should be saying if asked the same question.
From the little I have seen from Cable... I cannot believe he would be a believer in a passive, predictable SOB defense... I have high hopes.
Calico,
Don’t tell anybody but it was some guy named Oswald.
Mossbucket,
I’ll keep a look out. I went to a few home games and would show up in an Alabama hat and Raiders shirt and go say Hi to Snake by the Chimes on the Quad. Just a quick stop to shake his hand. He was usually mobbed but treated everyone like he had known them all his life. The conversations came in more relaxed areas. Even if he didn’t remember you he would say he did.
Jones,
I’m not denying they didn’t go deep. What I’m saying is it wasn’t the primary passing strategy as everyone says it was. Stats are one thing, but I’ll take Stabler’s word over the stats. He was calling the plays. Branch was phenomenal. It was his talent that opened things up underneath for Freddy and The Ghost.
Hell, Jerry Rice would average 20+ per catch in a West Coast Offense. There was a term invented in the 80’s called Yards After Catch. Primarily because of Rice. While he averaged 20+ in a season where he rarely caught the ball more than 15 yards from scrimmage. They even invented a stat/term for folks like him, Yards After Catch. It wasn’t used in ’76 that I am aware of.
One of the primary differences is a heavier reliance in throwing to the backs and the use of screen passes, Tom Rathman and Roger Craig would combine for well over 100 receptions. Many of them caught behind the line of scrimmage. Whereas the year you point out Mark van Egan, Clarence Davis and Pete Banaszak combined for less than 60. Craig actually caught more than Rice one year. Think Charlie Garner with Gannon.
Besides, if you are so up on that offense why are you ragging on Al for being forced to change.
Like I said, Stabler himself used the description and he was calling the plays. One of the reasons Davis decided to trade him was to get a stronger arm at quarterback. Pastorini only lasted 4 ½ games. Plunkett came in and even though he had a good arm, his leading receiver was the tight end, Christensen. Hardly a speed demon.
Bama,
You’re right. I wasn’t that 12 year old. I was a 27 year old college sophomore after six years in the Army, having been called “Baby Killer” in the San Francisco International Airport. I became the husband whose wife tried to miscarry at 6 months then grew into the father who held his daughters hand while she lay in a hospital bed and the doctors couldn’t tell me what was wrong with her. She’s married now and doing well, but has to take 250 – 300 pills a month.
Yeah, I’ve been disappointed over the years, but the sun came up the next day, my wife and I will soon celebrate our 35th anniversary and hopefully we will have grandchildren soon.
I am passionate about the Raiders, but not obsessed. Yes I can be cynical about things but not football. There are more important things for me to be angry about and thankful about. I’m still pissed about that “Baby Killer” thing.
Sorry, but you shared your reasons, those are mine.
H
This just in.
Madden has retired. New GM/Consultant????
I think I started that rumor in December/January timeframe.
H
Madden is retiring saying he wants to stay home, which IIRC, is close to Oakland. I wouldn't be surprised if he helps out Al in an advisory type situation just to stay close to the action and as long as he doesn't do any traveling.
It would be awesome!
Damn, H, did you have to break out the Tac Nukes? I think that just ended the argument over how important a game is.
FWIW, I'm still pissed about the "baby killer" thing, and I was a baby during Tet. (1 Feb, 67) Thanks again for your service.
---Jeff
Gary, I totally agree. That would friggin' rock the Casbah.
Could you imagine seeing John Madden at the HOT, stoking the fires and motivating the team?
I think the next few years will be pretty damn good.
JMHSO
---Jeff
Arkansas,
It was nothing against Bama. I actually admire people who are that passionate about some things in their lives. I just can't do it over football.
It's just that I got into an argument with a guy who was ragging on Vets last week. I have a friend I went through six months training with, his name is on a wall. I have two other friends who went into North Vietnam to rescue POW's in a little operation called the Son Tay Raid. I was actually taking out my frustration against that clown.
Appoligizes to all for losing it.
H
H, I thank you for your service as well. I spent a lot of that war speaking out against it. Many of my friends went off to fight, some volunteered. A couple of my friends are "Winter Soldiers." But many who showed up at protests and rallies were followers who had no idea why they were even there, other than to be seen. As you know, I'm not a big fan of ignorance - by anybody.
It shames me that you were so abused in my own home airport. Let me be the one to personally apologize to you, to ask your forgiveness, along with my hope that such will allow you to forever put that experience behind you.
As for Bama... Why are all your memorable Raider moments bad ones? And if they are, why are you a Raider fan? In my era there was the Immaculate Reception, but I don't dwell on it. I dwell on the Holy Roller play and the Sea of Hands play. I guess that's the difference between a half full and half empty kind a guy.
Blanda,
No appologizes needed. I've put it pretty much behind me. It's just it wasn't just me he was talking about, but my friends. Some of whom didn't come back.
Two months later I met the future Mrs. H and the rest is history. Ya gotta take the good with the bad.
H
Hey, what kind of Madden rumors can we start.
I think a year or so ago, we were throwing out all kinds of things. Like, Madden was actually the man behind the throne. And that he went off in the mid 80's, came back in '98. Then left after the Super Bowl thinking things were stable, and was poised for a return.
Sounds as good as anything and a lot more fun.
H
Bama:
I don't RAGE, it makes me laugh that these socalled know it all Raider fans in here still go on and on how good things are in Alameda. How positive it all is and damn all those who may actually question what is happening. On this site, it is the same thing every year. During the off season, the same ole crew goes on and on about how it's all turned around. Then once the season starts and it all falls apart, they go on and on how it is someone other than AD's fault.
If it is ever pointed out to them that there is a major flaw in Alameda and it is the guy who is calling the shots...... here comes the "why are you a Raider fan"? or " he has forgotten more than you know" or " he has 3 Super Bowls". All the while, the franchise set HISTORY for being crap.
How dare we question AD, how dare we want change when " everything is fine" or "You want to be like other franchises?" These guys like living in the past, they hate change, this is why they don't grow as human beings.
Let them be what they want, they will stick in their mud until the water rushes over their head. All the while saying " in AD we trust". They worship another man like he is God himself, not knowing that he is just as mortal as us all.
AD is human, he can fail and he is failing. All the while WE LOSE, but they don't care about losing, they just want to worship AD.
JONES
Madden....
The possibilities will never die..."MrD" said he had a man in view but he was committed and could NOT be talked about at the time and that he had local connection....He did NOT retire immediately after the "SB" but instead waited so it will NOT appear as though he retired to take a Raider position....Very clever...
So how many phone conversations have taken place while he has had his input in the interim...
ON-Board in time for the draft????....Let's all hope so....
AnnoAss....JONES....
Your imagined moment of silence is rediculas....Sense I last posted I have traveled farther -n- and lived more than you would dare while hiding in your freakin closet....
Just a very simple point of expression...
If on one hand you state the "O" is the same as it has always been under "MrD" and on the other you state the "O" was changed by that same "MrD" with coach Calihan than obviously your no more than a "Schizoid Paranoiac" -n- "Brain Dead" at birth which is obvious from what you write....
Conflict....
As fast as it started it was over so now I'm safely in Bangkok...Everyone shook hands and went home while they load up for the next event....No doubt I will be affected again but no need to fret...Just deal with it as it happens....
H -n- Arky....
I was Navy..Gunners Mate...Discharged 5-18-71....Than in "92" I earned a commission under the Coast Guard to serve as Master/Mate Inspected in a NON military capacity...
The service has changed substantially...Did you know that the U. S. Coast Guard now patrols most waters of the world....Even within 200 mi of other nations...They are now part of "Homeland Security" and an international police force with far too much authority....That may escalate in the so called "New World Order"....
"RT"...
I will try to put the rest together later when I have had time to take a larger view of what going to happen...But as for now I will simply state what I have stated before....
If the "Crab" is on the board he becomes a Raider....If NOT....Look to the positions which have NOT yet been selected because "MrD" won't select the second best player at any position this high in the draft....
I would NOT be surprised to see us take an "ILB" from USC...In Fact I would like it....
Some of the players projected to be taken by the Raiders as high as #7 don't merritt that pick....They have too many weak sides and are not complete players at their positions...One dimensional or undersized or lack speed...They may be the best this draft has to offer at their positions of need but NOT worthy of such a high pick as shown by previous drafts....In a deep class they would be later 1st rd picks or 2nd rd....
"C" is rarely a 1st rd pick....High ranked "G"s also don't go until the late 1st rd or early 2nd rd in typical drafts...That's why I say Gallery for the price is a partial "Bust" because typically a "G" is not worth that type of money or draft value....
Thus it's my statement that if an "OT" has already been taken before the 7th pick we will NOT be selecting for the "OL" with that pick...
NO available "DL" player is adequately equipped to be worthy of the #7 pick....Clarification...The projected "OL-DE" will most certainly already be off the table...
NO available "OLB" will be worthy of the #7 pick...The best at that position will already be off the table...
"QB"-n-"RB"-n-"TE" will NOT be considerations for the 1st rd....
Thus the ONLY "O" position player who will be selected is the top rated "WR" if still available....
On the "D" it will boil down to "ILB" -or- "CB" regardless of specific need...."S" is NOT a position normally selected this high and we already have invested a kings ransom in Huff who has up till now failed to produce as expected....But than again it took Nnamdi several years to come into his own and the "DC" could be responsible for part of the failure so it's still "Wait-n-See"....
On the "DL" last year "SOH" is the only player who has lived up to his billing and damn worth the pick...That class was rated higher than this one so I don't expect to see the "DL" taken as high this year....
Projection:....
The "Crab"...A total player...
USC "ILB"....A total player...
"CB" Ohio....A total player and you should read this before you dismiss the idea as reticules...
Fourth year as a starter in 2008 ... the leading contender for the Thorpe Award ... first-team all-Big Ten as a sophomore and junior ... usually plays on the wide side of the field but often moves around the field to cover the opponent’s best receiver ... is a natural corner with great instincts and outstanding speed and quickness ... excels at man-to-man coverage ... has been timed at 4.3 in the 40-yard dash.
Let me re-post this again....
excels at man-to-man coverage ... has been timed at 4.3
PantyRaider....AnyBody's Guess!!!/_
Whoever Punty says AD should draft...I say, don't draft him.
JONES
Moron....By Definition....
JONES.....
Madden....
The possibilities will never die..."MrD" said he had a man in view but he was committed and could NOT be talked about at the time and that he had local connection....He did NOT retire immediately after the "SB" but instead waited so it will NOT appear as though he retired to take a Raider position....Very clever...
So how many phone conversations have taken place while he has had his input in the interim...
ON-Board in time for the draft????....Let's all hope so....
AnnoAss....JONES....
Your imagined moment of silence is rediculas....Sense I last posted I have traveled farther -n- and lived more than you would dare while hiding in your freakin closet....
Just a very simple point of expression...
If on one hand you state the "O" is the same as it has always been under "MrD" and on the other you state the "O" was changed by that same "MrD" with coach Calihan than obviously your no more than a "Schizoid Paranoiac" -n- "Brain Dead" at birth which is obvious from what you write....
Conflict....
As fast as it started it was over so now I'm safely in Bangkok...Everyone shook hands and went home while they load up for the next event....No doubt I will be affected again but no need to fret...Just deal with it as it happens....
H -n- Arky....
I was Navy..Gunners Mate...Discharged 5-18-71....Than in "92" I earned a commission under the Coast Guard to serve as Master/Mate Inspected in a NON military capacity...
The service has changed substantially...Did you know that the U. S. Coast Guard now patrols most waters of the world....Even within 200 mi of other nations...They are now part of "Homeland Security" and an international police force with far too much authority....That may escalate in the so called "New World Order"....
"RT"...
I will try to put the rest together later when I have had time to take a larger view of what going to happen...But as for now I will simply state what I have stated before....
If the "Crab" is on the board he becomes a Raider....If NOT....Look to the positions which have NOT yet been selected because "MrD" won't select the second best player at any position this high in the draft....
I would NOT be surprised to see us take an "ILB" from USC...In Fact I would like it....
Some of the players projected to be taken by the Raiders as high as #7 don't merritt that pick....They have too many weak sides and are not complete players at their positions...One dimensional or undersized or lack speed...They may be the best this draft has to offer at their positions of need but NOT worthy of such a high pick as shown by previous drafts....In a deep class they would be later 1st rd picks or 2nd rd....
"C" is rarely a 1st rd pick....High ranked "G"s also don't go until the late 1st rd or early 2nd rd in typical drafts...That's why I say Gallery for the price is a partial "Bust" because typically a "G" is not worth that type of money or draft value....
Thus it's my statement that if an "OT" has already been taken before the 7th pick we will NOT be selecting for the "OL" with that pick...
NO available "DL" player is adequately equipped to be worthy of the #7 pick....Clarification...The projected "OL-DE" will most certainly already be off the table...
NO available "OLB" will be worthy of the #7 pick...The best at that position will already be off the table...
"QB"-n-"RB"-n-"TE" will NOT be considerations for the 1st rd....
Thus the ONLY "O" position player who will be selected is the top rated "WR" if still available....
On the "D" it will boil down to "ILB" -or- "CB" regardless of specific need...."S" is NOT a position normally selected this high and we already have invested a kings ransom in Huff who has up till now failed to produce as expected....But than again it took Nnamdi several years to come into his own and the "DC" could be responsible for part of the failure so it's still "Wait-n-See"....
On the "DL" last year "SOH" is the only player who has lived up to his billing and damn worth the pick...That class was rated higher than this one so I don't expect to see the "DL" taken as high this year....
Projection:....
The "Crab"...A total player...
USC "ILB"....A total player...
"CB" Ohio....A total player and you should read this before you dismiss the idea as reticules...
Fourth year as a starter in 2008 ... the leading contender for the Thorpe Award ... first-team all-Big Ten as a sophomore and junior ... usually plays on the wide side of the field but often moves around the field to cover the opponent’s best receiver ... is a natural corner with great instincts and outstanding speed and quickness ... excels at man-to-man coverage ... has been timed at 4.3 in the 40-yard dash.
Let me re-post this again....
excels at man-to-man coverage ... has been timed at 4.3
PantyRaider....AnyBody's Guess!!!/_
bama7
H, it's a football board and we've all had our tragedies, let downs and bad experiences. I'll bow out now if you're going to argue that way. Remember, you don't know the lives of others on this board. some of us don't show our personal sides. I'll leave it at that and bid you adieau. No nukes for me.
Not sure how it happened but I double posted....
Stepped out to re-fuel at "7-11"...pushed the "Re-Fresh" button...Must have been stuck in a "Time-Warp" lost in "CybeSpace"...
SO....Um!!!....What the hell did he just say....Was that a "Shadow-Post" or what....
Panty,
Thanks for your service. My father was a Coastie in WWII attached to the Navy, Pacific Theater. Saw some heavy stuff.
Jones,
No one has demanded you be all hunky dorey about things. I don't think Blanda, Calico, Arkansas or Panty is either (if I missed anyone appologizes). We've all had our criticisms of Raider HQ and it's Fearless Leader (a little Bullwinkle reference for all the old guys).
But, we see positive moves that sure as hell beat what has gone on the last six years. You seem to be saying nothing positive has happened.
It certainly appears on the surface you want nothing less than Al Davis' head on a platter. It ain't going to happen.
We remember the good times more than the bad (well except for recent history). But you seem to want to pull us into the dungeon of despair. We don't want to join you there. And, if we disagree with your opinion we will post that disagreement. If you disagree with us, post it.
None of us here have been in 100% agreement on anything except it's a lot more fun when the Raiders are winning. Some of us believe that will start happening fairly soon.
Bama,
You don't have to bow out. You gave your reasons for feeling the way you do. You seemed to wonder why I felt the way I did. I gave mine. Yes, it is a a football site, but my reasons for my feelings about the game have nothing to do with the game itself, so I had to step outside.
I even posted a subsequent apology saying I actually admired your passion. It was not an argument it was a reason, the foundation for my half full attitude.
To you it's a little more than a game and you told us why. To me it's a game and I said why. Yep, we all have our personal tragedies and stories. That's mine, I appologize for losing it that way. But, it's out there for good or bad, and I won't go that way again.
Ok, lets hear the Madden rumors.
H
Calico,
I did leave off Andre Smith. With his issues, I don't think a team is going to pay first round money for him. They can get him cheaper in the 2nd round, and not waste so much on a head case.
His stock is going to drop hard, It wouldn't surprise me if Stafford and Sanchez's drop too. It is the year of the O-line and D-line.
H :
Whos cares what you think. Yeah some good things happened the last 6 years and the 15 before Gruden.
Let's go over them....Art Shell gets the team into the playoffs, winning 2 games in 6 years, riding Bo's back and a fairly good defense. Except for the "prevent defence" that AD loves, preventing us from winning.
Umm, nothing until Gruden comes along, 3 good years. With a team that showed an offense we had never witnessed with the Raiders, that was new. AFC championship ( Cally), AFC Title gm, robbed of an AFC Title gm, Tuck .
Ahhhhh, well after that it is very thin, Aso,Fargas? uhh, we hire a young guy who seems to be going in a good direction, uhhh AD blows it out of the water again.....
You got me, what else should we be excited or proud of?
JONES
Nate,
Forget the draft. When is Madden showing up for work at Alameda. (Just Kidding).
H
H....
No Bodder Brodder!!!....
Emotion is part of the game and if someone can't handle it on-n-off the field than let them curb their "Wagging Tongue" which is what stirs the emotions in the 1st damn place....
Reminds me of a School-Yard....
That sick-assed little fat-boy with the snout running down his chin made me disgustingly sick when I wanted to eat so I slapped him up-along-side the scull and sent him Out-a-Site....
Than after he cried to the teacher that "PR" hit him than all hell broke loose as that bitch comes around the corner with the "VP" in a heated flurry just in time to see me imitating that fat kid and laughing my ass off...
So the ending is apparent....The squeaky wheel gets the attention even though it was that damn wheel that caused the problems in the first damn place....
So...In Conclusion....
Just tell that fat bitch to wipe His/Her nose and put a bridle on that tongue (Fingers on the key-board) if they can't with stand a little "EMOTION" from time to time....
I dig what you have to say Bro and don't see anything that merritts regret...Just from my personal perspective...As for the "Shadows-o-Darkness"....Well....We already know what they are so why bother...Let them waste away in their despair and get on with the up-n-coming Raiders....
PantyRaider....Just Draft Baby!!!/_
Jones,
You don't care what I think. Then just why in the hell do you keep arguing with me. I'm not going to give in just because you don't care what I think.
You argue your point, I'll argue mine. I've made it a point not to insult anyone here.
I took Gary to task about his choice of a certain word when he was using it against Bama. But, you have accused me of being dumb and knowing nothing about the Raiders and not being a true fan.
Well, if you want to be an asshole, knock yourself out.
H
Thanks Panty.
Maybe I'm just getting all misty eyed about the possibility of Madden coming back.
H
H...
I'm with ya Bro....
The following is my post to the article about Madden retiring...1st time I ever wanted to post at that paper after all the crap I have seen from them over time but this time was a necessity and I hope John is reading it....
John....
As soon as we heard you may retire many of us began to dream of you coming back to the Raiders as a "GM" or Consultant....This died out when the retirement failed to happen but now will without doubt reignite in a huge way.....
"MrD" said he had in mind a football man who had ties to the bay area but was now under contract and could not be approached....Here's hopping it was you because lord knows we could use your fine qualities in this organization again....
Here's to you Bro and all the fine memories both as a Raider and as a broadcaster....
PantyRaider....Bring Back Madden Band-Wagon!!!!/_
Kansas City Chiefs 4/12 Zach Thomas (LB) signed/unrestricted free agent (one-year contract).
Most Mock-Drafts have the "Squaw"s going for the "LB" but maybe now they go "QB"...
Something to watch closely as a player may fall to us at #7....
PantyRaider....Difficult to Figure!!!/_
Gee:
You guys can't wait to pull out the "poor me" card. "I have had all these troubles", or, "I'm going through a revolution and I am living more than you ever have".
Not one of you can dispute my take on what to think of the franchise. None of you can dispute what is going on in Alameda. So you trun to " this is my life" pity stories to gain sympathy for your cause.
I'll pull out a hanky for ya, " Jones is being an asshole, waaa". " I have just been shot at in this rough and tumble world, many people call me names. That Jones guy really makes up stories and is never happy."
Picture painting, you guys should really try it on canvas, you seem to have talent for it.
JONES
Panty,
That's a bandwagon I can get on. It wouldn't suprise me if there had been some "conference" calls occuring this offseason.
Naw, remember the Chefs just got the second coming of Johnny Unitas from the Patsies. Ticked off the Geldings so much they got rid of Cutler.
Jones,
You know something, the immaturity factor you exhibit is amazing. You know everything. The whole world should genuflect to your brilliance. That's your argument. "I'm right, the rest of the world is wrong." "I know with 100% certainty everthing that goes on in Alameda." "I don't have to prove it, cause I'm just that good." It doesn't matter that we can't dispute what you say is going on in Alameda because you can't prove it is what is going on in Alameda.
It's actually becoming boreing. As much as I've disagreed with Bama I always respected his opinion. Yeah, I put out some things about personal life experiences. So has Panty, so has Blanda, Arkansas and Take in he past. It's what friends do.
So, let me be as succinct as I can. Yeah, I’ve had a few rough spots in my life. I was under orders not to react to those jerks back then when I wanted to pound the crap out of him and his buds. Yes, it really pisses me off when anybody denigrates people who have served in the military. And, if you don’t like that, quite frankly I don’t give a shit. See my previous post.
H
H:
I don't know everything, I sure know what is going on at Alameda. Problem with you guys is, you can't handle the truth. You are stuck in mud, you can't fathom that AD is done. The years keep rolling by and you still can't see it.
Live on in a fairytale, sounds like coping mechanisim to me. If the Raiders have their 7th losing season this year, what will you say? That we are just rebuilding? This isn't " my dark and ugly place", this is the horror of being a Raiderfan at this time. We have suffered for years, you guys can keep your heads in the sand, some of us will push for change. Will you cry when there is change? Will you write blogs on how the team will never be the REAL Raiders?
There are plenty of fans who have had enough of AD, just the percentage of them on here are disproportionate to the real world.
H says:
"Yes, it really pisses me off when anybody denigrates people who have served in the military."
Who has done that on this site? Showing an anger problem, maybe you might want to check that.
JONES
Jones, what's your effing problem? What's your life fantasy? That millions of disgruntled Raider fans will show up in Alemeda with pitch forks and torches to storm the place?
You're not a Raider fan. You're not a fan of anything or anybody. You're an ass with a big mouth and an attitude.
I've argued with most people on this site at one point or another, but in the end, everybody (including Bama7) shows others some respect. At the end of the day we call ourselves Raider fans and friends.
It's time you stopped confusing truth with the loudest voice. Sometimes that loud voice is actually only a fart!
Sorry, Bama. I didn't mean to single you out in that rant.
Is it just me, or does it sound like JONES is HOPING for the Raiders to suck again next season so he can be right?
If true, I'm not sure I can think of anything more pathetic and disgusting than that.
Note to JONES... become a Patriot fan NOW... you would fit right in. Trust me!!
No, actually I think Jones has guaranteed us that the Raiders will suck this year. Because only he knows the truth. I think we've identified Jones' first name as Carnac.
God, H, we ARE old.
"...If he answers the question by yelling and screaming about the former staff and pretty much saying 'we looked like a bunch of assholes' then he could piss somebody off. I'll bet there's still a lot of players and staff that believe in Rob Ryan's scheme. It's much easier to answer in a fairly milquetoast fashion...." ~ButteryPat, 3:23 PM
I'm sensing that the CableMan is perhaps a touch more "poignant" to DC Marshall. As I've mentioned before, along with many others, I think the fundamentals portion is trusting your teammate to do his job so you don't try to be Super-D-Man.
"...This year's quiet restocking of depth has me feeling positive about my team.
And I like what I see in Cable. I know the proof is in winning, but so far he reminds me of Madden - an in the trenches, no BS guy that gets his players to play his system - or else." ~Tinfoil, 4:43 PM
For the team's sake, I think CableMan is sugar-coating to the media. Why create an environment of finger-pointing? We've all noticed that there's much less drama coming out of Alameda this year... Unlike Kiffin, the CableMan doesn't need to air his dirty laundry, that being SOB, to the world. After all, SOB is no longer his problem.
Media-Subtlety - perhaps that's the CableMan's angle... ya think maybe, RT?
~'Cat
"Note to JONES... become a Patriot fan NOW... you would fit right in. Trust me!!" ~gary
No doubt. We'll send up a smoke signal when BigAL is gone so he can jump back on the bandwagon again - oh, wait... just as long as it isn't a sub-par team with a BigAL philosophy... As Just Win, Baby! echoes through the halls...
~'Cat
Jones,
You said, "many people call me names." I was answering that assinine comment. Yes, because that idiot, and many others I have encounterd where not just talking about me. They were talking about Arkansas, Panty and the young Marine sergeant who was with me. And, Arkansas listen up buddy, there were two of us and four of them, we had them out numbered. If that's an "anger problem" in your words, you got that right. It's the closest to actual "truth" you have gotten since you declared yourself the guru of truth.
You also said, "I sure know what is going on at Alameda. Problem with you guys is, you can't handle the truth."
You keep saying you "know" and "truth", but when we ask for proof we hear crickets or you change the subject. How about once tell us your "inside source" our give us the dates and attendees of the meetings you were privy to. Until such time your "truth" is just opinion and has no more weight than any other opinion on this site.
Once you have provided the proof and verifiable source of your "truth" we will be more than happy to admit our trasgressions.
I gave the source of mine. Straight from the horse's mouth.
Now, speaking of changeing subjects. After some thought I have a slightly different slant on the Cable comments on the defense. Cable and SOB seem to be the types that would get along. Like they could sit down and have a few beers after work.
Based on that, I don't think he would go running down a guy he was friendly with in public. "Just going to tweak a few things," kind of statement.
They may have disagreed on some things, but I think Cable still respects the man.
H
Stick'em Pick'em
Detroit: Stafford
Rams: J. Smith
KC: Curry
Denver [from Sea]: Sanchez
Browns: Crabtree
Cincy: A. Smith
Oak: Eugene Monroe
There you have it
I think that's a good take, H. There's another aspect also. One of the things Cable set out to accomplish was to bring in good teachers. I think that's almost a no-brainer with a team as young as this one. I also think that's the most striking deficiency in SOB.
When you consider the first thing he did was to attempt to convert a bunch of defensive linemen into linebackers. So we had about four fairly midlan DLs now playing as really crappy OLBs. While those guys were taught how LBs line up in the scheme, they were never taught to be LBs. And the techniques are completely different.
Frankly, I think we'll see a noticable improvement on this team, across the board, during the preseason games.
But then... wait for it... I can't handle the truth.
LOL
H, roger that. You had them right where you wanted them--you could swing in any direction you wanted and hit one. They couldn't possibly escape... ;^)
---Jeff
Bama:
I have always enjoyed & respected your opinions. Your passion is authentic and undeniable. The "Tuck You" game put my heart in a blender. The last six seasons have been brutally disappointing. I'm hitching my wagon on Cable and hoping like hell for a nice ride.
There is something about Cable that resonates with me that is hard to describe. Call it destiny or dumb luck but Cable seems to be the ideal HC to have a solid working relationship with Davis. Cable is genuinely a nice guy, a straight shooter, football lifer, egoless and lifelong Raider fan who the players clearly respect. I view Cable as our shot at stability which has sorely been mising.
H:
You are welcome to share personal life experiences whenever you see fit. I'm quite certain that our service in the military has shaped the men that we've become. Don't stoop to Jones level with internet toughness. It is beneath you. I have disagreed with you, BR, Panty, and Gary countless times but at the end of the day I realize we are all Raider fans with different perspectives. Frankly, this forum would be dull if we were all in lock step with one another.
BR:
I sincerely wish I shared your optimism for our D this season. Perhaps Cable will be able to influence Marshall in terms of aggressiveness. Perhaps Marshall is an excellent teacher who will be able to instill more structure, discipline, sound techique, and improved execution. Perhaps we will upgrade our front 7 in the draft and free agency. I would love to be pleasantly suprised by the performances of Jay Richardson, Ricky Brown, Hiram Eugene, and Tyvon Branch just like we were with Chris Johnson last year. I would love to see a breakout/contract year performance from Derrick Burgess. I would love to see a "bounce back" season from Kelly. It would be nice if Trevor Scott rings up 10 sacks as a situational pass rusher. We shall wait and see.
CJ...
I think we all came to the agreement together that "SOB" was without a doubt the worst "DC" in the history of the Raiders and a close to the bottom "DC" for the entire NFL....That said....Just the fact that he has run himself out of town should instantly improve our porous "D"....
Marshal couldn't posibly be as bad...Could he....Now if the players are motivated by our new "HC" the way they were at the end of the season than by the evidence presented we should already be "Vastly" improved....
Not enough but on our way....With each player playing in position with emotion and discipline while understand their assignments and the "Scheme" as though we actually have one now should alone get your chilled blood flowing again....
With the improvements on the "O" and a balanced attack the "D" could be effective as a top "15" performer....Get better than that and we could be speaking "PO"s which is where my emotions are sending me....
I do believe....I do feel the emotion-n-excitement....I smell a plan...And if by chance Madden comes in I will start proclaiming "PO" bound....
PantyRaider....Victory Parade!!!/_
Madden Watch....
He said he will continue to be connected to the game in some way but does not yet know how that will be....He ruled out being a consultant but was not asked about being a "GM"....He also answered about team ownership and sorta left that unanswered....He said he has seen far too many players retire and have a change of heart soon after and make some sort of come-back and said he can't rule that out....
PantyRaider...Madden Fan-Wagon Hopes!!!/_
Obviously, he will still be involved in the video game, even if it's just review and stamp of approval.
No telling if he will work for Al. Sometimes it's just best not to go into business with your best friends.
And I for one do car what H has to say.
-moshbucket
Panty,
A consultant is only consulting if it's in the title. It could be an "advisory" capacity. Gotta know how to parse words.
Calico,
Thanks for your perspective, much appreciated. After some thought, and a few aspirin for the pain it induced, I actually have a different take on Jones.
If you go back and analyze Jones’ writings they are eerily similar to the old Anno Patsie poster. The attacks on Panty’s writing style, the “I’m right over 95% of the time” (Patsie Boy) attitude, the name calling (Panty Smeller/Punty). He seemed to have a special affinity for Panty as Patsie Boy did. I would venture even the writing styles are similar, if not the same.
He even references his fandom to the 70’s as Patsie Boy did. He never references personal experiences with the team and only highlights the negatives. His so called “truth” would lead one to believe he “wants” the Raiders to fail.
He also appeared on the scene shortly after some Anno postings that appeared to be from Patise Boy showed up again. Several of us requested he get a handle so we would know was insulting us. Jones came along and Patsie Boy has disappeared. If you are actually going to put a name to it, you want to try and blend in.
I believe we have an infiltrator. Could be wrong, after all analysis is nothing more that your best guess. Something Jones doesn’t seem to grasp.
My apologies to everyone, especially Bama, and Take for distracting this site from its true purpose. I’ll still disagree and won’t hold back on my opinion of football in general and the Raiders in particular. But this latest episode triggered some memories of things I feel very strongly about. Even more than my beloved Raiders. It won’t happen again.
H
Congrats to Madden on a great run. I hope he hangs around Raiders HQ in some capacity. I think he will.
And will someone please get A.Boldin's agent on the phone?
Psycho
H....
We are on the same page....
I also posted earlier that the AnnoAss was just a shadow of himself posting as a group of One in order to disguise his numbers....So he tries to make an argument and than back it up by having another AnnoAss post in support of his "Crap" while attempting to catch us in a "Cross-Fire"...
If anyone is truly upset with the condition of the Raiders he feeds upon it and tries to push their buttons to explosion....Than after provoking his subject it's time to sit back a laugh while writing derogatory about the up-set poster....Than he tries to gather support from others against the 3-4 "Stooges" which has totally failed....
"FaidaBoy"...AnnoAss..."PatsyBoy"...JONES...ect..ect...
But he can't hide his lying eyes even threw CyberSpace....The only "Truth" is the fact that out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks and his fingers tell the whole damn story....
In Conclusion....
Why would anyone waist time and energy replying to such total wasteful "CRAP"....
If it looks like shit....
If it smells like shit...
Than that's enough for me to believe it's most likely just a Pile-o-Shit....I have NO need to investigate any further....No need to stick my fingers in it to know it's consistency....No need to taste it to know it's rotten flavor...And most importantly NO need to digest it in order to know it's sickness...
Just deluge it with water and forget it was ever there...That's my perfect solution...H2O evaporates and leaves NO trace of what was once there...Water Soluble...
Now NO doubt that shot went totally over his collective "DickHeads"...
PantyRaider....Positive Considerations!!!!/_
When Madden retired as a head coach, he said he wanted to spend more time with his family. Particularly his kids. But after retirement he found out that his kids weren't at home waiting for him. They had their own things to do. So Madden started a career as an NFL color man.
Yesterday, Madden said he was retiring because he wanted to spend more time close to home to be with his grandchildren. I'm guessing that 'round about 2010 Madden will have discovered that his grandchildren aren't at home waiting for him, and have their own things to do. At that point Madden may begin hanging around Alemeda. It's close to home. Perhaps it is home.
"BR"....
Personally I'm hoping it comes alot sooner than that....This season would be nice and next week prior to the draft would be exultant...His positive energy has been sadly missed and would be a welcome site after the last 6 seasons of disparity...
If it is so, then this site can claim it first. I think it was about a year ago we were tossing around Madden returning to the fold.
We were joking of course, but if it works out RaiderTake blog should get out front and take credit.
After all we are a collection of the most intelligent Raider Fans on the planet.
H
H....
Smartest Raider Fans on the planet...
One further thought....Just popped up in my head....
It has become very evident that AnnoAss is only partially literate as exemplified by his in-ability to understand what he reads...
He becomes confused and gets hung-up on one word instead of being able to evaluate what has been discussed....He automatically sees only the negative and never has been able to view the entire subject nor has he been able to continue in any discussion nor has he been able to give support for his rediculas conclusions....Also he contradicts himself and uses the same arguments in 2 simultaneous directions in the same sequence....
"Schizoid Disorientation"...."Half-Witted" as in split personalities and Bi-Polar....No doubt he stays awake and argues with himself in his sleep..."Prozac Junky"...Lost and without a friend in the world so he tries to hang-out with the "Men-in-Black" who again reject him for the "Crap" that he is....
"Lost in CyberSpace" and can't find his way home....Just as the Beatles wrote...
"Get Back JONES"....Get back to where you once were...
PantyRaider...Pitiful Existence!!!/_
Correction....
"Get Back JONES"....Get back to where you once belonged...
Does that mean we now call him "Jo-Jo Jones, the Nowhere Man?"
Just riffin' on a theme...
---Jeff
ArkansanRaider....
We could add in some Elanor Rigby loneliness and "Vanilla Yellow Custard Dripping From a Dead Dogs Eye" just to complete the image...
Yuk!!!!....What a disgusting Image....NO wonder he is always rejected....
PantyRaider....Dated Songs!!!/_
For the last season or so, I've been under the impression that a lot of folks on the inside, and in the media, read this blog. It seems that the arguments tossed around here show up in the mainstream after one of us has brought them up. Other blogs seem to work the other way around by discussing issues subsequent to media attention.
RT's righteous "News You Can't Use" editorials would have attracted media types. Full throated fan discussions would have lured the insiders.
ROTFLOL @ PR!!!!
BR, Take has enough readership for folks to take notice. As a small-time blogger, I'm lucky to get "a" comment. Even some of the blogs from established journalists sometimes don't get as many comments as Take does.
So it stands to reason that many are taking notice.
Again, JMHSO.
---Jeff
Blanda,
Like I said, the most intelligent Raider Fans on the planet.
H
Why I wouldn't use my #7 overall on Crabtree.
Folks have said that the Raiders shouldn't pick Miclan because he's too much like Higgins. There's logic to that reasoning, especially in view of Cable's strong desire to put a "team" together. While every team must play in unison, every player on a team should bring something unique to the table - a different weapon in the arsenal when in war on the field.
I've spent some time watching video of Crabtree, and I find him too similar to McFadden. There is nothing really that Crabtree brings to the table that McFadden can't supply.
What we need is a WR who can bring to the field what we lose when Miller comes off the field. By that I mean someone with physical presence who can be a possession receiver over the middle, and big enough to snatch balls over the heads of LBs and safeties.
I think we should spend the first round addressing OL or DL, and save WR in a quest for Barden or Robiskie.
I think you made an arguement to take him actually. "He's to much like McFadden". Although I do see the similarity (speed is no contest), they're both studs at thier position, and potential once a decade type guys. I would actually love to have him on the squad. I wanted Fitz real bad when he came out. People talk about his off field issues, but I have no info on that, so I can't comment.
The reason I don't think we should draft Crabtree is that studs at his postion are a dime a dozen compared to studs at Tackle (O and D). Maybe that's to extreme, just trying to explain my reasoning.
And if all 4 tackles, BJ, and Orakpo, and Curry are gone, then maybe we take him or trade down.
Of course if that were to happen, we could probably get good value for that 7 pick with the 2 QBs still on the board. Maybe even Denver gives up 12 and 18 for 7 in that scenario? Not sure Al does that for Denver though :-) How does Maluga (spelling?) and Alex Mack sound in that scenario? Although people are saying he's not a 3 down LB?
I would be more likely to use your comparision with Heyward-bay (just because of the speed).
Should be interesting whatever happens! With Al, you just never know!
-moshbucket
To sum it up, I think we're going to end up with a tackle. Either one of the two from the SEC, or BJ.
-moshbucket
BR...
2 thing you said spark my reply..One I agree and One I don't....
#1...
The "Crab" is a very polished "WR" with great talent at his position and tremendous versatility...
"McFab" is a very polished "RB" with great talent at his position and tremendous versatility...
NO doubt they could learn the others position and play it well but together they make a "Dynamic Duo" that has not existed on our team before...
We have had Bo-Marcus-Brown-Christensen and Van Eagan-Biletnikoff-Branch-Casper....But could could you just imagine having "McFab"-Bush-"Crab"-Miller-n-(Higgins-Schillings-Walker) and posibly another veteran "WR" in the mix...Burriss-Vick....
This could be the thing dreams are made of...With a young core unit like that and a few added Vets we could be "Nigh Un-stoppable"....
#2...
2 days ago I posted a reply to that SF Rag on an article about Madden....Later that night there was another article addressing the very things I posted...The possibility of Madden returning to the Raiders as "GM" or Consultant...So do they read it for ideas...NO doubt....
I posted in the past to "RT" to be aware that posibly a writer was posting on his site as "Anno" because "RT" was attacking them on a public forum...I noticed that at times when "RT" would strike one of them down things seamed to heat up with an "AnnoAss" attacking everything here....I also noticed thing we talk about become subject of discussion in their "Rags" and by that unscrupolus "Rohmy" Bitch....
So do they listed to what we say...Do they "Surf" the Blog-Sites to see what type of reaction they get from their "Crap"....Why the hell wouldn't they....As "Partial" Humans they would be like any of us that want to see what effect we had with a statement we made...Why are they any different....
Also in the past I have noted the possibility that a player or two may scan the Blogs for an out-side look at himself...And at times I post a comment directly to that players or coach...Just as in the case 2 days ago when I addressed the post to Madden saying..."John"...
This is a powerful medium...When everything here was "Doom-n-Gloom" I reminded folks that speaking that way would NOT get them the "Fan-o-da-Week" award thinking that someone is listening...
At times I use that possibility to slap one of them up along-side the scull....Does it work...No idea but it's damn fun trying...
PantyRaider....Perinoia Strikes Deep....Someones Always Watching!!!/_
Panty, you son of a bitch! lol
101 anyways...
Psycho
Blanda,
What you said was almost the exact reason Jerry MacDonald said we should take Crabtree. He said Crabtree, while not as fast as Maklin, could take punishment and go up and take the ball away when necessary. My knock on Crabtree is the defenses he played against. The Big 12 led the universe in offense, and when they played strong defensive teams they struggled.
I would take Crabtree over Maklin at this point. But, would be happy with Robiskie in the second.
Moshbucket,
The best receiver isn’t even in the draft. One scout said Julio Jones after his true freshman year would go third round, possibly second and Alabama wasn’t a passing team. When he does come out he would be a top five, possibly number one overall. Fast, physical and good route runner, strong hands to hold onto the ball after the catch. The main knock is he sometimes looses his concentration. Not the same as taking plays off like Moss.
Paycho,
You’re slowing down in your old age.
H
Psycho....
Sorry Bro....It was a long post...When I started writing it was #98 sense #97 was already up...
In the interim "MoshBucket" took #s 98-n-99....I ended up at "100"...Almost an hour before you showed up....Please don't go psycho on me and send me out for 20 Lashes....They hurt too much and I bleed profusely....
I'll make it up to you some how....Maybe some "Stinky Finger Juice" from Thailand or Cambodia will appease your anger...
PantyRaider....Ouch! Ouch! Stop!....That Hurts!!!!/_
I propose the institution of "The Psycho Rule."
When 97 is up, posters must restrict the length of the post to nothing longer than "Waiting for Psycho." At 99, no one is allowed to post at 00 for 12 hours until Psycho has had his shot.
Psycho, you might have to change your name to 0tt0. H will understand the reference.
H,
It's these new 'Depends' that I have to wear. I just can't get around so fast.
Holy crap it's almost draft time!
Psycho
OK....The draft is one week away and info is not posted...Or at least I'm haveing trouble finding it...
Question....
What time out west does the draft start....NOT the coverage but the time of the first selection....What time does the clock start.....
PantyRaider....14 Hours Ahead!!!/_
1:3p AM
I would be fine with Crabtree, Raji, A. Smith, or Oher at #7.
I would be even more fine with a trade down. To get an extra pick would be huge.
Getting Rey Maleluga (sp?) and Heyward Bey with 2 1st round picks would be golden.
With Maleluga, we add toughness to our front 7 and run stopping abilities. Morrison would slide to SLB.
With Heyward Bey we get a WR who can stretch the field and provide a big target for JRuss.
Since Philly acquired OT Jason Peters from the Buffalo Chips, we can count out the Beagles as trading partners. We can count out the Donkeys making a draft day exchange with us.
Who has the ammo and desire to move up to #7? If Sanchez is still on the board at #7, that would be our best bet to finding a willing trading partner. I just don't see another team moving up to #7 for any player excluding a franchise potential QB.
When all is said and done, we will stay at #7. I really can't see Crabtree slipping by the Brownies. It is looking like either Andre Smith or Michael Oher.
Great news eh? That fat slob "big john madman" won't be blubbering bull shizzle though out the games any more!!!!! The only thing that could be better would be "al butt licker micheals" and the can't sing no talent-hank williams jr tendering their retirements as well! But something is better than nothing huh? Maybe big al (MR.) davis will hire the big 400 pound bag of manure to be the new faider GM, you faida fanatics would be in hog heaven then!!!!! Just dream babies. defund the "nation" now! 0-16 is doable in "09"
Mo Un-Intelegent Shadow Shit!!!.....
Draft Projection....
1st rd....@#7...The Raiders select...
Michael Crabtree (Sophomore)- "WR" Texas Tech (HT: 6'3" | WT: 210)...
Strengths:
-very productive college career
-great hands
-hard worker, learns fast and keeps getting better
-clutch, see Texas/Texas Tech game this year
-has the ability to stretch the field, go deep and work the middle of the field
-his numbers are off the charts
-very good awareness, finds the whole in the zones and runs great routes to get open
-gives 100% on every play and uses his size to be a good run blocker
-does not make many mistakes.
2nd rd...@#40...The Raiders select...
Clint Sintim - "OLB-DE" Virginia (HT: 6'2" | WT: 256)...
Strengths:
-great pass rusher, has the size and speed to get around the tackles and the strength to push back running backs
-has the versatility to play OLB in a 3-4 and DE in a 4-3, shows the ability to rush the passer in both a 3 and 2 point stance
-plays with a mean streak, and is always looking to lay out the ball carrier
-good awareness on the field, follows the ball well and takes good pursuit angles to the ball carrier
-solid wrap up tackler, has the strength to take down backs with his arms
-also able to drop back in coverage, a complete linebacker
3rd rd...@#71...The Raiders select....
Chris Baker (Junior) - "DT-DE" Hampton (HT: 6'2" | WT: 300)
Strengths:
-versatile, capable of playing as either a 4-3 DT or 3-4 DE (played DE in Hampton's 3-4)
-best suited to use his quickness and great first step as a one-gap DT
-is very stout at the point of attack
-can be disruptive in the passing game, has the power and explosion to make plays
-creates havoc in the backfield, productive college career
-was Penn State's most productive DT when he played there before the transfer
"Versatility" sums up the strategy...With 3 players we satisfy several needs...
Both "D" players are good pass rushers and tacklers -w- speed and fill needs at "DE" as well as "OLB"-n-"DT"....
PantyRaider....War Room Suggestions!!!/_
Other Considerations...
2nd rd....
(Junior) Sean Smith - "CB-S" Utah (HT: 6'3" | WT: 210)
Strengths:
-size and speed combination
-has excellent range, always around the ball, good closing and recovery speed
-good hands, ball awareness
-physical, can shed blocks, good at press coverage
-can play cornerback and safety, has all the tools
-hits well
Michael Johnson - "DE" Georgia Tech (HT: 6'7" | WT: 260)
Strengths:
-so athletic, great first step and is an excellent pass rusher, very explosive and good burst off the line
-great size, has the frame to even add more weight without it affecting his speed
-good quickness and agility, has the speed to close and finish plays
-changes direction well upfield
-strong upper body and can extend his arms when locked on
-can deliver the big hit
-his long arms make him a threat to tip passes when he can't get to the quarterback
-his athleticism and speed could even allow him to play in a 3-4 defense
3rd rd....
Paul Kruger - "DE" Utah (HT: 6'5" | WT: 265)
Strengths:
-pretty versatile and very athletic, is a converted quarterback
-is great against the run
-underrated pass rusher, his stats will not reflect this, though he got plenty of QB hurries
-has the frame to add more weight without sacrificing any speed
-might be a safer pick than some of the other top DEs, very low bust potential
-leader, plays with fire and passion
-very high character guy, he was in serious condition after being stabbed in January, 2008, was playing football again that summer
-best suited as a 4-3 DE
>>>
When 97 is up, posters must restrict the length of the post to nothing longer than "Waiting for Psycho." At 99, no one is allowed to post at 00 for 12 hours until Psycho has had his shot.
>>>>
Yuck. I think he has to earn the prestigious "X00" spot instead of being given it.
lol
Gary,
Well I do proudly wear my 00 jersey at least once a week to honor Mr. Raider. And I bought his autographed book right when it came out. I was thinking of cutting off my leg when I heard the bad news, but I realized how hard his fight was to keep his, so...OK not really the last one.
Oh and I was once kicked really hard in the balls and didn't react with show of pain. Therefore I feel I have a certain bond with Mr. Otto.
Psycho
It's going to be a slow news week even though the draft is coming. Teams will be shutting down news contact so as to not tip their hand. Everything coming out will be speculation.
One would think they were planning the Normandy invasion.
Calico,
Not so fast my parti colored friend. There actually is a way we trade down. It won't happen but here goes.
Denver needs a QB. They have two first round picks. They trade both to Detroit for their overall number one and take Stafford.
Detroit now has three first round picks. We send #7 and our fourth round pick with Michael Huff to Detroit for their #20 and their second round pick.
This gets them a fast safety who might play better on artifical turf and gets them back into the fourth round. We get picks 20, 33 and 40. Good solid position player picks for OT, DT, WR, Center or LB. Positions we actually need.
It doesn't get us two first rounders, but does allow us more opportunities to get the help we need with solid players.
Detroit, with #7 takes Sanchez for their QB and they pick again at #12.
It'll never happen, but hey I can dream can't I.
Sorry Take, that's as close as I can come to prediciting who picks whom.
H
H....
That trade stinks....
Huff was a high 1st rd pick....#7...Now we trade him with a 4th rd #97 pick for a #20 & #33....
We lose a starting player and fail to draft a top talent....Instead we get 2 players whom we project to be future starters...The fall off in talent between #7 and #20-#33 is tremendous...But to lose double is inexcusable...
Let's see what Huff can do in a "System"....Something "SOB" was completely unable to bring to our "D"....He came in "06" so this is his 4th season....I believe it was Nnamdi's 4th season when he came into his own....Could have/should have been sooner but he suffered with the same problem....NO "System"....He developed into his own man despite the lack of "D" coordination...."03" was I believe "SOB"s 1st season on the job so he is responsible for the lack of or slow development of Nnamdi....
Phillip Buchanan "02" -n- Derrick Gibson "01" also suffered at the hands of "SOB" and were traded away...Now we will never know what could have/should have been....
Charles Woodson "98" was also let go during "SOB"s tenure....Now how much of a mistake was that...He wanted out no doubt with good reason when using "Hind-Site" at this late date...
I'm more than willing to let every "D" player start from scratch and see what they have this season...NO judgement for past failure under a failing "System"....I think many of us are willing to give the "O" a break after understanding what a freaking idiot "Lance" was....So why not the "D" after a "5" year collapse under that "SOB"....
Stand put at #7 and take the very best player available...If it's the "WR" that falls to us than take him....If it's an "OT" than great...Only if...And I repeat...Only if all the top players who we target are off the big board should we even consider down trading....But not down too far...
For instance if the first 6 teams pass up the "QB"s but take the "OLB"-"WR"s-"OT"s....Now we should consider a trade down and target the "DT"-"DE" at pick #8-#9...Maybe #10-#11 if we really think those teams will pass on that position....But NO body will believe we would take the "QB" so the trade has less value...
PantyRaider....Draft Strategies!!!/_
I just looked again at the list of top drafted LT's, and its like wow. We'd be fools to pass up on one.
This years pro-bowl had FIVE of them, not including Clady, who was robbed... Chris Samuels, Jake Long, Jamaal Brown, Joe Thomas, and Walter Jones.
Add to that people like Ogden, Pace, Boselli, and Turley???
We need to stop gambling and picking more sure things with our top picks... Gallery was a horrible LT, but still a solid starter at guard.. could have made the pro-bowl if he were on a winning team.
Wr's and DT's are notoriously hit or miss top picks... where its hard to even find a LT that was a bust.
How many top picks did Detroit waste on WR's before they finally got a good one?
I hope Cleveland helps us out by picking Crabtree so they remove the temptation from Al.
"JJ" puts our draft needs in a different perspective and "DT"-"DE" are NOT mentioned...
Top needs are at "OT"-n-"WR"....Next in line are Depth at "G"-n-"C"...Impact "S"...2nd "TE"....
http://www.sacbee.com/raiders/story/1792905.html
2 "OT"s will most likely already be off the board so don't expect the Raiders to address that need with the 7th pick...The "WR" is the most likely selection above all others...But that is totally dependant on what happens between #1-n-#6....
Watching film on the "WR"s and there is a total difference...While the one can run away from everyone on the field the other gets drug down from behind but he has moves to get free for more yardage and he catches everything in traffic and struggles for that "TD"...The speed guy is wide open or has good down filed blocks that free him up and looks good in the return game which we don't need from out top draft pick....
In conclusion....
This team already has tremendous speed...What we need is a terrific target that catches everything within arms reach and is not afraid to go over the middle or up for the high ball....
When was the last time we had a "WR" with dependable hands....Brown-n-Rice....They were slowed at that point in time but still a good threat....If we had a speed "WR" -n- "TE" to support them they would have stayed productive....
PantyRaider...Who Falls!!!/_
The key to Cable's press conference. He made a big point of identifying the "strength of the draft." As most of us have discovered, the true strength of this draft is essentially between pick number 20 and 50. Bottom of the 1st to the middle of the second. This is the "strength of the draft" because this is where you're going to find the vast majority of lunch pales - the guys who work for a living.
It makes sense to me, then, that Cable will want to make whatever trades he can make to maximize the number of selections in this group. If that means he has to trade down, he will advocate trading down. If he has to trade up from the lower picks, so be it. He may do both.
Davis is the wild card here. Has Cable completely sold Al on his vision? I suspect, by the look of the off season so far, he has.
>>>
When was the last time we had a "WR" with dependable hands....
>>>>
Actually that was Curry until he suddenly got the "dropsies".
Thats how flaky WR's are, and why Detroit didn't win a game last year.
They kept trying for the stud WR and by the time they got one, the rest of the team was in shambles.
The more I think about it, the more I think they should just forget about a WR until round two or later, or at least trade down and pick one.
The problem with trading down might be there is no people that want to trade up, and as Panty mentioned, they know we are set at QB.
Thats why we need to get the best VALUE. Just pick a LT and plug him into our line somewhere for the next ten years and be done with it.
Panty,
Huff is not a starter. He's playing behind guys who were later round, later years draftees.
I was just giving Calico a scenerio where we might trade down.
Based on needs, the Geldings just might give up both first round picks to get the #1 overall. That would give Detroit 3 first rounders and I believe Safety is one of their needs, amongst many.
Also, what Blanda said.
H
Due dilligence. That's the two words many here were saying the Raiders lacked over the last six years. There's been a lot of that going on with Cable this off season. While the news reports have been few and far between, swarms of draft eligible players have been swarming to the Alemeda facility over the last couple of weeks, and Raider scouts have been spotted nation wide.
But there's a wrinkle. Many, if not most, of the players being looked at are those projected to be picked at the bottom of the draft (and possibly go undrafted). Cable appears to be looking for the bargins. He's looking for the college walk-ons who earned a starting spot in a good college program. He's looking for players that no one even noticed until their senior season because the player learned fast and his level of improvement was completely underestimated.
Many of these types of players have emerged as stars in NFL history. The Raiders used to be one of the best at finding them.
The coaches employed between Shell I and Cable have all been captives of NFL "group think." Cable is a student of the Raiders' days that H and I are not allowed to mention.
There's an aspect of this that I hadn't considered, but it certainly makes sense.
During that period that H and I are not allowed to mention, the Raiders were anual participants in the playoffs. They always went into the draft with low round picks. In order to continue winning, the Raiders were forced, in those days, to carefully examine the talent at the bottom of the draft and find the gems among the sewage.
It's a different mind set with high round picks. One is far more inclined to question, "how can we fail with such high picks?"
I've always believed that Raider HC's have far more input in the draft than ever acknowledged by the media. It also seems quite possible that Cable has sat down with Al and said, "Al, whether you're picking high or picking low, you have to examine the draft exactly the same way. You have to find the most value wherever it is available - high or low."
H...
Maybe that will change with a "D" scheme in place...All of our "D" plays like their confused and out of sincrinize...
"BR"....
Otis Sistruck from the university of Mars....
I'm all for it....We have had some luck in the past with players who went un-drafted but became starters for our team....And remember....There used to be 12 rds...NOT just 7....
"Hit-Man" Eddie Anderson came to us threw the strike season as a player who never had a chance but he stayed on with the team for several seasons...I was at that strike game in "Mule-High" when he broke their starting "WR"s rib-cage....Retired that "Dead Mule"...
We have also had some good come from converting a player who was a great athlete into a different position....That's why I find this guy interesting...
Paul Kruger - "DE" Utah (HT: 6'5" | WT: 265)
Strengths:
-pretty versatile and very athletic, is a converted quarterback
-is great against the run
-underrated pass rusher, his stats will not reflect this, though he got plenty of QB hurries
-has the frame to add more weight without sacrificing any speed
-might be a safer pick than some of the other top DEs, very low bust potential
-leader, plays with fire and passion
-very high character guy, he was in serious condition after being stabbed in January, 2008, was playing football again that summer
-best suited as a 4-3 DE
He looks to have a desire to play no matter what is asked of him...
PantyRaider....Head Scratchers!!!/_
"17" Rounds 1970....
1977...12th round....
#334 Rolf Benirschke K California-Davis Oakland Raiders
Played 10 seasons for "SD"...
#317 Rod Martin LB USC Oakland Raiders
Played 12 seasons for the Raiders...
So the Raiders chose 2 starters in the 12th rd that year....
http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?season=1977
PantyRaider...Times Can't Talk About!!!/_
Gary....
Curry was a 7th rd pick in "02" and after 7 years has less than 200 catches....His best year was 50...He showed some very damn good games but was never the talent of a Tim Brown or Jerry Rice who averaged 100 catches per season...They both posted over "1000" Carree reception....Curry can in NO way be compared to either of those two stars...
It's true...Detroit has had a bad time at "WR"....What was their "QB"s and Coaches and "GM"....
I don't want to look at the history of other teams for an accounting of the Raiders....We made our own mistakes....Jerry Porter 2nd rd -n- "TE" Rick Dudley 1st rd....Raghib Ismail 4th rd -n-Jessie Hester 1st rd...
James Jett was an UDFA who stuck around too long...
But now we have a very very good young core of "O" speciality players and the addition of one more at "WR" could posibly elevate this squad for years to come...But also the "Injury Bug" could come along and end it all in just one season or a game...
PantyRaider....NO Way to Know!!!/_
Panty,
Interesting you mention Rolf Benirschke. I met him a few years back. His biography is an interesting read “Alive and Kicking”. This is a kicker with guts, literally.
He suffered from severe Ulcerative Colitis and had to have his colon removed. He played a season or two wearing a colostomy bag. Said he was very disappointed when the Raiders cut him, he was a fan. I have his autographed book.
I talked to him about the rivalry and he said back then in the NFL every Sunday was a rivalry game for the Raiders. Everyone in the NFL wanted to beat them, just very few could pull it off.
H
H...
Like "BR" said....If we start looking at all the other prospects we could end up with a "Gem-in-da-Rough" that helps our team win as in the past...
"77" was the 1st season the NFL went down to only 12 rds for the draft and the Raiders came out doing very well...I'm sure we could again...
That by the way was a Madden year...If the "Cable Guy" comparisons to Madden are real we could have a few tricks up the sleeve...And if Madden comes back on board in some capacity we could have alot up our sleeves...
PantyRaider....Wait-n-See!!!/_
I remember watching him the last season or two....He would kick and walk straight off the field...NOT going to try to tackle a return man with a "Shit-Sack" strapped to his side....Another one was Dempsey...Half a foot and a great kicker...Than there was "RB" Blair who lost half his foot in "VN" but came back to help "Pits" win "SB"s...
Fran Tarkington was too small but took his team to 4 "SB"s..."Heart-n-Desire"...How do you measure it or know if a player today has it or is just playing for that big score....
"Show Me da Money" Attitude....
PantyRaider....Old Times!!!/_
Panty,
Small correction. Tarkenton spent a couple of seasons with the Midgets. Joe Kapp took them to one Super Bowl.
Just a minor point, but we don't want to be accused of giving out false information at our advanced age.
H
Well, it looks like that old feather duster, Parcells, still refuses to join modern football along with everybody else. Folks around here understand that old is just old. Only what is new is worth anything. Parcells is so old, he's sticking with the Single Wing.
http://www.sun-
sentinel.com/sports/football/pro/
dolphins/sfl-miami-dolphins-
wildcat-s0420sbapr20,0,4044729
.story
The fans in Los Angeles can't even get an area football team to last longer than 9 years. Anybody still of the opinion that Al Davis is just itching to get back there?
Hey, Ray Ratto, I'm looking at you!
Correction:
area football team should read, arena football team.
Having spent 15 years in LA, I think I can speak to why football is not successful there.
Number one is that LA, as a community, is very reluctant to come out in the day time for anything other than shopping, food, or the beach (along with an endless number of amusement parks).
The sports that do well play almost exclusively at night. While many teams have switched to playing a lot of day games, but the Angels and the Dogers still play the vast majority of their games at night because people don't show up in the day time. Laker games are also played at night, as are hockey games.
Also, in LA the sport is not the only attraction at the game. The Dogers assign almost all movie stars coming to the game to the section immediately behind the backstop. The Lakers and the Kings put all of their celeb attendees along courtside. Much of the rest of the crowd comes out to watch the celebs.
Nobody is from LA. Therefore teams that have come from somewhere outside of California, from high population business areas, seem to have greater success. A large segment of LA comes from NY City, so the Dogers do well. The Angels didn't historically do well until they were bought by Disney. Disney started incorporating the Angels into their movies and promoting them through Disneyland.
The Lakers do well because they win and because the celebs are easiest viewed at Laker courtside. The Kings had no interest until Gretzky.
Just a handfull. There are many more reasons. But I think it would be a big mistake for any football team to move to LA. There are three (maybe four) possible exceptions because of LAs cross coast immigration value. Those four teams would be the Jets, Giants, Dolphins or Patriots. But none of those teams would leave their existing locations.
Cable has turned down the extra minicamp offered teams with new HCs.
“'I’m actually doing some things different for a reason,” Cable said at a news conference earlier this week.'
"For one, Cable is having his players immerse themselves in the strength program set up by strength-and-conditioning coach Brad Roll.
“'Our strength program is so right for this football team, meaning we’re getting stronger and bigger,' Cable said. 'I like the games we had last year, I like what we’ve done thus far this year, so I don’t want to take away from that and take time off for that.'”
One of the things I've been complaining about, and mostly attributing the problem to an offense that can't sustain drives, is that the defense always seems to run out of gas toward the end of a game. Looks like Cable is directly facing this issue from both sides.
By the way, where do most of us stand right now?
A. As long as Al Davis lives, this team will never have a winning season again!
B. Eh, maybe six or seven games can be won this year.
C. Is that a light I see at the far end of the tunnel?
D. I get the sense we are already much improved - to at least solid .500 team.
E. Winning? I remember that! And I'm beginning to think it could happen again.
F. At least 9 wins - maybe better!
G. That whiff of something in the air kind of smelled like a playoff spot - maybe just a fart.
H. Yeah, man! Playoffs! Here we come....
I. Dare I say it? S-U-P-E-R B-...
J. Damn right! I'LL say it! Suuuuuuppperrr Booooowwwwllll!
By the way, where do most of us stand right now?
A. As long as Al Davis lives, this team will never have a winning season again!
B. Eh, maybe six or seven games can be won this year.
C. Is that a light I see at the far end of the tunnel?
D. I get the sense we are already much improved - to at least solid .500 team.
E. Winning? I remember that! And I'm beginning to think it could happen again.
F. At least 9 wins - maybe better!
G. That whiff of something in the air kind of smelled like a playoff spot - maybe just a fart.
H. Yeah, man! Playoffs! Here we come....
I. Dare I say it? S-U-P-E-R B-...
J. Damn right! I'LL say it! Suuuuuuppperrr Booooowwwwllll!
Sorry for the unintentional double post. My own most honest assessment right at this moment is...
As all of you know, I've never been in the A camp. I pretty much started the post season at B. Currently I'm firmly at D, getting ready to attempt to step off onto E (but I don't want to get ahead of myself until I see these guys on the field).
I have to say, I've liked what the Raiders have done (or haven't done) so far this offseason, with my biggest question at DC. I don't know Marshall, but I'm frightened by the comment Cable made that our D will be the same (more or less). Yikes!
The Raiders desparately need to disguise coverages and blitz more... and that is far from the "same thing" they've been doing.
This weekend's draft may give us all a spark of hope. By most accounts, it should be D-heavy for the Raiders, with the possible, yet obvious exceptions of a WR and an O-lineman.
While highly unlikely, could the unconventional Raiders take Alex Mack at #7?
Assuming Curry and the top OTs are off the board, I'm now hoping we pick Crabtree... but that could change by draft day.
Andrew Walter...
There is no question that Walter is on his way out the door. Cable said specifically that Walter was not taking part in the QB school.
However, if there was some question as to whether Walter would actually be on the sideline this season, he would definately be taking part. It appears to me that the team doesn't expect Walter to be around through training camp.
That would probably mean they have draft day plans for Walter. I think they'd package him with a late round pick in an effort to move up - or straight out for a fifth or sixth rounder. I'd expect the Raiders to use him in a package that would get them an additional 4th round selection.
Whatever happened to that mystery executive that Davis was suggesting might be in the works? Could James Lofton be auditioning for that job right now? Word has it that he's been well involved in the search for new personnel.
BR Pop Quiz:
I will go with "c" until the draft and training camp is complete.
As far as the LA Market ...
I have lived in LA for most of my 45 years. These are my observations and opinions:
#1 To discount the size of the LA market as it relates to supporting a 65,000 size venue is foolish. LA is the 2nd biggest media market in the US. LA is the #1 entertainment capital in the world. LA is the largest populated city in the US without a pro football team. Just a guess, but I would venture to say that LA is at least 10 times larger in population than Jacksonville.
#2 Sports is entertainment. An exciting product (NFL) and a fan friendly enviornment is an easy sale.
#3 Build a first class venue with all the amenities, and even a 2nd tier sports team like the LA Galaxy has a rock solid fan base.
The venue ready to be built by Roskie (with a willing partner) will be a state of the art venue.
#4 The following LA teams have some of the most knowledgeable and loyal fans; USC football, UCLA basketball, LA Dodgers, LA Lakers, LA/Anaheim Angels.
The key practical issue to this discussion is the actual venue. A 1st class stadium in the city of LA for an exciting sport like the NFL is a no brainer.
All the arguments about the beach, other day time activities, the inconsistent support at the LA Colisium are moot points. A city with millions of sports fans would relish the opportunity to see an NFL team after visiting the stadium beer garden.
As far as the Raiders, we shall see how the current lease goes. To rule out the Raiders as possible tenants would not be smart.
BR....
Officially put me down as "D-E"....Hanging on the cuff...
If the draft is good to me I will teeter over to an "F"....
"G-H" is a possibility for a fan with such a positive attitude by the time pre-season rolls around...But we have a tough schedual and need to come out firring on all cylinders to have a chance at that....
PantyRaider....Sceptically Optimistic!!!/_
Clarification....
I'm very very excited about the up-comming season...We have put ourselves in position to be a damn good football team...Just a few more acquisitions will push us over the top....
Today I went back and watched the high-lights from the "TB" game week "17"....
The "O" now has an improved "OL" and our speciality players are now "Vets"...We now have one of the best back-up "QB"s in the game and we could depend upon him to be able to pull out a victory late even if the team is down by 2 "TD"s....He has that type of talent....Just like those old days with the "Snake" -n- Blanda....That old man could come off the bench and move that team...
If we get the top "WR" in this draft and our new coaching staff puts together a scheme that works than our "O" is over the top...We have that type of talent...
The "D"...
It boils down to an un-known element...The "DC" and the "Motivator"..."HC"....
The addition of a few key players could make this a productive unit....NOT the top "D" in the game but a consistent "D" on the rise....Top "15" will balance well with a top "5" "O" if we can achieve that type of turn-around this year....
PantyRaider....DraftDay Excitement!!!/_
Blanda,
For all the detractors Nick Saban had in the media, and they were plentiful, the first thing he did was throw out Alabama’s old conditioning program. Alabama was constantly loosing leads in the second half. The results were the team returned to the SEC Championship Game a year before all the “experts” said they would even contend for a division championship.
This is a smart move by Cable. Since the core players are still on board and the systems are not undergoing major changes, the camps are more about teaching proper execution than teaching new systems.
Being the consummate “half full” guy I’ll go with E. A winning season is possible. Keeping the team healthy is key, which is another reason for the conditioning program. Better conditioned teams seem to have fewer major injuries.
There was an article about the team focusing on “Team” players. A quote “Cable didn't want big names. He wanted guys who fit in the locker room.”
It has been said that Al Davis wasn’t concerned with team chemistry. I believe he even said that himself, but I don’t remember the exact quote. It just may be he considers that the responsibility of the coach.
This off season sure seems to go against the prevailing attitude that Al Davis does not listen to his coaches, as Kiffin himself alluded to. Cable is looking for team first types of guys. Usually those types get along on and off the field. No cliques. Characters are ok, but no character problems (shooting off firearms at strip clubs). There is a difference.
Character problems indicate a “me first” attitude. Those that run around with their entourages (Vick, Pac Man, Moss) are more concerned with their celebrity than their team. Russell appears to be a private type. He’s close to his family, not his hangers on. The same would appear to apply to Bush, Miller, Nnamdi and others. They might like to raise a little hell every now and then, but they aren’t stupid about it. And, when they do get a little stupid they seem to learn from it, e. g. Jano.
H
Blanda,
Right about now, I'm somewhere between "C" and "D" until they show me something on a field. Talk has been cheap for far too long. Time to hit.
Psycho
I'll say IT! Super Bowl Baby! (very wishful thinking) I always says this until after week 1.
Angelic Raider
Angelic Raider,
That's the spirit.
H
H....
81 Anquan Boldin, WR "AZ"....
Reportedly being shopped for a trade but the Cards want a 1st-n-3rd which is rediculas....
29 yrs old and a 1000 yd "WR"....
6'1"...217 lbs....Lacks speed but has good hands...2nd rd "03" #54...
502 rec/6,496 yds....40 "TD"s...
Sounds similar to the "Crab" who we may take at #7...
You mentioned a trade with "Huff"....So here is a packaged trade....
We send Huff-n-Walter for Boldin....Walter gets to go home...Are there picks attached...
"AZ"s needs are listed as...
"LB"-"RB"-"CB" -w- ??? @ "QB"....
Lainert may be on his way out also...
We are deep at "RB" and could part with Fargas to sweeten the deal...
If this could be pulled off for just players or players and we get the extra picks in later rounds than I'm all for it...
How about we send them Walker just as a bonus...
da "O"....
"QB"...."JRus"-Garcia
"RB"...."McFab"-Bush
"TE"....Miller
"WR"....Boldin-"Crab"-Higgins
"WR"s still listed on the roster...
Drew Carter-Jonathan Holland-Ashley Lelie-Chaz Schilens-Arman Shields-Todd Watkins
PantyRaider...Dream Team!!!/_
Watching film HighLights....
Boldin-n-"Crab" look very similar...It's rather difficult to tell them apart...
Athletic -w- very good body control...Spin moves -w- good stop-n-go technique...Not elite speed but can still run away from some defenders and able to gain separation in their routs with their athletic ability -n- physical style of play...
Two great targets...Coupled with Higgins as the speed receiver we would have a difficult to defend "Trio"...Add in the "TE" -n- the physical speed "RB"s -n- "JRus"s arm....Wow!!!!....
PantyRaider....Just Imagine!!!!/_
Calico, I used to feel the same way about LA that you do - until I moved away from there. Then when I moved away, I looked back and said to myself, "Wow, it really is all true."
The LA market can't be compared to any other, and the numbers really don't mean anything. Partly because of the square milage of LA county and Orange County.
First off, you can't compare college sports attendance with pro sports attendance. So forget USC and UCLA in your arguments. No matter where those schools were located, they'd get pretty much the same results.
I know for a fact that you're wrong about the Angels because I used to be a fan. In the late '70s/early 80's they were getting into the post season fairly regularly, but with fairly small crowds. When the Red Sox or the Yankees came to town, the fans from Boston or NY were always louder and in more abundance than Raider fans. I used to really resent getting out yelled in my own stadium. But Disney turned that around with national marketing.
I agree that the Dodgers and the Lakers both have a very loyal fan base. With the Dodgers it's for two reasons - the large numbers of NYers who have moved to LA, and the fact that the Dogers have been consistant winners. The Lakers have been consistant winners as well, and the celebs are a huge draw. Their rivalry with Boston helps (another East coast link). But if you want a picture of how any other team would do their, take a look at the Clippers.
As for NFL football, the Rams couldn't get sufficient attendance at either the LA Colossus or the Big A. 1984, one year after the Raiders won their last Super Bowl, I remember less than 50 thousand in attendance for a divisional home game. So for football, winning DOESN'T pull them in.
But perhaps the fans there are so shallow that everything they see must be brand new and state of the art. That would explain why LA has a purely attrocious record for preserving landmarks (other than the Hollywood sign, which was originally only put up as a marketing device for a housing development).
So let's see, the Chargers failed in LA, the Rams failed in LA, the Raiders failed in LA, the Express failed in LA, a couple of other league start up teams, and now their arena team. So, I think that in regards to whether a pro football team can make it in LA, history is on my side.
Calico:
There is something that would work for football in LA, but the teams around the league would never agree to it.
That would be to create a state of the art statium, that would be perpetually a state of the art stadium - but with NO home team. The stadium would be used primarily for football special events. All Pro Bowls would be played there, all Super Bowls would be played there... They'd make a bigger deal out of the Hall of Fame game, and that would be played there - and, perhaps, all Monday night games would be played there (you could make the schedule work - by having East Coast teams stay in LA for the week after another western visit).
If they did that, I guarantee that every game played would be sold out.
http://www.eastcoastsportsnews.com/
2009NFLDraft.html
"OLB" "AC" Falls to the Raiders @#7....?????....
NOT very believable but I would take it...
One scenario where the Raiders have a very good possibility of trading down and swapping 1st rd picks...
2-3 "OT"s are gone....
"WR" has been taken...
"QB" falls to the 7th pick....
He won't make it past the #8 "Jags"...So any team who is interested in the "QB" would be willing to move up to #7 to get him....
But wait....
Why won't that work for the "WR" if "Crab" is on the board at #7...."AZ" gets the "Crab" while we get Boldin and still have a pick at the end of the 1st rd....#31 to go with our #40 in the 2nd rd....
PantyRaider....NO Trade-Down!!!!/_
There is one more aspect also to the LA situation. Folks here got pretty brutal on Al Davis because of the last six years. In 1990, in LA, it was just as bad, if not worse for Davis. Everyone down there was insisting Davis had lost it because the Raiders hadn't won a Super Bowl in six years. This, even though Davis was the only football owner to ever bring the city an NFL national championship.
"OT"....
There seems to be a possibility that Andre Smith, OL, Alabama slips down to the #7 position in the draft....
6'4" 325 and can move...Plays at times at close to 350...Is the best player this year on the "OL" but has had negative press as a result of a violation for hiring an agent which would never concern me...Also was not ready for the combine so the character issues are pushing him down the board...
NONE of that crap would concern me in the least...He was a high performer on the field and has a great deal of talent....
If the "WR" is gone and this guy falls I would take him....But in all honesty I don't believe "MrD" will take the second player at any position this high in the draft....Except posibly if that player is the one he has rated as the top talent all along....
At this point there are several options at #7 and most of them are good for the team...
PantyRaider....Who Really Knows!!!/_
I can't put many faces together with how the strategy will be played out, but I think the approach the Raiders will take is this.
I think they have their eye on one person they want for that #7 pick, and I think it's an O-lineman. It is very possibly Smith. If that person is not there at #7, the Raiders will immediately begin realigning their picks to concentrate them between the end of the first round, through the fourth round ("the strength of this draft").
Through this process, several players will be on the table to sweeten deals and to lure takers. Walter will definately be on that table, and so will Fargas (but they will not let Fargas go cheap because of his leadership skills). Bush, for a very high price, will also be on the table (they won't both be traded - very likely neither Fargas nor Bush will be traded - but they'll be on the table to "inspire discussion").
Cable will be going for a sweep of positive picks. He's already said that he thinks that is important and can be done.
At the end of the weekend, I wouldn't be surprised if we made no picks in rounds 5-7, only 1-4. We may not even pick in the first round - say 2 or 3 in the 2nd. However, I also predict that come Monday morning we will be ready to sign anywhere from 2 to 6 undrafted free agents.
BR...
If you are correct this will be completely out-o-line for a Raider ball-club....But as I said a few weeks ago....
This is the most Un-predictable draft I have ever seen....Just too many good angles to take and loads of possibilities....
We could come out with a newly rebuilt franchise or....
PantyRaider....Deep Depression-n-Despair!!!/_
Clarification...
What makes it so difficult is that the top "DL" players have too much weakness in their game...One dimensional or slow or undersized...Later in the draft "Tweener" types are available who may pan-out to be just as good down the road and more versatile...
There are too many projected "OT"s who could help a team as a rookie...But here again they all fail to bring something to the table or as in the case of Smith...Questions about attitude and weight....
There are some very very good "WR"s to pick from which is a need but the same holds true...The best lacks speed....The speed ones lack the talent of the best...But several look to be very good and an immediate help for a team in need....BUT...
Do we already have some "WR"s just like this hidden on our squad now...
"WR"s still listed on the roster...
Drew Carter-Jonathan Holland-Higgins-Ashley Lelie-Chaz Schilens-Arman Shields-Todd Watkins-Walker...
There is also very damn good help at the "LB" positions....Both inside and outside which further confuses the issue...
The only thing clear is what we won't take..."QB"-"TE"-"RB"-"S"...
PantyRaider..."WR"-"OL"-"DL"-"LB"...
BR:
Your argument is seriously flawed in so many ways about the LA Market.
#1: To act like the sheer size of the market should not be factored into the equation is silly.
To be a viable market you need the following:
(a) a city with a large enough base of sports fans with the disposable income to support it
(LA: check)
(b) a first class venue
(Roski stadium: check)
(c) an exciting sport
(NFL #1 sport: check)
When you've got millions of sports fans within a 1 hr. drive to the stadium, it should be taken into account. Let's not forget, an NFL season is 8 to 10 Sundays and it only will be a max capacity of 65,000 to fill it.
As far as your counter points:
"I know for a fact that you're wrong about the Angels because I used to be a fan. In the late '70s/early 80's they were getting into the post season fairly regularly, but with fairly small crowds."
To compare the Orange County market of the 70s to today's OC Market is laughable. The OC Market began to explode in the late 80s.
"But if you want a picture of how any other team would do their, take a look at the Clippers."
In spite of one of the worst performing teams in the history of the NBA, when the Clippers moved into the Staples Center, their attendance was good. I know since I had a mini season game package for 3 seasons. This year the crowds have been small but if you look up the attendance the previous 8 years you will find that the Clips have done well attendance wise in the Staples Center. Why? It is a first class venue and an exciting sport. Of course attendance would naturally get even better for the Clips if they had a better performing team.
"As for NFL football, the Rams couldn't get sufficient attendance at either the LA Colossus or the Big A."
The Big A was probably THE WORST football venue of all time. Once again, I'm basing my argument about LA being a VERY viable market on having a state of the art venue. All you need to do is go to this link http://www.losangelesfootballstadium.com/ and look it over for 5 minutes and I guarantee that you will see the validity to ALL of my points.
This venue is ideally located and will be a first class venue. It will have shops, a beer garden, great site lines, restaurants, and is close proximity to the major parts of LA and OC.
"So for football, winning DOESN'T pull them in."
What pulls in the LA crowd are 3 things;
Winning, an exciting product, and a fan friendly, state of the art venue. It is not rocket science. All of the arguments about the Big A and LA Coliseum are not relevant. Both venues were complete dumps and WERE NOT fan friendly. Don't you get it?
"But perhaps the fans there are so shallow that everything they see must be brand new and state of the art."
Sorry but this is a below the belt, cheap shot that simply isn't true. Yes, it is true that to compete for the entertainment dollars in LA you've got to have a great product to include the venue since there are plenty of alternatives. And your point is?
"So let's see, the Chargers failed in LA, the Rams failed in LA, the Raiders failed in LA, the Express failed in LA, a couple of other league start up teams, and now their arena team. So, I think that in regards to whether a pro football team can make it in LA, history is on my side.
Let me take these 1 at a time;
The LA Chargers were in the market in what the early sixties before TV exploded.
The LA Rams were playing in the worst football stadium known to mankind.
The Raiders never got the bells and whistles that the LA Commission promised and were playing in a dump.
The LA Express failed due to the league failing not the market.
BR:
As far as your prediction on the #7 pick, I'm 100% with you. In my mind it comes down to Smith or Oher.
Perspective....
Should Smith fall to us at #7 and the Raiders select him what could it bring to the team...
Smith-Gallery-Satele -n- the return of Upshaw-Shell-Dalby...."Student Body Left" with a twist sense we now have very fast and versatile "RB"s to go with the left side of the "OL"...
Should the "WR" fall to us what would we have...
"WR"..."Crab"-Higgins-Walker
"TE"...Miller
"RB"s.."McFab"-Bush-Fargas
"QB"s.."JRus"-Garcia
It would be very difficult to be disappointed either way....
PantyRaider...Posibilities!!!/_
Andre Smith may be on the road to redemption. He recently fired the agent who got him suspended for the Sugar Bowl, and gave him bad advice about the combine. A good first step. However, he is currently more of a drive/power blocker. At 330-350 I wonder how he will fit in the ZBS. Oher seems to have the athletic ability to fit in the ZBS. Both have the quick feet to adjust to speed rushers. Both have solid potential and upside.
It was stated that the team planned to add a little more “power” to the line. Barnes and Pear don’t seem to fit that bill. Barnes maybe.
Don’t know much about Monroe and others as I didn’t see them play that much, if at all.
It’s now being reported that Matthew Stafford is in contract negotiations with the Kittens.
Calico,
I grew up in LA and I don’t recall any of the things you are talking about. We didn’t have any of those things in Lower Alabama. Are you sure you really live there?
H
OK I'm revising my picks. I had us taking a "surprise" but WR just makes more sense:
DET - Stafford
STL - J.Smith
KC - Curry
SEA - Crabtree
CLE - Orakpo
CIN - Monroe
OAK - J.Maclin (welcome aboard)
Psycho (Yes that's a JAX pick)
I'm not so sure we should have ZBS prototype at every position anyway because sooner or later we are also going to have to pass the damn ball.
Doesn't it make more sense to have a ZBS blocker at every position BUT LT???
I think I'd pick a LT because he isn't a ZBS rather than because he is.
Gallery coming out of college would prolly be the best ZBS LT in the history of the league, but we found out he was worthless against speed rushers on the outside (and yes, I know we weren't running the ZBS when he played LT, but he'd be just as wortless at LT now as he was then.)
Gimmee someone to give up just 2 sacks a season at LT and work around his ZBS deficiencies.
Further.. if a LT screws up his running assignment we get stopped for short loss at worst.
OTOH, if a LT screws up his passing assignment, he gives up a sack, and as we have seen with JRuss, all too often a fumble.
Which part is more important?
Raider Beat reports (draft day) trade bait may include Fargas. I'm a big fan of Fargas, but hope he is traded for the following reasons:
1- McFadden and Bush should be made the focus of our running game. Loyalties to Fargas may hamper this.
2- Louis Rankin (last year's top pre-season RB) should be ready to step up.
3- Fargas trade value, while not great, may never be as good. Primarily because he's healthy.
4- a trade may allow us to move up and select a DT, DE or other player that is needed.
Gary,
That’s why I’m high on Oher. I believe he has the ability to do both. Smith is an awesome talent, but I’m not sure he fits the ZBS as well as Oher. Also, the ZBS requires a lot of coordination and timing on the line. Being quick is a definite plus.
NYRaider,
I agree with the Fargas thing, even though I’m a big fan. I assume you mean move up in rounds 2 and later, I don’t think we could package him and move up in round 1. I would like an extra pick in round 2 if possible. Plus then we would get to see what Rankin could really do.
H
Calico, you can argue all you want. Every football team starting up in Los Angeles has made EXACTLY the same arguments you're making. But actual history (which you completely ignore) puts the total lie to it. The Chargers failed, the Rams Failed, the Raiders failed, the Express failed, the Avengers failed. EVERY (read that again) EVERY pro football team that has EVER entered the LA market ultimately FAILED. Argue with that!
H:
When was the last time you were actually living in SoCal ... 10 years ago? 20 years ago? 30 years ago? What 'things' are you referring to with your comment,
"I grew up in LA and I don’t recall any of the things you are talking about."
Yes, I currently live in SoCal. Yes, I was born and raised in SoCal. I have lived in SoCal for 40+ years.
1964-1982: Palos Verdes Estates, CA
1982-1987: Santa Barbara, CA
1988: MCRD San Diego
1989-1990: Subic Bay, Philippines
1990-1991: Kuwait, Saudia Arabia
1992-1997: El Segundo, CA
1998-2000: Manhattan Beach, CA
2000-today: Torrance, CA
5/1/09: Moving to Gardena, CA
The only time I wasn't living in SoCal was my stint in the Marines.
What's your point? Are you trying to imply that I'm not qualified to talk about the LA sports market? Give me a break. I have been knee deep in the LA sports market since I was a toddler in the 1960s.
BTW, my 1 central point about the viability of LA market to support an NFL team is very simple: the key is a state of the art, first class venue.
BR: Name 1 football team in LA history that has played in a modern stadium? Crickets.
My point which you conveniently always neglect is forget the past. Your past and teams you name are TOTALLY irrelevant?
I'm talking about a state of the art, first class venue for NFL games not some archaic, piss soaked stadium (Colisium) or baseball stadium (Big A) for football games ... great site lines at the Big A, right? What a joke.
You talk about the OC market of the 70s ... who cares that this market has tripled in the last 20 years?
You talk about the Express and Avengers ... who cares about 2nd rate leagues?
You talk about the Chargers from the early 60s "failing" ... 45 years later a lot has changed. The TV revenue, salary cap, CBAs, the game itself.
You talk about the Rams and Raiders "failing" ... The Big A and LA Colisium were complete dumps.
And, Calico, that's another reason I love arguing with you. At the end of the day, we can always find something to agree on. It's a very positive advisarial relationship. If they put us in DC, on oposite sides of the aile, we'd get shit done.
H, Cable said that he thinks Smith would work well in any system. In fact, he said all of the top four could play immediately and play in any system. That's why I have to believe that he's looking for one of those guys (either one or two of them) to be there at #7. And if that guy(s) is no longer on the table, they'll trade down. Cable said Smith athleticism (inspite of his size) allows him to do things others of his size can't. He implied that Smith could ZB well AND protect JaMarcus' backside. That's why I'm beginning to think that Smith is his guy - Oher I think, might be the other.
I also think it's possible that the Raiders will NOT draft a WR. The Raiders have a lot of question marks currently sitting on their roster. I think Cable will first attempt to remove all of the questions, and then rebuild the position (if necessary) next year.
I think the primary positions addressed in the draft will be - OT, DE/DT, OLB and Safety. I also think that Cable will give a very long look at Jarron Gilbert out of San Jose State. Here's why:
1) One thing that Gruden did, that Cable seems inclined to latch on to, is look for players with local ties - players who have lived in this area and LIKE living in this area - and who would like to play their whole career for the local teams.
2) Cable is gravitating toward players who are the most teachable. Gilbert was a walk-on and not on ANYONE's raidar until late in his Junior season. Starting his senior year, nobody expected that he'd get drafted, but that he might be able to hook to a team as a FA. NOW, some are projecting him to go in the 2nd round. I'd say that shows that Gilbert has the ability to learn, and learn quickly.
Gilbert is best at DT, but is built more as a DE. He can play both, either as a run stopping DT or a run stopping DE. He's fast for his position, and he's got the frame to add weight without losing any speed or agility.
Calico,
It was a joke. Where I grew up we refered to LA as L-ower A-labama. Reread the post. People in Montgomery, Alabama would go down to the beaches in LA, AKA The Redneck Riviera.
It's where Snake and I grew up. He grew up on the eastern side of Mobile Bay and I grew up on the western side.
Aside from my last rant, don't take much of what I say seriously.
Thanks for your service Leatherneck. They're some of my favorite people and relatives.
H
Calico, there's always a reason teams fail. In each case so far, the problem has been inadequate attendance. Since it was you who put up college ball in your argument, I'd add that USC doesn't have any trouble filling the LA coliseum.
And whenever I say that football failed in LA, you tell me that's because the fans couldn't go to an amusement park (a new, super delux, super stadium with beer gardens and a playground for the kiddies). I'm sorry, Calico, that that arguement seems to accentuate my point - that Angelenos would rather go to amusement parks than football games.
"...I grew up in LA and I don’t recall any of the things you are talking about. We didn’t have any of those things in Lower Alabama..." ~H
ROFLMAO!
"Are you trying to imply that I'm not qualified to talk about the LA sports market? Give me a break..." ~Calico Jack
CJ!
Hey, brah! H was just reaching up and yanking your chain a little bit!
Prior to moving back to Oakland in 1995, the L.A. Coliseum's NFL-configured seating capacity was about 92,000. That would be tough for any team to sell out on a regular basis! Plus, it's in the heart of the Watts district, right?
I think a new, classy venue would work as well...!
~'Cat
H, L(ower) A(labama) is an excellent venue for football. Folks there can't get enough of the stuff. I actually think that a pro team in a 55,000 seat venue would do very well there. I think too much emphasis is made on large cities. Folks in big cities often won't go to games because they have to drive 30 minutes to the facility. Folks in smaller population venues will often drive for six hours to go see a game. Passion is often the key for a successful team, and not potential numbers.
As an example, I'd use theatre. Some of the finest theatre in the country is performed and attended in places like Ashland, Oregon and Louiville, Kentucky. They sell out every performance for eight performances a week. The most successful theatre in the country is NOT on Broadway.
Oh, and for my first post, I wanted to talk about this, but answered Calico instead...
If you check out an article from the SF Chron on Raidernews.com, regarding Gruden's comments on what the Raiders should focus on in the draft. While he did say that Al always makes the final call on the pick, he also said that Davis is willing to take chances and he admired Davis for that. He said that Davis might well draft who Cable wants, but it's up to Cable to sell Al his choice. (And this backs up everything I've heard in the past, and argued on this board.) He also seemed to be on board with the Jano pick, outlining the logic of the pick. So I hope we can finally put that argument to rest.
Blanda,
yes, we can finally put the issue to rest.
al makes the picks.
and we didn't need gruden to tell us the HC's have input, and might even get their guy.
al himself was all to eager to let everyone in earshot know that art shell picked mike huff.
anyway, i'm not trying to dump on al. i actually think he's has one of his best off seasons in a long, long, time.
and i hope he continues on saturday.
Regarding Huff, I don't think that either Shell or Davis should be embarrassed by that pick. We needed a safety desperately, and Huff was the shining star in the draft. He played well in college and gave great performances at the combine and on pro day. It was a good call in spite of how it turned out.
And the reality is that it might not have turned out that badly. Huff played his first two seasons out of position, and had to relearn is position last year. Nnamdi is of the opinion that this will be a break out year for Huff. Of course, he said that last year too.
I'd also add that part of Huff's problem might have been spending his rookie season under Art Shell's coaching staff. I'm not talking about Willie Brown here, because Huff played his rookie season in run support at SS. This would go back to SOB, who I think is a very bad teacher.
Blanda,
The issue will never be put to rest.
H
H: Sorry for not realizing you were joking about L(ower) A(labama) not Los Angeles. My bad.
BR: You keep insisting that the LA Football teams "failed". The failures of the Express and Avengers was the league not the team's failures.
The failures of the Rams and Raiders if you want to call it that was having sub class stadiums.
The chief reason the Rams and Raiders both moved was largely due to an impossible situation to get an acceptable stadium.
Show me 1 NFL team that is playing in a relatively new, football only stadium who is failing. All you need to do is look at the Cardinals as a prime example of a team that once it got a new, modern stadium is doing extremely well. Prior to get a new stadium, this team's attendance was one of the worst in the league.
I'm standing behind my original point that the LA market is a VERY viable NFL market if and only if a new stadium is built. Normally I would be skeptical of this ever happening due to politics, lack of funding, no clear vision, etc. However the Roski plan is rock solid.
(1) The land is owned by Roski
(2) The environmental reports are finalized and clear
(3) The blue prints are done
(4) It is an ideal location with ample land for parking, restaurants, a beer garden, shops, etc.
(5) Roski has a proven record of delivering
Basically there are no hurdles politically or finanically. As soon as a team, any team commits to playing there, ground will be broke the following day.
I am totally convinced that an NFL team will be playing in LA by the year 2011. Now the only question is which team will make the move.
LA Market...
I was at the games constantly from "81" to "94"....I lived a short while in Pico Revera and 4 years in "SD" on the bay...57' Ketch...
LA Colisium....
Same place as the Trogens play on Saturday but the press does NOT treat it as such...
The Sunday event was publisized as being a bunch of "Thugs" and Violence was rampant everywhere...Soon it all most became such as the Punks began to show up in hords...Others complained and stoped attending out of fear for their families...The ticket price was only $13 and it started to become a venue for Punks who had never played a down in their lives but wanted to be "Tough" so attached themselves to the Raiders but not as fans...For the "Colors"...
I think this was a big part of the decission by "MrD" to bring his team home to "OakTown" and the price price was raised and "PSL"s were sold to prevent this from happening again...So we can all personally thank the "Mediot"s for disrupting what could have been a very good venue in LA with the Raiders the only show in town...
Sundays were protrayed completely negetively and the neiborhood was to blame....The same neiborhood where USC playes on Saturday...I went to most of the home games and never had a problem in that stadium...Was there at the "Pitts" game around "90" when a "Squeeler" Fan was damaged severly and the next home game when they took away our beer...The bad press continued to publisise the "Punk-Shit" and Rhome was on it like the bitch that he is....
That's what ruined the Raiders in LA and why we failed in that market...
PantyRaider..."Mediot" Shit!!!/_
CJ....
Does "MrD" still own the rights to the LA Market...He had to purchase it from the NFL when he moved his team south and they never paid him back...If so...Any team wanting to play in LA will have to pay Al Davis up front money or regular commissions...
That or include Al as a franchise owner...
PantyRaider....GOOOoooo "MrD"!!!/_
Draft Value...
"PB" "OT" from the "Bills" was worth the 28th pick in the "09" draft...How much can Boldin be worth...Was he in the "PB"...Yes...
"AZ" has the 31st pick....What would be the value to move up to the #7 spot....
Boldin I think and they should be damn happy to make the trade...
As I said before...We swap picks and get the player we want....Package another player or two with the deal a pick up an extra late 3rd pick just below #100...Now we have 4 picks on Saturday...
Fargas-Walter...
PantyRaider....Trade Bait!!!/_
Calico,
No problem. Chain Yanking is a time honored sport. We should do more of it here. Get a little obsurd. That way we could find out who in the media is mining us for opinion, news, rumor and innuendo.
Panty,
On multiple occasions, Al Davis has said he still owns the rights to the LA market and any team locating (expansion which is doubtful - we have a near perfect number with every geographic area covered) or relocating there would owe him that money.
H
CJ...
Correct and the price has certanly grown sense Al spent that money...NO doubt that will have an efect on any team who considers moving there so it's not exactly a free-n-clear deal as it stands...
Well as Psycho said it's a slow news week....So slow that we end up debating something as rediculas as LA 2 days before the draft....
Here is something that puts the right perspective on 2 days from now....
It was that rickety bridge between the two play stations, those few months between the Cotton Bowl and the fourth pick of the NFL draft, where McFadden faced a most magnified misery.
"That's the most up-and-down part there is about the whole thing," McFadden said with a bitter shaking of the head. "People build you up and then drag you down. It's very frustrating but, at the same time, leading all the way up to the draft, they're going to critique you to the T."
McFadden got his happy ending when the Raiders dismissed any and all character red flags - from the Little Rock bar fights to the multiple paternity suits - and embraced him in last year's opening round.
Keep that in mind when the Raiders pick again this year with the No. 7 overall pick of Saturday's NFL draft. Thanks to a new batch of five-star attractions with their own issues, the Raiders can choose again from several players with no business still being on the board beyond the top five.
Want the best wide receiver out there? Texas Tech touchdown maker Michael Crabtree might be around because of recent foot surgery.
More interested in college's top offensive lineman? Alabama left tackle Andre Smith won the Outland Trophy award as the top interior lineman. That was before his bowl-game suspension, NFL combine disappearing act and topless pro-day workout.
Bent on fixing the run defense? Boston College's B.J. Raji is the best defensive tackle in the class, but he can't escape unverified reports of a failed drug test.
By the way, want to know the Raiders' three biggest draft needs? A big-body receiver who can score, an athletic left tackle who can pass protect, and a run stuffer who can bail out a perpetually bad run defense.
It's no wonder Raiders coach Tom Cable refused to write off the above players. Frankly, he isn't sure what all the fuss is about.
"A lot of that is really speculation," Cable said. "None of those things are really real other than maybe the injury to Crabtree. Some of those other things, they are what they are. But, when you really dig down and look at it, they're probably OK in the way that they're evaluated and the way everybody sees them."
Raiders owner Al Davis has never shied away from a prize talent, no matter the predraft concerns. McFadden is the most recent case in point of a trend that has played out this past decade.
JaMarcus Russell was said to be out of shape and overweight before the Raiders took him No. 1 overall in 2007. The year before that, they took defensive back Michael Huff at No. 7 when he never had a defined position at Texas. Don't forget first-round kicker Sebastian Janikowski, despite the predraft threat of criminal charges and deportation in 2000.
For all the perceived problems, the Raiders drafted each of them based on their college track record. Cable said it will be no different under his watch. Bench presses and 40 times are fascinating, in-person interviews can be telling, but they don't trump game film.
After all, if someone like Crabtree was sensational playing with a stress fracture in his foot last season, imagine what he can do as a healthy NFL starter.
"You've got to keep it to who they are as football players," Cable said. "It's the level of talent they played at, who they played against and being able to compare players. Because you do get into this ... a lot of meeting and interviews. Then, pretty soon, that doesn't have to do with anything.
"It's still about who is this player and you've got to really keep that real."
PantyRaider....Which of the 3 named players is at the top of Al's tallent board....Or is it all 3.....
Panty, that's a very good point. For the local media, the LA Coliseum was only a "gang" venue when the Raiders played on Sunday. On Saturdays when the Trojans played there, it was a "Grand Old" stadium.
Calico, your point that I should attempt to name one team in a state of the art stadium that isn't successful is completely and totally absurd. Consider that the team HAS a new, state of the art stadium BECAUSE they are successful. It's not that they became successful because the got a new, state of the art stadium.
Blanda said "Gilbert was a walk-on and not on ANYONE's raidar until late in his Junior season
"raidar" pretty clever there blanda.
guys, i like crabtree as the pick. if not, gotta go OL or DL. if not, trade down. but that won't happen so we get the best player available.
Thanks, Scorpio. I didn't think anyone would even notice.
Some pre draft thoughts:
Cable's got his eye on four O-Linemen who could start in their first year in the NFL, and all, according to Cable, could fit into a ZB system. One is certainly going to be available at #7.
As Cable and the Raiders seem to be abundantly aware of the strongest area of the draft (late 1st through the 2nd round), so does everyone else in the league, so the prospects of trading down are slimmer than usual. There is also the fact that the entire league is now fatigued from paying super star contracts to kids who have never played a down in the NFL. Some in the media are reporting a virtual clamor by teams trade down - in a market with no takers. Enter Al Davis, with league's most extensive experience at NOT trading down.
It is said that Al Davis is inclined to reach. This may be the perfect season to do it. As potential draftees slip, in the darkness of night, in and out of Alameda, perhaps Davis is testing the waters to see if he can find a late 1st round / early 2nd round prospect willing to be taken in the top ten, but for low 1st round money. Cable and Davis can tell them, when you prove yourself the top ten money will be there, and based on the player's draft position, his stock will always be higher.
But as the prospects of trading down are small, the Raiders will be forced to make a pick at #7 even if their favorites are no longer on the board.
But right now, as things are panning out through the week, I think the Raiders absolutely pick an OT with the #7 pick. I cannot imagine a scenario where there isn't one of the four still there at #7. And Cable will convince Davis to take one of those linemen even if it is a reach. I do not think the Raider will pick a WR in this draft. That would add another WR who is a talented, but unproven prospect, and the Raiders already have about seven of those on the roster. So after the OT selection, it will be all about defense.
Blanda,
One problemo with your “testing the waters” theory. The only team allowed to test the waters is Detroit. They can talk football, work them out, interview them, but zero contract/financial discussions unless you hold the overall number one pick.
Once the Kittens sign someone, presumably Stafford, then the Nutered Sheep are on the clock and can discuss with anyone they want.
H
It's true that they can't discuss contracts, but they can plant seeds by suggesting what the Raiders might be thinking.
Regardless, only Oher among the four might be considered a reach at #7. I'd be perfectly happy with Oher at #7, but the Raiders may not want to pay him top 10 money.
BR:
The Roski stadium is a unique project unlike other stadiums that were built in the past. Other stadiums were planned, designed, and built with a team specifically in mind.
Also, you can't tell me the following applies to the Cardinals;
"Consider that the team HAS a new, state of the art stadium BECAUSE they are successful." Are you implying that the Cards were successful before this stadium was built and by what measure or standard?
From Field of Dreams, "Build it and they will come".
As I mentioned in an earlier post, I'm in synch with you on #7. Take a spin by SBF ... I posted my thought a few nights ago.
Neither Oher or Smith are "reaches" at #7. FF Toolbox scouting reports has Oher at #8 and Smith at #9 for their top 100 prospects. Both are tailor made for the NFL to start from day 1 and have potentially All Pro caliber careers.
Calico - I forgot about the Cards. Well, as they say, the exception proves the rule. How's that for an agravating response?
Anyway, I'm glad we agree on #7. I'm also pretty sure that we won't draft a WR, but if we do I think it will be a lower round pick. I think after #7 we will look to pick up a DL, a SS and a LB. Not necessarily in that order.
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Blanda: I do not think the Raider will pick a WR in this draft.
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I can see it only if Crabtree is available.
And I would like that pick.
If he's gone, I am all over ANY of the four LT's.
That or trading down would make me happiest!
The only way I see a trade down is if Sanchez is still on the board and there are teams thinking Jax might take him because Garrard had such a horrible year.
Very unlikely IMO.
We are picking 7th.
Ok, screw Crabtree...
http://raiderbeat.com/?p=1939
....quote...
At one point, a questioner asked Crabtree his thoughts on playing for the Raiders.
“I’m not cocky at all,” Crabtree said. “People talk, man, but I’m a cool guy. As for playing for the Raiders, no comment.”
[...]
The Browns reportedly “have all but crossed off Crabtree from their draft board after meeting with him last week, according to the Cleveland Plain Dealer.
The report said that Browns coach Eric Mangini was put off by Crabtree’s “diva attitude.”
.....end quote....
Just the words "diva attitude" and WR mixed together makes me want to run from this guy like the plague, let alone obviously he doesn't want to play for the Raiders.
Just gimmee a no nonsense LT...
Final decision.
I hate to do this and I'm not sure if it violates the "Stick'Em Draft Challenge but I would like to tweak my prediction ...
Original Picks:
Detroit: Stafford
St.Louis: Monroe
KC: Jason Smith
Seattle: Sanchez
Cleveland: Crabtree
Cincy: Andre Smith
Oakland: BJ Raji
New Revised Picks:
Detroit: Stafford
St.Louis: Jason Smith
KC: Monroe
Seattle: Curry
Cleveland: Sanchez
(Trade Quinn to TBay)
Cincy: Andre Smith
Oakland: Michael Oher
Call me crazy but in a draft day shock, I have Crabtree tumbling all the way down to #10 (S.F.)
KC traded Gonzalez to Atlanta. Is it just me, or does it appear every OTHER team in the AFC West is imploding this off-season? KC just went from bad to worse, but the Jay Cutler fiasco was priceless... forcing Denver to abandon a pro-bowl QB.
I'm predicting the Raiders draft WR at #7, but not necessarily Crabtree. Hell, even Nnamdi said on National TV that WR should be their top priority. Of course he probably also thinks our defense is fine.
Take,
I'm working on my picks, I should have them ready by Sunday.
Calico,
I would agree with you on your assessment of the Red Chickens and the “Build it and they will come” statement to a point.
If Arizona goes back to sucking, attendance will drop. The Atlanta Parakeets had a state of the art dome stadium with all the amenities. After the first year or two, things were great. But the product on the field would “stink on ice” (my movie reference – trivia name it anyone?). After the newness wore off with no improvement in the team sellouts stopped.
The same thing is happening in Oakland currently. If they make it to the bye week at .500 or better home sellouts will go up, especially if they were 3-1 at home. I think Take would agree on this point.
Personally I’m not a fan of all these “State of the Art” stadiums. I attended a Raider game at the Georgia Dome a few years back. It was too sterile, too clean, too pretty. I want a football atmosphere. I’m probably in the minority on this, but I prefer the old sport specific stadiums without all the jumbo tron screens and all that. You feel more a part of the game. That’s what’s great about The Black Hole.
Gary,
The Jacksonville scenario is not as far fetched as you might think. Garrard had a bad year, but he had a very good year the season before. So, he has the ability. The wild card in this is Garrard has Crohn’s Disease. He’s done some time in the hospital with it. It’s similar to what Rolf Benirschke had. And, it can flare up at any moment and will probably shorten his career. You have to really admire anyone with those types of diseases who line up and take the chance of a physical beat down each Sunday.
Speaking of Benirschke – a correction. I stated he was down about being released by the Raiders. Actually he was traded to the Dolts, but he was still down about it.
By the way. Where are all the folks who screamed we should have drafted Matt Leinart, then screamed we should have drafted Brady Quinn? Leinart can’t beat out a 36 year old QB and Quinn is reported on his way out with the Brownies. These two were considered the most NFL ready of their respective classes. If Russell takes that next step this season everyone of those folks should genuflect in the direction of Oakland, California and beg forgiveness.
H
200!!!
PSYCHO
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