Broncos Gameday Thread
It's probably now or never.
Incredibly, the Raiders are still in this. The Chiefs blew it once again today.
The division is still there for the taking, but first the Raiders must beat the Broncos.
Otherwise, momentum would be fully ceded to the Chargers, and the Raiders would be three games under .500 with five to play, which would effectively derail any road to a division title or a wild card spot, even if they were to win out from there.
Pagano has his work cut out for him. Musgrave is looking for revenge. This is a game the Raiders should win. Will they?
It's time turn it around and win out the rest of the schedule, starting today.
Incredibly, the Raiders are still in this. The Chiefs blew it once again today.
The division is still there for the taking, but first the Raiders must beat the Broncos.
Otherwise, momentum would be fully ceded to the Chargers, and the Raiders would be three games under .500 with five to play, which would effectively derail any road to a division title or a wild card spot, even if they were to win out from there.
Pagano has his work cut out for him. Musgrave is looking for revenge. This is a game the Raiders should win. Will they?
It's time turn it around and win out the rest of the schedule, starting today.
posted by Raider Take at 1:12 PM
24 Comments:
Bill Callahan may have been right.
I hate Talib, he is the dirtiest player in the League and the NFL needs to suspend this clown for his continued actions. He looks for fights, and the League needs to come down hard on him. You take away that factor from him, and he's a garbage CB.
The freaking Raiders blitzed today .... ALOT! I loved it! CBS reported that Downing will be fired at the end of the season. YES, I HOPE THEY HAVE ALREADY SPOKEN WITH MIKE MCCOY! It was a big division win today, with the Raiders first INT. I hate to say it, but the WRs played better when Cooper went out, Patterson came up HUGE! I hope Crabtree is not suspended, nor Gabe Jackson for that matter. I will take a W over the Doncos any day, I don't care how ugly.
Thanks everyone for the kind words before Thanksgiving. What I said was heart-felt, and I truly meant it. I hope to meet every single one of you one day. We are brothers and family. JUST WIN, BABY!
That was an amazing throw to end the game by Carr to Patterson. Raaaaaaaaaaaaiders.
Two thoughts. As the second half started I called my brother and said, please don't let Paxton get hurt.
Marshawn Lynch needs 20 carries every game. If only to keep the D fresh.
Have a good night
Sandy
Today's game was a battle of two bad teams. Broncos offense was so bad, they made the Raiders defense look a lot better than it was. Paxton Lynch was the Raiders best friend today.
Honestly, the Raiders are lucky Seimian didn't start, but even he was ignoring open WRs.
So the Raiders dialed up a little more pressure. That was good to see. And they were able to run the ball effectively... even though playcalling was predicable, again. But there's nothing I saw today that would make me change my mind about wanting Downing out, ASAP.
Crabtree made it one whole play before retaliating for last year. Way to be a team player.
So we've clawed our way to 3rd in the division. So much better than a loss. At least, for now, games still mean something.
Jeez NY cheer up. It's a win and it is better than the Sunday night blues
Regards
Sandy
Indeed. And I do appreciate not having the Sunday night blues. But I'm uninspired by what I saw. The offense is still offensive, and I pin that on Downing being a terrible play caller.
Ironically, the Raiders now control their own destiny. They have one game each against the Chiefs and the Chargers and can win the division if they win out. Assuming the Chiefs and Chargers each lose at least one or two more games, that gives the Raiders even more cushion.
But the simple fact is they have to beat the Chiefs and Chargers. Those games are huge.
On a side note, I read that Alib ripped off Crabtree's chain again, or at least tried to. That's what started today's fight. What a tool.
Cheers!
Given we all seem to be unanimous in criticizing the coaching and with reason. However with the exception of a few geniuses like Bellicheck and Popovich I often think coaches get too much credit and too much blame. That being said and ignoring the coaching issues for a moment I would like to pose a question to the group
How much of last year's 12-4 record was fool's gold and Carr playing out of his mind vs this year's disappointment. Or does the truth lie somewhere in the middle.
Regards
Sandy
Sandy, you want to the long version or the short one... uh, I'll give you the short one!
I could just point you to the Texans playoff game for the answer, but that would be too easy.
IMO, it was clear even before this season that the Raiders overachieved last year. Del Rio looked like a genius for calling high-risk plays that the Raiders were successful and helped win close (awesome) games. The most obvious was a 2-pt conversion to beat the Saints when Del Rio should have kicked the extra pt for a tie. Perhaps too ballsy but we didn't care because it worked!
We all knew the Raiders defense was their weakness, despite having MVP Mack. Honestly, even Mack was playing outside himself, with five sacks in one game. And he and Irving were masterful at strip sacks.
That leads to the another key element: turnover ratio. Raiders led the league this time last year.
Fast forward to this year, the high-risk plays haven't worked for the Raiders. The defense is so bad, teams can afford to put extra players on Mack and keep him mostly in check. And the Raiders defense has proven incapable of forcing turnovers. It took a heads up play by a 49er to make the Raiders first and only INT of the season.
With that said, I am floored how bad Downing has been. I was surprised to see Musgrave leave, but also excited about the prospect of opening up the Raiders' high-powered offense even more. What we got was punked by Raiders' brass who empowered a rookie OC that is way over his head calling plays, managing the play clock, and formulating scheme that most suits a roster of players which is decidedly lopsided with talent on his side of the ball.
IMO, the longer Del Rio turns a blind eye to this problem, the more at risk he should be at the end of the season.
A point I made earlier was that Del Rio almost certainly became directly involved in the defense before going to an extreme measure of firing his DC. Yet, the defense got worse.
Here, Del Rio has relied too heavily on Downing to correct a problem that he created. It's like we time warped back to the days of Denis Allen and his staff during which stupid and predictable ruled.
Raiders have the Giants this week. Giants are badly wounded but they have proven to be capable spoilers.
Yet, after the Giants, the Raiders have to face the Chiefs, Cowboys, Eagles (are you kidding!) and Chargers.
Meanwhile, I think the only team with a winning record the red hot Chargers have left is the Chiefs.
So, what are the Raiders chances? .........1:1,000,000?
Cheers!
NY good points, last year I count 4 games that could have gone either way TB, Carolina, New Orleans, Balt maybe even both Chargers games.
It seems the team's luck has gone in the other direction this year especially turnovers as you point out.
Hopefully the secondary improves next year and we find a complimentary edge rusher to Mack.
With crabtree suspended for two games it will be difficult to beat the Chiefs but at least the games still mean something.
Regards
Sandy
Sandy,
I think the answer to your question lies in a little bit of both; and lies in the middle.
I think last year's offensive success was Musgrave giving DC the ability to check off plays, and running a system Derek was comfortable with (shotgun, fast-paced, read the defense and make a play call). The problem this year is Downing has taken that away from DC. Last season, Musgrave was talking with Derek on the sidelines between every ball possession; and this year, Derek sits alone on the bench with no coach with him going over adjustments. Musgrave was good at teaching his QB how to run the offense and letting him learn. Downing has come in with a "scheme" where everyone needs to get on board, instead of utilizing strengths. Musgrave did a lot of things right, but was way too conservative and didn't open up the book (he would be killing it right now with Lynch as his RB though). It is going to take Derek (and the o-line) a few years to get used to this system, but we don't have a "few years". I think if the Raiders went after McCoy to be OC, we will have the Raiders offense back on track like last year. If we keep Downing, it is not going to be as good.
Carr played out of his mind last year because he was able to utilize his strengths, get back to that philosophy as your "scheme" and he'll be back. Force him to play in a "scheme" he is unsure of, and it will bite us. He has the capability to play like Manning and Brady, and he needs a coach that will let him do it.
On a different note, we all saw a difference on our defense this last week. Blitzes, getting Irvin back involved in pass rush, and we got more out of our defense this week than we did all year. Pagano has clearly proven the biggest issue on defense was coaching. We need to fix the other issue of Linebacker and DBs.
JUST WIN, BABY!
Nate,
I love your optimism on Pagano but I wonder if we have to give more of the credit to Paxton Lynch lol for the defensive improvement.
Good news is we will be facing Geno Smith this week, so we could get a repeat performance.
McCoy would not be a bad choice for offensive coordinator. How about Marc Trestman for coordinator. I saw he just won his third Grey Cup and everywhere he has been in the nfl including the Raiders he had a great offense.
Regards
Sandy
You guys have made the point before that the Raiders offense has moved to more zone blocking. That has been one of their biggest downfalls, which should be obvious to any head coach... yet, where's Del Rio?
We all agree Musgrave was kind of conservative last year, but Downing makes him look like a wild man.
Interestingly, last year the Raiders were among league leaders in explosive plays of 20 yards or more. This year, they are among the worst, if not dead last.
Just seems when you put all this sh*t together, it's pretty obvious the offense jumping the shark is not random, circumstance, or anything else that's beyond Downing's control. It rests squarely on Downing... and for lack of intervention, now it's squarely on Del Rio.
Even if Del Rio doesn't fire him, he could at least tell him to stop the nonsense and play football the way these guys are capable of playing. We've seen the tape.
Some news today, besides the fact Eli Manning got dissed by his head coach.
McFadden announced his retirement. What a disappointing career, plagued by injuries.
Also, read that the Raiders designated Hamilton for return from IR, leaving Janokowski on season-ending IR. But Hamilton isn't eligible to play for a couple weeks.
In another move, Raiders promoted this kid from USC. from the media: "Whitney, who caught 11 passes for 144 yards and two touchdowns in his two-year career at USC, signed with the Raiders as an undrafted free agent in May. Oakland waived him after the preseason and then signed him to its practice squad."
11 catches for his entire career at USC? And he's playing! WTF? Is this the kind of personnel move the Raiders make en route to trying to win their division?
They should have promoted Breon Borders weeks ago when they ran out of serviceable CBs and started using safeties to play corner.
Isn't it stuff like this that will ultimately prevent the Raiders from becoming a really good team?
Good news Crabtree suspension cut to one game he will be back for KC
Good night
Sandy
If Seabass has played his last game with the Raiders I will miss him. He was a very good player a great Raider and will be missed.
Thanks for the memories
Sandy
Paxton aside, Denver's o-line is pretty decent; and nasty, and the Raiders ran them over and took away their running game (which is what they were counting on).
Raiders did, however, not blitz as much once Semen (intentionally misspelled) came into the game. Pagano gave some different looks that the Doncos couldn't figure out. I'm hoping Amerson comes back this week, if not, then against the Chiefs. I agree with NY though, they should have promoted Borders.
I'm pretty sad if this is it for Seabass. Dude has been stellar. I'm happy for Hamilton though, I think he can be a special player. The guy works hard, and I thought he was going to beat out Sean Smith coming into the season. I really like his play. Good dude too.
I think Del Rio needs to break the choke hold that Downing has on Carr, and let Carr do his thing. He's said it best, "The Head Coach goes as far as his QB." Anyone know if Gabe Jackson is going to be suspended, or was the ejection good enough? I haven't heard anything but Crab and Talib. It also has taken away from who's been practicing and who's not.
I can't believe the Giants benched Eli Manning and are going to start Geno Smith. I hope the Eagles bench Carson Wentz when we play them in a few weeks. That would be epic. JUST WIN, BABY!
Manning's benching is a travesty. Guy has 210 straight starts and has done more for the Giants than any player or coach. If Mara wants to bench someone to audition talent for next year, he should bench McAdoo.
McAdoo just said he went with Geno because he is more creative than Manning. WHAT!!!???? I've never heard anything more stupid than that statement in my life!
McAdoo probably thinks Uncle Rico from Napoleon Dynamite missed his chance to be the best QB ever. Seriously, I wish Elway would hire this clown to be the Doncos Head Coach for life; they deserve each other.
I feel bad for Eli, but I still can't get over how people say he never quit. What about when the Chargers drafted him, does that still count? I'm glad he threw a fit over that, because imagine having to play against Eli 2 games every seasons, and then he and Peyton? Uuuugh, gives me nightmares.
Just reported by PFT:
"John Mara: No guarantee Ben McAdoo will remain coach for the rest of the season"
Looks like the Giants are busy wasting their time.
McAdoo, Smith and now Manning will all be gone next year.
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