Jaguars Gameday Thread
I was gonna say it's now or never, but then I realized it's already too late for that. Play for pride. GO RAIDERS!
posted by Raider Take at 10:12 AM
Sunday, November 06, 2022
DEFENDING THE NATION!
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Saw something that shows the culture of this Raider team, a Raider team that had the ultimate culture last year.
TV shows Carr sitting on the bench, the score was 20-7 for the Raiders. Hollins is talking with Carr and they both laugh like they have it all sown up. This from a team that was just embarrassed last week, being shutout. This from a team that is 2-5 and going no where. If this team was doing the right things, they wouldn't be laughing like they are at a party or something on the sidelines. Jags kick a FG and then score 2 TTD's to start the 2nd half, while the Raiders drop passes, run improper routes and can't stop an Offense that has been horrible lately. Something is very wrong in Raiderland, you can take that, to the bank.
The Raiders routinely won last drive games in 2021. This year they routinely lose those games. Play-calling obviously is a factor, but I can't put my finger on why Carr has lost his late game magic. He routinely chokes now in these type games.
At this point, the Raiders are in the drivers seat for a top draft pick. Pathetic!
This is a staggering stat...
Raiders had 3 blown leads of 17 pts or more in 628 games before McDaniels arrived and have 3 such blow leads since.
Hard to imagine McDaniels can survive the season.
NY sorry to correct you but it was only twice in Raiders history that they have blow 17 leads prior to that fool McDaniels showing up. Sandy
I think we're all speechless at this point.
Sounds like players are starting to revolt. Mark has a real mess on his hands. I praised Mark for getting the team to a point I thought they would reach, now, Mark has to start from ground zero again.
Just read someone say that Billycheat in N.E. hasn't hired a real OC because he knew it wouldn't be long until McDaniels was back.
I really don't know how Mark can watch this and think this regime will be good for the long haul. 2 long standing, top players in the league, Carr and Adams, are calling out the coaching after half a season, it's not good.
Dumbfounded, for sure.
I will say, the Raiders have plenty of holes in their roster, but this is on the coaches and their inept game planning and playcalling.
Eight games in and I don't know which I would prefer, Davis to fire McDaniels or give him another chance in 2023 to grow into the position. Obviously, I want McDaniels to succeed but he has been incompetent thus far.
As bad as the defense has been, they have given the offense the ball with a chance to win 5 out of 6 losses. That's remarkable. Yet, each time, the playcalling has been awful and the Raiders have choked. Carr deserves some of the blame, but he's the guy with 30 career last drive wins, including 6 last year. So Carr's ability to get the job done should not be in question here.
The rapid and absolute collapse of the Raiders season is nothing short of stunning. How could McDaniels have possibly guided the Patriots offense for so long and not exposed this level of incompetence?
Sandy,
Up 20-0 v Cardinals to lose. Up 17-0 v Chiefs to lose. Up 17-0 v Jags and lost.
Davante called out the coaches yesterday. Carr was asked about losing 3 games with a 17 point lead this season. His answer, "There's a lot I want to say about it, but I'm not going to say it here."
At this point, McDaniels and Graham are the issue; Raiders look lost on both sides of the ball. There was one play in the second half, where Carr pointed out a blitzer to the O-line, and they let him through untouched.
The question becomes, who do you want as a HC? I think our biggest problem has been going with experimental coaches. I am not a Gruden fan, never was. I think our coach needs to be someone who can game plan to the strengths of the players. I'm a big believer in that kind of system. Andy Reid is that kind of guy, and that is why he is successful. Bill Bellichek is that kind of coach, Robert Saleh, Sean McDermott, and Pete Carroll are those kind of coaches.
I see people on Twitter calling for Sean Payton, I think he is another Gruden. He will build to a system; and quite frank, I am tired of system guys. Our biggest successes came with Hue Jackson, Del Rio/Musgrave, and last year when Bissaccia took over; all of who were build to the player's strengths guys.
Frank Reich was just fired from the Colts, he is a players strength guy; but didn't have any strengths on his offense. I personally would like a HC with HC experience; but here are some that I would give a chance on:
Shane Steichen (OC, Eagles)
Demeco Ryans (DC, 9ers)
Frank Smith (OC, Dolphins)
Don Martindale (DC, Giants)
I would love to see someone with HC experience. There are rumors that Mike Tomlin is on the hot seat in Pittsburgh. If he gets the axe, he'd move to the top of the list. If not, Jim Harbaugh is my top guy. I'm sure as the season moves on and ends, there will be more candidates; but McDaniels and company is not working. They have lost the locker room more than Del Rio did in 2017
Saw Carr yelling at McDaniels a couple of times yesterday. Once near the end of the game and another time when they were on the bench together.
I have seen Carr not being the QB he was prior to McDaniels. It started from the 1st game, Carr has never looked comfortable in this Offense.
Renfrow has fallen off a cliff, gameplans are drawn up the morning of the games, it would seem.
The team has lost whatever it had built prior to McDaniels, down to rock bottom.
Feel bad for Carr, he has been a loyal warrior, year after year for a team unable to find it's ass with both it's hands. Feel bad for the fans too, the best fans in the world and this is what we get, year after year, Goodell must be a happy guy?
Gruden says it right.
https://twitter.com/LOP_LWO/status/1589430512091037696
Nate, I disagree that Sean Payton is a system guy, at least to the extent that he had immediate success in NO. It didn't take him 4 years to build a team.
In simple terms, Ziegler and McDaniels lied to Mark Davis that they could advance the team with the roster Gruden/Mayock left them, plus a few tweaks here and there. Perhaps the most egregious mistake was their epic whiff on the O-line, completely ignoring deficiencies any 5th grader could have pointed out. They had the time and money to sign a decent FA RT, but they ended up platooning with marginal vets and two rookies, including a 7th rounder.
Patrick Graham was way overrated. He fielded a decent defense in NY last year, but the Giants D is better this year without him. That speaks for itself.
Patriots offense doesn't even have a designated OC. Turns out, Bill Belichick doesn't need coordinators. That begs the Q: would he even bring McDaniels back if the Raiders fired him? If he's watched any Raiders football this season, the answer should be resoundingly, NO!
NY, We had some serious banter going at the start of the year when I was down on McDaiels and Ziegler. Unfortunetly it was worse than I even thought. The one issue that made me go negative on those two right from the start was the gross negiligence in regards to the OL. Everyone and their dog knows that Carr really struggles against pressure. They did zero to address this. In fact they compunded hte problem by not even playing what turned out to be the starters in the preseason. Everything can be traced back to this.
Sandy
"teams adjust and we have to adjust back". Quote from Graham the DC.
What is going on in Vegas? A woman president and now this coaching staff, Mark, what have you done?
This season has gone off the rails, and now yet another former first-round pick has been jettisoned. When will the Raiders EVER turn this ship around?
Why is it on McDaniels and Graham? Why isn't it on:
1. The NFL for 1st pressuring the front office to hire all kinds of NFL people and forget about keeping some of Al's people.
2. The NFL/ owners for pressuring the Raiders to move to L.V.
3. The NFL/ owners for conning fans by trying to get ex-Raiders to be leaders but not really able to make decisions without their
4. The owners for pressuring the Raiders to become more valuable by bringing in business(es)/ billionaire(s) Al's wouldn't want inside the Raiders.
5. Raidernation for believing that 'model franchise' none sense then after years of losing STILL listening to the media/ NFL. Even though the Raiders played in a SB but then the NFL passed them by over 1 year that Al's ideas were old/ stuck in 90s'.
So, you believe its' been bad decisions and hyped up coaches along with issues with money, top employees and ownership that is causing the issues with the team?
But if that's true then why are you still looking at what these regime will do instead of asking for the Raiders to explain their lack of good decision making?
Is everybody they hire that bad or bad at all? Weren't most of these guys winning before they came here?
It seems the model franchise way is only dong a little for us and really hasn't done anything except give us 2 playoff games.
why are fans allowing the NFL to destroy the teams' commitment to putting out a good product.
Is NE the only dynasty in NFL history? Is their way the only 1? You just have to have a franchise QB, be cheap and draft high character guys and then coach them up? They had T. Brady we didn't but you expect to win like the Patriots(?) or Pittsburgh with great drafting but a conservative attitude but they kept their front office people for years and didn't erase them when new coaches/ GMs' came.
Well, you had some of those things in Al's era but you thought the NFL could bring people who could rebuild us.
You wanted Al out but you wanted the new NFL front office to build a winning culture.
Yea, you were upset with losing and wanted a change. The NFL came in claimed it could help.
What you got was a greedy league that didn't care about us until the L.V. thing came up. Some fans still believe the Raiders made that deal and it was done to get them a new stadium. It was about hate, payback and changing this team to something Al would hate.
The Raiders using ideas of other teams is cool and moving from 1 system to another is o.k. but who do you copy? Reggie and the Pats' guys? you listened and you have 2 playoff games why not try Al's ideas again? Why not bigger, faster more athletic and let the Pats' guys coach em up? Why not spend on a star FA CB, edge or RB? We could show speed and size and surprise some teams and maybe the Pats' guys could use some of Al's ideas- they could use both systems.
Abram being released now is a bit much. This guy had a body of work before the season that should've made any DC cringe. He can't cover! That would be an important factor for any safety, so you'd think.
IMO, it's not entirely Abram's fault. Under Bradley, Abram was asked to play more around the LOS, where he does his best work.
However, under Graham, not only have we seen Abram more in coverage, but we've seen Chandler and Crosby and other DL in coverage. In a word, ridiculous.
If we've learned anything about the 2022 Raiders Defense, it's that no lead is safe. Patrick Graham is a fraud, masquerading as a defensive coordinator.
NY, you are absolutely right with Abram. He needed to be near the LOS. However, in our division, he needs to be able to cover the TE; and that is something he cannot do. He bites on everything. The problem though, he was not sticking with his assignments. He needed to be cut at the beginning of the season though.
However, my beef is also with the DC. A good DC would utilize him to spy QB's like Mahomes, Herbert, Wilson, Lamar, etc. Take away their game of creating space and more time with their legs by having Abram knock them down. Since we are running a hybrid Nickel defense, we can afford to do that. We don't need to get creative with the packages we run. Let Crosby and Jones rush, let Abram spy the QB, get a DT that can get push and take away double/triple teams off Maxx, let Moehrig ball hawk passes, let our corners play man-zone (zone to take away cross routes) and bump the WR's off the line. This is not rocket science.
Abram has been used as a spy and he sucked at it. As for Moehrig, that's been his job in the defensive backfield and he is regularly in the wrong position to make a play on the ball. Both these Gruden era safeties are below average. The Raiders can do much better and IMO they should have before the season started.
Now all they can hope for is a compensatory draft pick.
Davante:
“At the end of the day, if we’re just going to concede and say, ‘Oh, they double-teamed Tae, so it’s forcing the ball to him if we threw it to him,’ then I’ve got no business being in this building, because that’s what teams are going to do. So, if you think that the only way I’m going to get the ball is when I’m singled up, then I’m going to have four catches on the year.”
I don't know if this is aimed at Carr, coaches or both. But it's definitely aimed.
a lot of arrows being shot out right now. DC Graham threw his players under the bus in his last interview. What a mess and we have a woman prez to clean it up. Mark, what have you done?
Take,
I believe it was aimed at both. I think DC's disdain to make mistakes makes it difficult for him to throw into double-coverage. Yet, in reality, every throw is nearly double covered in the League. Tae is challenging DC to not give up so easily on a play. At the same time, he is calling out the play calling too. This last game was the tale of 2 halves. The first half was the Tae and Carr show; the second half was a completely different game plan of protecting the Lead. I think what Tae was saying is what we've been saying here on your site; "The more aggressive win." If you start aggressive, stay aggressive. Carr and the coaching staff need to learn this lesson; and Tae is calling them both out on it.
Reports are that Darren Waller and Hunter Renfrow will be headed to the IR.
Who makes the decisions?
The Raiders hired Reggie?
Reggie hired D. Allen?
D. Allen hired the assistants?
Why didn't they try and keep Palmer?
They went and got:
M. Schuab
M. Flynn
Why didn't they try to develop TP2?
They went with:
M. McGloin
Why? McGloin was an UDFA who wasn't really ready to be a starting QB.
Pryor could've won more games and was the starting QB.
So, Reggie was the foundation setter? really? He was supposed to:
1. break down the old Raiders' and overhaul the team.
2. get rid of those overpriced contracts and fix the salary cap.
3. bring some discipline and NFL culture to the team.
4. get the old front office execs in line or fire them.
* Drafts?: other than '14 when has this team ever had a big time draft? the new Raiders hit the jackpot with:
D. Carr(QB) and K. Mack(DE/LB) in the '14 draft. It got us pumped we felt we had a pro bowl level edge and finally, a franchise QB.
free agency?: Well, the 1st year doesn't count because when you overhaul, you are signing a lot of free agents/ draft picks.
But '13-present: the Raiders refuse to sign ANY star free agents. The media claimed star players weren't that important with systems like the Patriots and Steelers who take a tough attitude with stars and won't pay them huge contracts; you just need good players that you coach up- have a plan and work on winning.
With Bellichick/ Brady, Steelers, GB and
NYG dominating the NFL, this claim was bought by fans.
You couldn't be big spending and talent loaded. PARITY makes a level playing field(?) and average-good guys can be coached up.
So Al just can't win anymore and teams like that but strange if the Raiders' are mediocre wouldn't PARITY make them as good as any team? if they are loaded with talent and a legend in the GM seat then shouldn't they be 1 of the best PARITY teams in the league?
RT, I would guess Adams words are more directed to McDaniels. That said, the Raiders have talented WRs, so they should throw to best (least) coverage options.
We've all watched Derek Carr for his entire career. He's had some ups and downs, but he's had far too many changes at HC and even more at OC. Carr is one of the best in the league at last drives, but he's choked each one this year. Why?!
I feel strongly that this is not a Carr issue. The problems the Raiders are experiencing fall directly on Josh McDaniels and Patrick Graham.
Suddenly, the players are too dumb to run Graham's defense? What are we back in 2002? We're America's dumbest team all over again.
Something really stinks!!
I truly believe it is more difficult to learn defense than it is to learn offense. Wade Phillips is a prime example. Coming into a team his first year as DC, his defense looks sloppy; but the next season he has a top 5 defense. I can see than happening with Graham. Yes, the Giants look better right now, but the Giants offense is also playing better than they were when Graham was there; so there is more balance. I believe one of Graham's guys took over too, so there is continuity in scheme. We all knew coming in there were major issues with the D-line, and questions about the DBs.
The biggest question mark and weakness on offense was the line, and with Kolton Miller struggling, you have to wonder if he is playing through injury again. With all that said, something isn't right in Vegas. You cannot tell me that DC, who comes in early and stays in late, learning the play book with his perfectionist work ethic and style is too dumb to learn a system. You cannot tell me that guys like Denzel Perryman who has had much success in this league, Rock Ya-Sin, Chandler Jones, and others are struggling because they are too dumb to learn a system. Coaches have to learn to adjust to the strengths of the players; and when they don't know how to is when players start getting hurt. Waller has dealt with an injury all off-season and season. Renfrow hasn't been right since his injury. Carr doesn't seem to be making good choices on offense. Where's Chandler Jones? How is it that some of the Leagues best players have issues like this and it be on the players execution? Now, what should have happened a few weeks ago, Waller and Renfrow are on IR missing another 4 weeks. Blake Martinez retired, Jonathan Abram cut, Jonathan Hankins traded. It seems McDaniels and company has lost the locker room and player's confidence. At the same time, it seems that Mark Davis is content on letting them destroy the team to do things their way. Stuck in the middle is Raiders fans getting spit on and kicked.
The Raiders have become the definition of insanity, doing the same thing year-in and year-out expecting different results. I'm not sure McDaniels has the wherewithal to change and adapt; and I'm not sure Mark Davis knows how to either. The team of decades has become a laughingstock, and the Raiders may further embarrass themselves against the Colts this weekend. God help us.
Nate, I don't think we can assume Mark Davis is "content" about anything involving the Raiders.
The team of the decades faded decades ago, sometime around the period they lost the moniker of being the winningest team on MNF. I think Howard Cosell was still announcing then.
This team is off the rails.
Martinez announces retirement. After a couple of weeks, he said, nah, not worth it. Bad optics and sends another bad signal that it's rotten in Raiderland.
Mark is going to have to do something, his hand will be forced. This seems to want to continue and if something isn't done, that fire is going to be unstoppable. Mark, what have you done?
Think for a second everything that happened last season and somehow the Raiders held it together, played their asses off down the stretch and made the playoffs.
Now they are in a race for top draft pick.
Unless the current gameplan is to tank games to that end, I believe the Colts game this weekend could end McDaniels HC career, should the Raiders lose.
Not sure howe Mark Davis is holding it together, except that he doesn't really have options.
The only black hole in Vegas these days is the one the team has fallen into.
Be upbeat and keep expecting something better!
But don't let a Corporation tell you what winning is and 'ain't!
You keep talking about talent yet, its like it wasn't important during the Patriots' dynasty!
After they started winning it became a good thing to have cheaper salaries and make lower offers to star free agents.
Before that PARITY came and the NFL/ media claimed it gave all teams a chance to at least get a wild card and upset the best teams in the regular season- and maybe, upset elite team and win 2 playoff games. Its' not a guarantee and claiming none sense but it was a way to make fans more interested.
Well, what you got if mediocre games, 1 team has won over 6 SBs' in less than 30 years, there's a questionable salary cap system, the NFLPA is a disgrace and the same teams make the playoffs almost every year(NE, Pitt, now TB, Philly, GB and Tenn).
There was a time when fans liked seeing their teams loaded with talent but PARITY said it was outdated and unimportant.
So, the new owners came in and promoted it. Because they believe in it? No, because it was part of a plan to save millions. They forced star free agents to accept less money IOW they had 29 owners refusing to pay a star much more than the others until he accepted 1 of their offers.
The only teams still playing big was Manning's Colts, Oak., Dall., and Wash. And you know they were heavily criticized by media for it. The owners wanted a new CBA to keep salaries low and using average-good player is 1 way to do it.
The 49ers, Raiders, Cowboys and Snyders' Washington liked to load up on talent and would spend big on free agents and it worked for years
Why not high character and a great staff to coach 'em up and a front office that can find the players that fit your system?
Wow! you mean you just coach up a team? some teams took off and some started losing. It meant your mediocre team could win with a good plan and staff without begging star free agents to sign up. And with PARITY, you can win a few late season games maybe beat an elite team and maybe, make the playoffs.
Well that's cool but doesn't this seem just a little too successful?
Dallas wasn't only loaded it had great staff but hadn't won a playoff game for almost 19 years. The 49ers started losing only because Eddie D. was forced to give up the team and Al's Raiders just stopped winning a year after going to the SB even though they were loaded.
Now, its' great for an underdog or little guy roster to win but what makes you think that teams can't win on talent?
You really beleive that story? Nobody who spends big and gets a lot of talent- you have to pay big to keep that talent can win but mediocrity can and high character football can.
That just sounds strange.
So, should the Pats' guys try to go obsessed and try to make a playoff run now? Or tell us how things will go when they have more control of the Raiders next year?
Should they go out and sign any ex-star/ pro bowler to replace injuries and retirements that will play for a cheap salary?
Why didn't they just keep D. Jackson as a WR? He's 35 but still fast and probably would be a starter for us.
Al probably has given up on a season or 2 himself but if he did he we didn't know it.
In a PARITY system the season isn't over yet anyway but teams that really want to win may try to sign anybody they think can help win now.
The Raiders aren't saying anything except these 2 are coming back. The thing that surprised me is that some of you aren't happy. Usually, you go with almost everything the Raiders say. No matter how mediocre the staff is you go with it. So, what so different about the Pats' guys?
You need:
speed at KR/ J. Ford, maybe J. Richard or D. Jackson are there.
An edge rusher and DT that can get to the QB/ Whats the problem with T. Bowers? M. Koonce needs more time to play. Ex-Raider DT P.J. Hall has unbelievable college stats(42 sacks, 14 blocked kicks and 95.5 TFL) they should sign him and try to get some work out of him and Patriots/ Bellichick coaching on him to see if he wants to play in the NFL.
Jerry Hughes- Bills, Hey he may be retired but he might want to make a playoff run. He could work back into NFL shape with Raiders.
D. Philon, DT/ would help the team.
Ex-Lion A. Zettle
NFL level OLBs'/ we could make J. Brown the MLB and D. Perryman an OLB. Ex-Bill Kiko Alonso would be a good move.
Some help in the secondary/ Maybe I. Johnson wasn't that good after all but maybe the Raiders should sign him and see if he can help. Retired FS Eric Weddle might take chance and take a 1 year contract.
speed at RB: What a slow team. The Pats' guys feel you get a lot of good RBs' and use them differn
speed at WR: see the top J. Ford, D. Jackson.
The Colts are actually in worse shape than the Raiders, which could make today's game a deciding event for next season. If the Raiders hit rock bottom and lose to the rudderless Colts today, I wouldn't rule out the possibility that Mark Davis fires McDaniels (in or after the season) and we see a Gruden-Davis reunion, particularly if Gruden's lawsuit against the NFL goes in his favor. It's pretty obvious the NFL ran Gruden out of the league, either to spite Gruden or the Raiders, or both.
Ziegler hasn't exactly hit it out of the park, so many fans would welcome another change, even if it's backward.
That opens the door for another 5-year rebuilding process.
So here we go. It's already ugly, but things could get worse, starting today!
Honestly, it's hard to have much confidence in a team that blows 17-point leads 3x in 8 games. That's almost a 40% clip. No lead is safe.
In no way will the league allow Gruden back, especially with the Raiders.
I would gladly welcome Gruden back he is 10x the coach McDaniels is. Sandy
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