Jaguars Gameday Thread
Well, what more can be said?
Sorry, Antonio Pierce has to go. I don't care if the team is 'playing hard' for him.
If the coaching, performance and game management aren't there, playing hard and a nickel isn't worth a five-cent cup of jack squat. You think Pierce can get the Raiders back on next season and match wits in the years ahead with Reid, Payton and Harbaugh? No.
Mark Davis is like a child who keeps breaking the same toy. Give him a clean slate and he soils it within 18 months. Rinse and repeat.
How to break the cycle? I'm counting on your takes to sort it out for me.
GO RAIDERS (or is it TANK RAIDERS now)!?
posted by Raider Take at 1:40 PM
75 Comments:
IMO, the cheer is "Tank Raiders!" This game could not be less meaningful, especially, if the intention is to replace Pierce.
We need a head coach and a QB. Both may become less effective with a win today.
Let's not blow it.
What a shame. Raiders in a waiting game to see how far back a meaningless win puts them in the draft order.
Meanwhile, Pierce might be clinging to his job.
We could end up with NO head coach and NO QB, unless we overpay for Sam Darnold.
I know most here are disappointed, but not me. I am glad the Raiders won. I am tired of hearing about the losing streak, and the all important high draft pick. I hope the Raiders win there last two games as well.
You'll never convince me that the road of losing will lead to the road of winning. Yhea, I know, it seemingly has worked for Houston, & Washington. Stroud & Daniels, with new HC's, and they are playoff teams. So were the Bengals with Burrow the first two years, but than they began to fade. Texans & Commanders might fade as well over time.
There's nothing that beats winning. Think about it, if Raiders keep winning, the problem is solving itself. I still believe in AP, and I believe in AOC as the QB. Let's take our best draft position, and build a formidable team around them. Let's upgrade AP's coaching staff too. Stop changing plans every season. Stick to this plan, and see where it leads.
The NFL is a joke, with a handful of teams trying to win championship, while most of the league is trying to lose for a high draft pick. Raiders should break out of the mold. There is little evidence this tanking is working anyway.
Instead of trying to lose, try to win, it just might work. Stop telling everyone they are losers, and the only way to win, is to keep losing. It makes no sense.
So, "Just Win Baby". It's the blueprint Al Davis left behind. A simple plan that can work if applied.
Ghost, you and I differ on this point. I've never wished for the Raiders to lose a game until now, but I feel confident they did not win anything yesterday. Sanders, Ward and Hunter are now out of their reach. One of these guys could have been a franchise player for the Raiders.
The Giants, Jags and other teams are playing to lose for a reason. The Giants so much so they dumped their starting QB weeks ago.
The Giants now control the draft. They will not trade back. The Jags might, but it will cost the Raiders high draft capital or, worse, the only franchise player the Raiders have, Maxx Crosby.
I would say this, be careful what you wish for.
The Raiders just traded a franchise player for one win.
One more win against the Saints and maybe we can keep Pierce as HC and AOC as QB1. Then we can do this again next year.
Completely agree with you New York until we get a franchise quarterback mediocrity is the best we can hope for or even worse in the case of this year. I'm not saying Sanders or Ward is the second coming of John Elway but they're one hell of a lot better than AOC. Happy holidays Sandy
To Raidernation,
Al-Anon
Yes! get a high draft pick but we don't need to TANK for the overall 1st round pick!!
Yes, win and try to get some things fixed before the season ends.
Raiders should show they want to win rather than TANK. they are gonna look for a "Franchise QB" later in the 1st round or have a group with a special job of looking at and stealing a star or a good QB to 'coach up' or a future starter draft pick following coaches at practice and holding running tasks for them.
Win and try to get some things fixed this year and have things to build on for next year! this team might have a special group of staff to find their QB and they will be focused on 1 and w/ Brady they may be able to take a chance, draft an elite OL or defensive player in the 1st round and find a star QB in lower rounds.
They have the man to find a QB so they don't have to go after the top 2 guys. they have two ways to go draft an elite QB or
get a high draft pick or trade it down for other positions and then find a steal/ future starter in lower rounds.
To NY Raider,
Al-Anon
You don't want to lose but you want to support bad and shady ways to win. Raiders were about winning and felt they had the front office to find their kind of players to win.
Now, I understand if there is a huge hole and there are some elite college players in the 1st round and even though they're gonna miss the playoffs they sometimes a team wants fans/ players to know they want to win out and be motivated for next year. they may miss a superstar/ future HOF'er but they want to be motivated/ have a winning attitude and culture. and they'll work hard/ depend on their front office to find draft star players and spend on star FAs' to win.
Sandy, the Raiders obviously know more than we do about their plans. Or do they? Mark Davis strikes me as a bit of a simpleton, playboy first, kind of guy who has demonstrated he's more interested in cashing in his Vegas chips.
The Raiders are the only crappy team playing hard. For what?
IMO, that only makes sense if they keep Antonio Pierce AND they don't have confidence in Sanders or Ward. If Pierce is truly out the door, then allowing him to win games at the expense of the Raiders future makes no sense (he should already be fired). Other teams understand that. Even the Jags looked like a team who didn't mind losing for the cause.
How often does any team get the #1 pick? Most teams, never.
Raiders are a multi-billion organization on a sugar high from one win in a lost season, with no vision for the future.
A winning formula probably requires some sacrifice.
NY Raider,
Al-Anon
A simpleton?: MD- you said he did a smart/ great move to move to L.V.,. that he made good hires of Reggie, Gruden II and A.P. now you say he's not a good owner?
A.P.?: you said he might be a very good coach for us. and now you say he should be fired?
No #1 pick?: you've said that elite and star players aren't that important if you have the game plan/ system and can 'coach 'em up'. the way the Raiders TANKED is not good for morale or motivation and a good front office can find good draft picks in lower rounds.
Why do the Raiders need the 1st overall pick for a QB if Brady knows how to find a good 1?
"Even the Jags looked like a team who didn't mind losing for the cause." That's right NYR, and how long have the jags been losing for their cause ? This is just the latest season of their losing. And they'll be plenty more losing in the future, since they don't seem to mind it.
AP & AOC lost their best offensive player when Raiders let Jacobs walk. Then Adams wanted out when he saw things going south. TE, Mike Meyers stepped away for a few games. And AOC was left to be battered behind a shaky offensive line. And picking the wrong OC, in off season didn't help matters.
If you guys think Ward, or Sanders can do better on this team, I point you toward Caleb Williams in Chicago.
You want all the eggs in the QB basket ? Ok, but don't drop it.
The cycle of losing only leads to more losing. How many bites at the draft apple have the tanking Jags taken already ?
Use the draft to build the best team you can. Give AP & AOC a chance to succeed. But they'll need something to work with.
The Raiders decided to TANK before the season started. A.P. is not good or bad as a HC this year because the idea was to lose.
Jacksonville is a modern franchise and trying to get an elite/ star college player! forget winning to win. I can understand like somebody posted an Elway, Marino or "Prime Time" but not every time you see a star and want him. you might have to pass on a star and get a good/ star player lower in the 1st round.
The Jags are a small market them and like Oakland, the NFL doesn't worry much about them- and they haven't been very good for awhile so that may also be the case w/ their front office.
The NFL wants to make money and these young QB's sell rookie jerseys so that's 1 way to win for bad teams even if they c
Ghost, retaining AP and AOC is definitely a path I could see the Raiders taking. However, I wonder if that path is more likely to break the cycle than going for a standout QB at the top of the draft. Sure, there's high risk, but it's worth it if you end up with another CJ Stroud or Jayden Daniels, or even Bo Nix.
I get your Caleb Williams reference, but having a prototypical QB is far better than not having one... the Raiders should be so lucky.
The Raiders will have $112M in cap space, so I don't think they would be putting all their eggs in one place by targeting a top QB in the draft. Just the opposite. They have more resources than most teams, by a lot.
In the end, I think most of us can agree, the Raiders biggest problem is the Raiders. They are guess-wrong far too often, to the point of incompetence.
Why should this off-season be any different?
Here's a headline that will have legs for a while.
"Raiders Predicted to Swing Massive NFL Draft Trade for Franchise QB
That's what stupid organizations do. They made their bed. If they trade up for a QB and expend resources now, that would be nothing short of pathetic. They had the top draft pick two days ago.
MY current take:
Raiders should re-sign several of their own key free agents, e.g., Spillane, Butler, Moehrig, to name a few.
Sign Sam Darnold or Russell Wilson, or even Justin Fields to compete with O"Connell (whose career seems to be headed toward being a serviceable backup). But keep it real, don't overpay for a FA QB out of desperation!
Draft the best available player in Round 1, ala Brock Bowers, and maybe Rounds 2-3, if a player(s) stands out. Perhaps draft a sleeper QB in the middle of the draft.
Option 2: Scorch earth approach. Go young across the roster, lose out and draft Arch Manning next year. That probably means trading Crosby for draft capital. Let's face it, Crosby deserves better.
To NY Raider,
Al-Anon
The AFC is tough enough but the AFC West has 3 elite HC's.
Now you say what? get rid of M. Crosby? why?
The hype will start in January or by late winter about what Brady/ Seymore will do to rebuild the Raiders.
Maybe a few fans will question this game plan but- oh how NY Raider and others will post about Brady/ Seymore and the new regime they might be trying to build.
We gonna be the team to beat o.k. maybe we get a new HC but A.P. might work w/ Brady and have a top offense. Brady and Seymore may coach up/ workout with rookie QBs' and DLs'.
Or the Raiders can build a big time defense. Brady helps draft a "Franchise QB" but the Raiders draft an elite defensive players in the 1st round and draft their QB in lower rounds.
To Raidernation,
Al-Anon
Jacksonville showed us that they want the high pick badly but also that a team should only TANK so much and then just try to win out.
This is the way other teams work but not the 49ers or Al's Raiders! you miss the elite player go get somebody else but you don't TANK!
There are things Brady might help us with like getting FAs' to play for us and, finding a "Franchise QB"/ future starter in the draft but we don't need more inexperienced people running this team. we think an ex-super star player/ ex-star player can turn this thing around. they may be able to do some good things but maybe looking for veteran front office people and maybe trying to use Al Davis' ideas might help us win. the Raiders need to find good players and good staff. and some speed, size and athletes and spending big this off season might help us.
keep the defensive staff except make another guy head DC.
Make Turners' the OC
keep A.P. as HC because there aren't any elite HC's available right now.
Make T. McAllister into a RB.
keep #44
get H. Reddick in a trade
let Koonce walk
sign D. Greenlaw
In what world would the Raiders hire a new head coach and force that new coach to retain assistant coaches?
Only Al Davis would do that.
Everything you profess is a return to losing.
You're glad to win a meaningless game against Jacksonville that pushed the Raiders out of the #1 draft pick, but you're okay with setting the Raiders up for more years of failure.
Saints' Mega Team:
D. Brees
D. Hilliard
L. Neal
D. Abramowicz W. Chandler
M. Thomas D. Henderson
J. Grahm H. Childs(TE #2)
W. Roaf
C. Dobler
M. Unger
C. Nicks
S. Brock
T. Dempsey(K)
M. Gray(KR)
W. Martin
D. Moore T. Elliot(3-4 NG)
L. Glover
C. Jordan
R. Jackson
J. Vilma J. Kovach(3-4 ILB)
M. Fields
D. Waymer B. Maxie(dime)
E. Allen J. Greer(nickle)
T. Meyers
T. Morstead(P)
M. Lewis(PR)
Raiders' Dominators:
H. Long
J. Matuzak B. Golic(3-4 NG)
T. Washington
D. Burgess
O. Wilson
M. Millen
T. Hendricks
L. Hayes
C. Woodson D. Hall(nickle)
F. Williamson M. Giardano(dime)
M. Davis
S. Lechler(P)
J.L. Higgins(PR)
K. Stabler
B. Jackson
Z. Crockett
D. Hasselbeck E. Hortan(TE #2)
B. Chandler R. Barksdale(#4)
T. Brown C. Smith(#3)
A. Shell
K. Gogan
D. Mosebar
M. Montoya
J. Lachey
D. Carlson(K)
G. Pruitt(KR)
Oh, if they hire Vrable I guess he knows who he wants as staff but the Raiders' defensive staff is awesome, they just were TANKING and they refuse to bring in star FAs' or draft elite defensive players.
But when the Raiders do hire a guy it sometimes looks outright mediocre when they hire their staffs.
Al kept staff that knew his system and he hired good/ elite assistants. you wanted 3 of them to be HC's for the Raiders.
Also- Al was:
1 of the best GM/ owners in pro sports history.
was a scout, HC, assistant, Commissioner and owner.
Don't you think he knew what was best for the so-called mediocre HCs' he hired? and maybe some of the great 1s he hired?
NY, something Al would do? a HOF GM/ owner's mistakes and he's the worst ever in team history but other less experienced guys are just making mistakes/ whiffed and missed with some of their game plans, but they know better than guys like Al?
Wow, NY! your comments are o.k. until you try to go after Al and make silliness(bringing more inexperienced people) look good. you need to question the Raiders and your own posts.
You regularly try and worm your way out of your own ridiculous comments.
If we're taking you at your word, you said...
"keep the defensive staff except make another guy head DC. Make Turners' the OC"
So replace the head coach but keep his staff?
Because Al did it, it's okay?
That's exactly why top-level coaches never worked for Al Davis.
Before you say something else stupid, I can think of several assistant coaches Al retained over and over during regime changes. In any other organization, that doesn't happen.
You want to bring us back to that formula, but with the lesser Davis at the helm.
Good luck!
Ummm...NY its almost true Al didn't hire a lot of elite HCs' but in 1 case SOMEBODY told a young DC NOT to work for him! as for other top level HCs' not working for him when did this happen outside of the slump('03-'11)? FOA...Al NEVER hired elite HCs' because he could make his coaches better by teaching them and finding good players for them.
Some winning teams kept/ keep some assistants no matter who they hire as HC/ GM. Al didn't invent it.
Reggie came in knowing he didn't have a game plan o
and why didn't he, Pat's guys bring in elite assistants? well NY? maybe the NFL is making the Raiders hire at a cheap and mediocre pace/ level.
To the NFL,
Why are you trying to take the Davis family's team? I thought moving to L.V. would make you happy. Isn't the feud with Al Davis the deceased legend over with? His son Mark has done almost everything to make you happy yet, it seems you want the Davis family to sell their team.
I think you should try and keep them in the NFL as long as possible. The Raiders have helped the NFL become wealthier and more popular, they've helped open doors for women and minorities and bought a lot of excitement and new ideas to pro sports. I think they need to stay in the NFL. I keep hearing about new stake holders buying more of the team, that's o.k., but even if its' a business deal, it doesn't make it right for the Davis family to be minority owners or sell the team. Even if the new stake holders come from a winning culture the Davis family should be majority owners of the Raiders.
I don't think Al would be happy with this situation and a lot of fans wouldn't be happy about it either. We want something to stay on the team from its' past and not just turn into a corporations . I know there's been feuding and a lot of disagreements/ hostility but its' more than glamour and money the Raiders helped make the NFL big and the Davis family are iconic and they should keep their property.
Why do you continue to gaslight us and post such nonsense? Facts prove you wrong every time. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say, everything you said above is provably false.
You can't name one elite HC Al ever hired.
You can't name one other team that keeps assistant coaches with each new HC hire.
Reggie McKenzie had a well-documented plan. He inherited a team with an overextended salary cap and he fixed it.
Your posts are nonsensical.
NY Raider,
Al-Anon
Just NFL NY?
the Warriors do.
the Steelers do
the 49ers do
Reggie inherited Al's mess?: Reggie inherited a talented roster and a decent/ good staff and he ruined the team for over a decade:
he didn't have a "game plan" at all! all he did was fire staff and get rid of players!
he fired Al's guys and replaced them with guys(staff) he probably didn't know.
he managed the salary cap so much so that he refused to keep good players and refused to sign star FAs' w/ the Broncos and Chargers being contenders.
he draft only 1 elite player(Mack) and didn't watch his staff who were very strange/ unfriendly with some of Al's players.
he even had an elite run game(DMAC and M. Bush) and DL(Kelly, Bryant, Wimbley, Seymore, Brodine) and got rid of those.
No, Reggie wasn't the best GM and he was hired to get rid of Al's era. he didn't get a chance to show if he could win because that wasn't the issue it was about changing this team and they done a great job of that.
Al brought in bad/ average players and paid them too much money?: the players were paid to win, they didn't or they stopped winning! if a guy wants to play for lower prices in this kind of game its' noble/ being a solider but also kind'a risky if not foolish. its' funny fans like to make OVERPAYING guys to win as a reason they lost then we have it all wrong only Bellichick knows how to get guys to win and 1 way is to tell them they aren't getting big salaries? wow!
overpaid salaries?: he paid guys to win and they quit on him. that's not Al's fault that's on them. Makes sense to pay good players, maybe refusing to pay them to get them to play harder/ motivated is a good way too but some guys but stars/ good players SHOULD play hard for money too!
but do owners want to sell cheap tickets until they win? no! you got some very one sided opinions NY!
What did Reggie inherit:
a famous/ iconic team w/ a culture he once played with.
a loaded roster w/ speed, size, athleticism and some of the best units(STs', DL, secondary, run game and receivers) in the NFL.
a pro bowl QB C. Palmer.
and he got rid of them. he also, tried to distance himself from the teams' old staff and that was a huge question mark.
He didn't know about other staf or he wasn't allowed to interview them. he was a scout doing a GM's job and even MD should've asked/ told him not to fire Al's staff if for any reason just to teach/ train him to be a GM.
The Raiders are not some great comeback story, they are a team being ruined by greed and hated.
Huh? That's more confusion and gaslighting.
The Warriors, Steelers and 49ers "do" what, exactly?
You've said nothing and still can't back it up.
NY Raider,
Al-Anon
There have been other teams that have kept favorite/ elite assistants after firing/ retiring a HC!
NY, Al was 1 of the best football men ever! he didn't have to answer a ton of questions on how he should run a team but it's fair to ask those questions.
In the case of the new regimes except for the Pat's guys and Gruden II, the other new regimes were inexperienced in the HC and GM spots.
Al was a legendary/ iconic exec/ football man he could show his coaches what to do.
The Warriors are/ have kept the same front office and you know the Steelers like to keep their front offices mainly because they usually keep their HC's for years.
But back to Al- he helped his HCs' and he DID let them bring in assistants but they had to understand he had say in the team so that may been bad or good sometimes and might've made some staff unhappy and others were o.k. with it. but he was a genius/ top exec and could help his staff. having an elite HC wasn't needed because you had a genius/ top GM- he made some of the best coaching hires ever.
You can't name one NFL assistant coach retained by the owner/GM following a regime change. Al did it with regularity.
The front office and head coach are separate and separable. Please stop talking in circles. That's nonsense!
Gruden wasn't an experienced HC when Al hired him. And Dave Ziegler was never a GM before the Raiders.
Maybe you should take stock in the facts and stop gaslighting.
I think the Raiders are going to have more options with a veteran QB than Darnold, Russell Wilson, or Justin Fields. Rumors have it that the Saints are going to part ways with Derek Carr, and after this weekend, he may be headed back to the Raiders if that happens.
Personally, I wouldn't mind it. I know there is a love/hate relationship with Derek among Raider Nation; but the guy did nothing but put us in a position to win. I'd bring him back on a 1 year deal, with a 2nd year optional; and put him in a position to ball out.
A lot of complaining about the Raiders winning the last 2 games to remove them from the Sanders/Ward draft conversation. These are 2 good QBs, but they are not the only ones. I think we are in a great position to draft Ashton Jeanty, and then pick up a good QB in the 2nd/3rd round.
My favorite, underdog, QB is Will Howard (Ohio St), he is 6'5 and has completed 73 percent of his passes for 3,171 yards with 29 touchdowns and nine interceptions.
Drew Allar (Penn St), hasn't declared, but I really like this guy too. I think he is the most under-the-radar QB in college right now. Dillon Gabriel (Oregon) is another guy I like; and will not get a lot of looks due to his size. Riley Leonard (Notre Dame) is a duel threat QB that I like as well. Tyler Shough (Louisville) is another 6'5 QB with impressive numbers, 3,195 yards with 23 touchdowns and six interceptions that is overlooked because of a 63% completion rating that is due to a bad O-Line.
I am not of the opinion that the Raiders have screwed themselves out of a top-tier QB. With that said, I'm not in favor of Quinn Ewers (Texas), Jalen Milroe (Bama), Jaxson Dart (Ole Miss), or Garrett Nussmeier (LSU). I think these guys will not do well in the next level due to inconsistency. Carson Beck (Georgia) and Cade Klubnik (Clemson), I am on the fence with. Beck has the talent, but has made some terrible reads this year; but his numbers in 2023 are difficult to look past. Whereas, Klubnik's numbers in 2023 were ok and middle of the pack, his numbers this year were vastly improved, and he made a lot of good decisions with the football.
Nate, I'm not sure Carr could beat out Aiden O'Connell right now. Saints have gotten worse since bringing in Carr.
I know very little about any of the college QBs you mentioned but, at a minimum, I would expect the Raiders to draft someone they feel confident can beat out O'Connell. Perhaps that means free agency, but the Vikings might not be quick to send Darnold packing after the season he's had. That leaves the choices extremely thin.
I'm dumbfounded by the elation expressed by Mark Davis - on the brink of firing Antonio Pierce -- for winning two games and taking the Raiders from #1 draft pick to the #8 draft pick. He could have fired AP and kept the Raiders in the running for #1... especially, since the Giants won.
There are no moral victories in winning two games to end a lost season while the entire coaching staff has one foot out the door and overseeing a franchise in its third decade of losing.
Not very shrewd of Davis.
Hope Davis doesn't pull another sloth-like start to this offseason. He should already have Vrabel on speed-dial. He could have brought Vrabel in as interim HC. That would have been far more meaningful.
I don't believe the Raiders have a choice but to fire Pierce, and they should have already fired him.
Regardless of what you think of Pierce (personally, I'm a fan), they can't afford to bring him back as a lame duck HC. Patrick Graham has already refused an extension with the Raiders, and no OC worth squat will sign a one-year deal.
Vrabel should already be the interim HC, interviewing Scott Turner in real time while watching out for the next Raiders DC.
Davis waiting for Tom Brady or someone else to help make a decision for him is business as usual.
Raiders look to begin another off-season with no answers.
Lather, rinse and repeat.
The Steelers, 49ers and Warriors mostly keep some assistants even when a new HC is hired.
Why you're using this to put down on Al is a mystery. he was a teacher, coach and leader for his HCs'.
Now, the Steelers usually keep their HCs' for years and the 49ers for a good while too and/ or move them around to different jobs but they do keep some of them after hiring new HCs'.
No, Gruden wasn't an experienced HC when he was hired but again, AL WAS A LEGENDARY, ICONIC, GENIUS and TOP owner/ GM and he could teach/ advise his HCs' and so if he wanted to keep old assistants he was knew how to build a team and probably knew what he was doing/ thought it was a good idea to keep some of his old assistants.
NY
You like A.P. but they should fire him? and you're the 1 who has a bigger/ better point than me?
Well, there's nothing wrong with your comment he may not be good HC maybe a good assistant. but here's the thing you have a liking for inexperienced HCs and I don't think you know what you want.
You seem to be all in on Brady bringing in his choices for staff maybe even building a new staff. but why would you think an inexperienced guy and some Wall Street investors can fix this problem? I never said the Raiders should just use Al's ideas and ignore young or other front office ideas- I said they need to keep their culture/ some of Al's ideas about building a team. but you think a guys fame/ rep is the only thing to go by and fans need to understand this team hasn't had an elite GM or HC since Al passed and that's what they need.
Raiders need experienced guys and not just a guy picking a new HC take us to 'glory'.
" NY - You like A.P. but they should fire him? and you're the 1 who has a bigger/ better point than me?"
It has nothing to do with what I want. The explanation was in my post. It's not vague. It's lame duck logic.
Please! Repeating your ridiculous assertion doesn't make it true. Give me one name of an assistant coach the owner retained during a regime change. Google it.
Funny that you chose the 49ers and Steelers as your examples. The two teams with some of the greatest head coaches in NFL history. If you don't think Kyle Shanahan hired his own staff, please name the assistant coach he was forced to work with (ala Al Davis style). And the Steelers? Really? The team which has had only three head coaches since the 1960s?
If you could only take a step back and see how ridiculous that is.
Sure, Al was a legendary iconic genius until he was an overbearing owner who tried to do too much and damaged his own brand and legacy.
I'm not making it up, and it's not just my opinion.
It's amazing that being a Raiders fan has taught you nothing. You can't separate fact from fiction.
To NY Raider,
Al-Anon
Happy New Year!!! Raidernation!!!
See, its' not so much that you play black and white' fan who thinks the Raiders just need a few changes it's the fact that you change you have a habit of
1. defending almost any new regime and terrible, strange and sometimes, ridiculous game plans by the Raiders.
2. saying that the new modern NFL vision is better or the best way to build a team.
3. calling the Raiders '03-'11 team bad because the lost but the NFL good or the right side to support because they come up with ways to get richer when it was them who help tamper with the Raiders and maybe its' them giving us ADVISE and its' ruining this team.
the Steelers keep their HCs: The Steelers are a legendary/ iconic and outstanding franchise. but you have to admit the Raiders won for decades with different HC's but 1 GM/ owner.
The Raiders not only won with 3 different HC's the same as the Steelers(Noll, Tomlin and Cower) the won with 1 more(John Raunch in the 60's) so your little put downs/ old facts don't look so great.
We are not getting the 2 elite QBs'. mabye the NFL doesn't want us to have them! great, this time we will pick lower on purpose! but we could build/ add talent to a good/ great defense for the future. maybe we have a group just focused on finding a QB or plan to create a room and pick some staff to help do it but w/ Brady they might be able to find a good college QB.
Happy New Year everyone !!
Raiders starting the new year right by, WINNING. Sanders is not a top ten draft pick. he will slide out of top ten, so Raiders can still get him if they want.
Derek Carr is finished as a starting Qb. Put some talent around AOC, and forget the past. Lets move on please.
Ghost, I'm okay with building around AOC and waiting for next year, if need be. Maybe take a shot at getting Darnold.
Unfortunately, the Raiders might be desperate. If they trade up for Sanders, it will be costly in terms of draft capital. At this point, having moved so far back in the draft order already, I hope AOC lights up the Chargers and puts real doubt into that kind of trade.
Happy New Year!
I still think the best QB coming into this year's draft is Will Howard of Ohio St. He is going to turn heads and his stock will drastically rise. I think this is the best shot for the Raiders at this position.
Holy crap, there shouldn't be another QB we are looking at other than Will Howard after yesterday. Drew Allar (Penn St) is the only other QB that I'd consider, and that is if he enters the draft.
Right now, Ohio St is the team to beat, IMO. Oregon did not look like the #1 team. I think the Championship is going to be Ohio St vs Penn St (at this point). Ohio St cannot overlook Texas though. UT can win, it just depends on which Ewers shows up to play. He did enough to be Arizona St, but his play wouldn't be Ohio St.
I also think Notre Dame beats Georgia tonight, which would mean every team that had a bye-week will have lost. Going to be interesting.
I only watched the OH State game briefly, but it was long enough to see Howard throw a laser deep pass for a TD. Very impressive.
That said, we should be cautioned this wouldn't be the first time the NFL has been fooled by great QB performances in college playoff or bowl games. Justin Fields comes to mind, as does JaMarcus Russell.
There needs to be more. IDK anything about college QBs right now, aside from media hype. Howard has definitely improved his draft stock.
Raiders need to be smarter than usual to get past their losing cycle. That might mean drafting a top CB in Rd 1 and waiting until rounds 2-3 (or next year) before drafting a QB.
What if they sign Fields and let him compete with AOC? Next year they might get a chance to draft Arch Manning, especially, if they flop again.
I don't know the answer!
NY, Justin Fields is a better example than JaMarcus. JaMarcus had incredible talent, but was incredibly lazy. Justin Fields played well for the Steelers this season in his 6 starts in the absence of Wilson, and he knew as soon as Wilson was healthy, RW was going to start. His overall stats are better with the Steelers this year, than with his time in Chicago. I think Fields' issue had to do more with the Bears than it did with him being a bad QB.
Its the same with Howard's collegiate career. Will Howard played at KSU, and he struggled because of the team surrounding him. At Ohio St, he has blossomed and shown what he is capable of when good coaches can develop him and the talent around him. He has a career completion percentage of 63%, but what would it be had his entire career been at Ohio St, where he currently has a completion percentage of 72%? Those are the factors you have to look and consider, it doesn't equate to how he will do in the NFL, but it shows that he is more than capable to lead a team. Can the Raiders put a team together and develop them to this level? That's the question the Raiders need to answer that they haven't answered. If you want to see proof of this, google Aiden O'Connell's stat comparison with CJ Stroud.
Here is a url to the stat comparison:
https://www.reddit.com/r/raiders/comments/1hqy0qw/aoc_vs_cj_stroud_season_comparison/?rdt=57742
Interesting, Nate. Thx. O'Connell has overachieved at every level. As I said in an earlier post, I'd rather fly with AOC than bring back Carr.
The big question is, can the Raiders demonstrate a little patience and keep things in place to promote continuity. Even with the chips down, the team has played hard for Pierce. That's rather impressive for a coach on the ropes.
And Scott Turner has dialed up a decent offence since taking over as OC.
Problem is, and it can't be overstated, Pierce would be a lame duck HC next year. Graham has one foot out the door, and Turner will probably fly too. It would be a small miracle if Davis/Telesco can keep it all together.
I think part of the discussion has to be the progress made with young players on the roster, on both sides of the ball. JPJ, Blaze, Bowers, Tucker and McCormick, notably on offense. On defense, Bennett was having a good year before injury. Moehrig had a breakout season (mostly as SS), Spillane is a star of the Raiders defense and Chassion should be re-signed at whatever it takes to keep him. Others have stepped up too.
The decision process could become very muddy if AOC lights up the Chargers.
Raiders have already botched the tank option, so I'm on board with a full beatdown of the Chargers before they head to the playoffs.
Torch the Chargers and pick a top CB in Round 1. Grab Howard in 2nd or 3rd (or trade for another pick in 2nd round).
I want to believe there's a Santa Claus.
The Raiders need help! they need defensive help!
AOC if you think he can get better then Brady can train/ teach and coach him. that should give the other staff chances to make decisions instead of Seymore and Brady.
I've been unsure when defending Al's era because of the W/ L record over the last 9 years but now looking at the NFL and the Raiders' decisions the new regimes this is a joke!
Al would and did build a far better team and get the staff to win. wow! the Raiders will draft/ bring in anybody and fans just buy it! this team needs to be the real Raiders and do things
To keep playing you're not impressing anybody the only reason Brady bought a stake is because the league asked him to. all those negatives you said about Al now seems silly and weak arguments.
Did the NFL tamper? maybe the NFL has done some pay back to the Raiders in the past..and did Al ruin his team? I don't think so...I mean, 31 other teams didn't go for 9 years without at least 1 season winning more games than losing even if they missed the playoffs and/ or making the playoffs at least once.....are the Raiders' new regimes better?- NO!!!!!!!!
What exactly, are the Raiders supposed to be doing that would make fans all in w/ new partners running some of the front office? its' because the media said this is a good idea and Brady is a legend and Seymore a HOF'er but Al was a legend, coach, commissioner, assistant, owner and GM and you fans said "love you Al but its' time to step down"! "sorry Al, we love you sorry you passed but now we have a chance to win again". but it seems we have been conned or at least shined on, played with by the NFL/ owners who ADVISE us on what to do!
We are the worst team in the NFL? well, IDK, but we are the most naive and abused fan base in the league.
To NY Raider,
Al-Anon
When Al went to L.A. Chargers:
signed players away from the NFL, signed future HOF'ers, signed guys from HBCUs', was an assistant as WR and OL coach.
new regimes assistants who went to "new" Raiders: Rich Bissiccia was not only a very good STs' coach but did a good job as interim HC. Bill Musgrave helped D. Carr get better.
Al when he went to Oakland: bought top assistants from the Chargers w/ him, hired some ex-AFL/ NFL players as scouts, Raiders started winning, Raiders played in 2nd SB, he caused the NFL/ AFL merger, he drafted Stabler, Shell and Upshaw in the 60s', he bougt the Chargers' passing game to Oakland and created his own deep passing game, he created the "bump and run" DB style/ system for jamming WRs'(Steelers' Mel Blount may've helped or been doing that too but in the 70's).
"New" regimes that went to Oakland: Reggie drafted stars D. Carr, K. Mack and G. Jackson and signed J. Richard, R. Hudson, M. Crabtree, Alden Smith and C-Wood. Reggie and coach Del Rio went to playoffs in '16. Gruden/ Mayock and Bissiccia went to playoffs in '21. Gruden/ Mayock drafted M. Crosby, F. Moreau and signed A.J. Cole.
Pats' guys signed J. Johnson and J. Meyers and drafted M. Meyer and A.P. drafted B. Bowers.
Al loving, old school delusional stuck in the past fans' vision/ opinions for future: use Al's ideas..some of them not all, for size and speed/ faster defenses and spending on star FA's and drafting top defensive players.
New regime's ideas for the future: invite ex-superstar players to help run the front office, hire more ex-Patriot assistants/ HCs' to be HC, and getting along with the league/ owners. drafting to fit a system, spending on good but not elite FAs' and for some strange reason, trading for elite WRs' but not getting the talent to help them win; then later, trading them for almost nothing in return(C. Patterson, A. Brown and A. Adams).
To Raidernation, To NY Raider part II
Al-Anon
This is what the new regimes have done w/ WRs': traded D. Adams, C. Patterson and released A. Brown, D. Moore.
R. Streater, A. Cooper, J. Jones, D. Adams, C. Patterson, H. Renfrow, J. Nelson, J. Meyers, M. Crabtree, A. Brown(DNP), M. Bryant, A. Holmes, #10, D. Jackson.
J. Rice, T. Brown, DHB, D. Moore, J. Porter, D. Gabriel, J. Walker, N. Miller(KR), L. Murphy,
J. Ford(KR), #19, R. Moss, R. Curry, J. Jett, A. Whitted.
Now, I have to admit the new regimes had some very good/ elite WRs' but Al had 3 future HOF'ers and some good WRs and the QBs' to make them produce/ help us win. but the Raiders didn't win they lost a lot but IMO....it wasn't Al's fault, even if I don't add a conspiracy theory to my opinions in a PARITY league were some teams don't have close to the talent the Raiders had can win it makes no sense this team couldn't've won once over a 9 year period.
I watched this week's pressers with Turner and Graham. Not sure what will happen, but the Raiders could do a lot worse than bringing back both these guys. Maybe they bring back Graham as HC and he keeps Turner on board. Maybe they bring back Pierce and give Graham a new, extended contract. If Pierce fails, insert Graham as HC.
Again, they could do much, and they have historically.
Raiders will have the #6 overall pick. I think they should draft Will Howard, and then trade back in to the first and draft either Jeanty or Skattebo. The 3rd pick should be a CB, and then O Line and D Line the rest of the way
Amik Robertson is playing lights out so far for Lions. Wish the Raiders would have kept him.
Whatever happens, they need to go back to man on the corners and zone with the LB's and Safeties. Aggressive football wins
Per Spotrac, Raiders spent 227M of their 255M cap this year. It shows they had almost 34M surplus. They could have signed Robertson (now a Lions starter) and Josh Jacobs without flinching and still had a big surplus.
My guess is they will now sit on their hands about who will be their HC next year while the current staff fractures off into many other directions and qualified coaches are interviewed and hired by other teams. Not for better or worse, it's just how they operate. Slow and stupid.
Vrabel is available now, and he's interviewing with Jets and Pats. If the Raiders plan to hire another HC, Vrabel should be contacted immediately. Maybe Brady already has, which kinda makes Telesco ineffective and outside the process.
Sorry for my cynicism, but I don't see the Raiders separating themselves from dysfunction that has plagued them for decades. It might not be the same dysfunction as the 2000s, but it brings us the same results.
Chargers too much for Raiders to handle. This game shows how far behind Raiders have fallen. Raiders did not win a division game.
AOC has played only about 10 NFL games, so he will get better as the talent around him is upgraded. Raiders need a lot. Offense, defense, and everything in between. Is Telesco the man for the job ? This draft should show us.
Last off season, I felt like too much was subtracted, and not enough added. Cannot build a team this way. AP deserves better. Find him players, don't take them away.
In Telesco's defense, the first three players he drafted for the Raiders are all starters. And he brought in Chaisson, who should get a new contract with the Raiders.
I don't know which direction the Raiders should go. However, I believe they should be decisive. Start the off-season today!
Option 1 - Fire Pierce and interview HC candidates asap.
Option 2 - Keep Pierce and sign Scott Turner. Try and retain Graham, which will be difficult. He will likely be interviewing for HC openings (maybe with the Raiders).
Option 3 - anybody's guess. This is probably where the Raiders will fall.
We'll see. Today might be revealing.
NY, I'm not sold on Turner as OC. I think if the Raiders keep Pierce, they need to tell him to rid of some of the voices; and that will help keep Graham. I like Pierce, and I like how the players play for him. He needs help on offense, someone he can trust, and someone who will be aggressive. Not sure who is available though. That's the difference between he and Campbell.
Ghost, I like AOC too; not sure if he is the guy or not. There was a lot that wasn't left on the field. Not sure if it had anything to do with the worst RB game in the NFL.
Ok, so I am researching draft items. Maybe I'm a little too excited on Will Howard, and I am. I think his stock will rise; but most scouts have graded him into the 3rd round due to his time at Kansas St. I don't think that will hurt him, because it was Kansas St. His overall #'s are very comparable to Sanders and Ward's career. The Raiders have glaring needs on offense, RB, RG, C, T, QB; but they need a shutdown CB on defense and depth. This draft is rich in talent in most positions, so with that in mind, and its still really early; here is my first mock:
1st round - Andre Carter (DE, Penn St) He and Maxx Crosby with Christian Wilkins coming back would be terrifying!
2nd round - Will Howard (QB, Ohio St)
3rd rounda - Jonah Monheim (C/OG/OT, USC) a versatile player like JPJ, could actually start on the O-line at RG or C.
3rd roundb - Trey Amos (CB, Ole Miss). He posted similar, and in some cases, better #'s than Hunter at CB; but is not getting a lot of looks.
4th Round - Omarion Hampton (RB, NC). Hampton is easily one of the best RBs in college not named Jeanty; and this will be a great pickup and he will be a starter.
5th Round - Josh Simmons (OT, Ohio St) he tore his ACL, and was headed into the top 2 rounds of the draft. This would be a steal, and could be valuable pick for the future. Take a year off and get healthy.
6th Rounda - Tai Felton (WR, Maryland)
6th Roundb - Mikail Kamara (DE, Indiana)
6th Roundc - BJ Adams (CB, Central Florida)
7th Round - Tate Ratledge (OG, Georgia) I think he would have been higher, but he was injured early in the season, and has not impressed when he came back late in the season. Like Josh Simmons, he will be a great pick if they let him rest a year.
Nate, Graham had previously refused to renew his contract with the Raiders. Bringing him back won't be easy. It's probably unlikely.
Turner is only as good as the players he had and, like you said, no run support. Raiders offense improved with him, and he's not afraid to throw the ball downfield. He's a solid candidate as OC around the league. Careful what you wish for. Raiders can do worse, and they have.
Jets and Patriots have already set interviews with Vrabel and they are now requesting interviews with coaches on playoff-bound teams. If the Raiders plan to fire Pierce, they may soon be behind the curve on the hiring process, again!
If they plan to keep Pierce, they will quickly find themselves behind in securing assistants..., evening the assistants on staff.
We watched it playout last year. Mark Davis had ample time after firing McDaniels but he seemed to wait until after the season to even begin the process. Then he hired Pierce toward the end of the hiring cycle, leaving him minimal time to secure a staff.
Garbage in / garbage out.
I think a lot of folks might agree, on its face this is a poorly run organization. When you consider its multi-billion-dollar valuation and the fact that they are competing with 31 other teams for limited resources, "poorly run" might be an understatement.
Not sure if even Tom Brady can breathe life into it. We'll see.
To Raidernation,
Al-Anon
Chargers/ interviewed an elite HC
signed a top pass rusher- K. Mack
drafted decent DBs'
drafted an elite QB but didn't d
drafted a star WR(McConkey)
Al's last era w/ Chargers
J. Harbaugh/ an assistant w/ Raiders- left to coach Stanford U. and was a HC at Michigan and w/ 49ers. lead Chargers to playoffs 1st year.
N. Turner/ fired by Raiders because he couldn't win with maybe a top offensive roster w/ guys like K. Collins, R. Moss and a what might've been an outstanding defense. but helped/ lead Chargers to dominate the AFC West.
Raiders' new regimes and hiring HCs/
Gruden/ Mayock built a good team but traded away a lot of stars for high draft picks but whiffed on a lot of them.
A.P. maybe a good HC but isn't really building a good team because the Raiders aren't spending/ signing talent to help team win.
J. Del Rio/ a decent HC but he didn't have a lot of top talent to help him win and the Raiders were already having issues before he was hired but the did't help him fix/ clean house and refuse to spend big on star FAs'. he did lead them to the playoffs but they later fired him to hire Gruden II.
The 'Pat's guys' made some good moves and looked like they could lead the Raiders but then they started tmessing up/ doing strange things and the team didn't get better they were later fired. they did bring in good players from trades and draft but were slow to change the roster and too conservative to spend big on FA's and couldn't get the team to play much better or like a top team. they kept the Raiders old system/ program- they knew it and they bought it there- they bought the 'Patriot way' there again, but they were part of the original dynasty/ 'Patriot way'.
Al's Chargers: Al was a scout and assistant for the Chargers and helped make them maybe the top 3 best team in the AFL(K.C., LACs' and Patriots). he signed future HOF'ers and All-star players and he signed guys from the HBCU.
The Chargers after Al left:
Won the AFL Championship in '63
were a playoff team in the late 70's('78-'82) but Broncos won a few division titles back then and Chargers had to take a "wild card" playoff spot.
went to the SB after '93 season
Raiders after Al passed:
Raiders were already in a 9 year slump then Reggie said they needed an overhaul and it might take about 5 years to make the playoffs. Reggie took over in '12 and Raiders went to the playoffs after '16 season.
Raiders made playoffs in '21. HC Gruden II resigned and M. Mayock was later fired and STs' coach R. Bissicia was the interim HC.
The Pat guys took over and lasted 2 years.
A.P. took over and has been HC for 2 years.
Turner's play-calling was pretty vanilla, especially after Mattison returned to RB. But even before McCormick got injured, the run calls were not very imaginative. Not a lot of outside rushes, a lot of up the gut runs though. Have to be more creative with running the ball, especially in the red zone.
That leads to the other issue that has plagued the Raiders since 2016, can't score in the red zone. This isn't rocket science; but for whatever reason, the solution can't seem to be found with the Raiders.
What? None of that post makes sense. You cross eras and post like it all happened at the same time. Mack was already a Charger when Harbaugh was hired as HC, and the Raiders current GM drafted the Chargers QB.
Two lines down you're talking about 1963.
Your posts make no sense.
The Pats guys did NOT last for two years.
And AP has NOT been HC for two years.
You can't even be factually correct on the simplest detail.
Today is a big day for the Raiders organization to start getting it right for next season. You don't mention a word about that.
Other organizations are getting their houses in order today. Several head coaches have been fired and several of those teams have already requested interviews with playoff teams' top coordinators, including now the Jets, Pats and Saints. These teams are moving quickly and exposing themselves to all the available options. Brian Flores is out there. Ben Johnson. Mike Vrabel, and many, many more solid candidates.
Meanwhile, Antonio Pierce was just quoted in media as saying he has not heard from the Raiders org. He only knows what is reported by media, which is only speculation.
Mark Davis should already know his plan. He shouldn't need to interview Pierce today or this week or next. He should have been talking to Pierce and Telesco every day. The wheels are not turning in LV.
The Raiders come off as being arrogant, like they know what they're doing. Clearly, they do not. It's been the same clown show for 22 years.
In Gumball Rally ease, the Raiders are the driver who waits until the start of the race to map out their course.
Just once, I'd like to be impressed by the Raiders processes. Even when they hired Pierce, they had no little or no exposure to other HC candidates. That's not how smart orgs work.
Nate, not sure how you can take the circumstances Turner was put into after the Bye week and say that's all he's got. At a minimum, he has pedigree, lest you believe Norval is not a good coordinator either.
McCormick played in five games, all with Turner as OC, and he managed almost 5 ypc. I'd take that and build off it. Draft another RB and load up by training camp. Let's not forget, he had two rookie OL and Desmond Ridder starting one game.
Raiders need to choose a path and follow it like it matters. Either they overthink or they don't think. Either way, it hasn't worked.
I think if Patrick Graham leaves (presumably for a HC job), the Raiders should go after Jerrod Mayo as DC. Turner as OC, I'm not sold. Especially since there are other, formidable possibilities available. Ken Dorsey is out there, he had good success in Buffalo, but not in Cleveland. Also, the possibility of Klint Kubiak if he doesn't get the HC job in New Orleans, Chip Kelly (OC at Ohio St), and then passing game coordinators: Joe Bleymaier (Chiefs), Marcus Brady (Chargers), and Josh Grizzard (Bucs). I just think there are better candidates.
With that said, AP said in his presser today, he doesn't see any changes to the staff. That is a different than what Patrick Graham has indicated about himself.
Oh so glad you commented about my post NY. Sorry, I wasn't saying Harbaugh had anything to do with K. Mack and others being signed/ traded to the Chargers I was just remembering that the Chargers and Raiders' old/ new regimes did different things and how Al did w/ both of these teams.
See, since Al left the Chargers they've only had so much success and he helped build their best teams. they did go to a SB and dominate the AFC West in the early '00s but nothing close to the success that Al had w/ the Raiders. and Chargers have been mediocre for years but an ex-Raiders' assistant(Harbaugh) is their HC and they are in the playoffs.
The new Raiders' regimes haven't done much and their decisions have been very disappointing. you backed these new regimes
you said they would fix Al's mess and build a contender.
you said they would bring in better players and draft good players.
you said they would hire better HC's and GMs' than Al.
you said the were making good decisions in the front office on the football and business sides.
you said they are doing the right thing/ great by managing the salary cap and other business side decisions.
you said we have great players and teams and one day we'll find the right HC who can lead them.
Wow!
To NY Raider
Yea, it sure is a big day for them! they've gone into find a hero mode- Tom Brady is gonna come and build a winner/ contender!
And then you want to turn on A.P., Pats' guys then some of you claimed it was a mistake to bring back Gruden II and he may've not even been as good a HC as they thought he was.
But using Al's ideas/ vision is a joke, no way a ridiculous idea.
A team waiting for return to greatness and thinking/ expecting the NFL/ owners care enough to want to help us get there. and that another inexperienced leader(Brady) will do it. this fan base needs a few years of rest and a lot of fresh air and coffee and maybe somebody to have a long talk with them.
Raidernation! wow!+
Nate, didn't Mayo just get fired by the Pats. Shouldn't stop punching down and punch up for a change? Stop chasing the Getsy's of the NFL.
Flores and Johnson just had career years. Mike Vrabel is probably hungry to coach again. Even Patrick Graham should be considered.
But we still have Pierce. The Raiders thought enough of him to allow him to do his year-end news presser without any knowledge of his future with the team. If they fire him now, that would be an incredible slap in the face.
As for OC, let's be honest, the Raiders are not going to get an experienced OC that hasn't been fired by another team. Once again, they will be punching down.
If Pierce is to remain, continuity is important.
Al Anon, please stop invoking me in your posts. I didn't say anything you're suggesting. Your revisionist history is not for me.
Joe Burrow said recently on the prospect of losing Tee Higgins...You can't build a team by letting your best players leave the building. So true.
When Raiders let Jacobs walk, and than traded Adams, you just can't replace these type of players so easy. Telesco did do some good things, but on balance, Raiders were letting all pro/future hall of fame players go out the door.
Gotta do better this off season...Nate, I am not opposed to Raiders bringing in another Qb, and having AOC earn the job. I think Sanders will be there at 6th pick. Maybe Raiders can even trade down a little, and still get Sanders.
Ghost, don't discount "hype" as a powerful tool. No matter what you think of Sanders, I can't imagine he will still be on the board at the #6 pick.
Case and point, there were six QBs off the board by the #13 pick last year. That probably means at least four teams were not drafting "best available" player. (Kudos to the Raiders for not reaching for the #7 best QB.)
It's a QB league and the consensus is, the Raiders need one. I'm more inclined to believe the Raiders will try and trade up. Reportedly, they tried that last year. They could easily fail, again. Depending on what you think of Sanders (or Ward), that could be for better or for worse.
PS I agree about losing Jacobs. Stupid. But Adams went more on his own as the Raiders were imploding. Jets had a QB and still face planted. The league is extremely competitive. That's why the Raiders have to be better at every level of their operations.
Today is the 2nd day of the Raiders offseason. If Mark Davis planned on firing AP, yesterday was his deadline as far as I'm concerned. Teams needing new coaches are already well into that process. It's actually impressive that the Jets and Pats have approached their off-season in high gear with plan... by scheduling interviews with some of the best available coaches.
Here's something to chew on. If AP stays and Patrick Graham is waiting for his HC opportunity, the Raiders will need to be on the hunt for a DC... soon!
I imagine they will roll with Scott Turner as OC. My guess.
Mayo was only given one year, with no talent on his roster. His firing was a complete farce; and says nothing of his capabilities. So how is that "punching down"? To me, hiring Vrabel as HC would be more "punching down" than Mayo.
Pierce said in his media conference yesterday that he is not going anywhere. He also said that he is not aware of any "staff" changes as those higher than him have not informed him of any. He also said AOC deserves to be QB1, and regrets moving away from his gut in Training Camp (I think that had more to do with Getsy); and losing Koonce was a big deal on the team's morale. What he had to say was interesting, and at the same time, scary. One thing for sure, he is not tipping his hand.
There is obvious need for change here, anyone and everyone sees that; so to come out and basically say "I don't see a need for change" is scary. How about changes in the win-loss column? How about changes to the offensive blocking and running game schemes?
We head into the 23rd season where we have not had a playoff win, and only 2 winning records in that span. What are you going to do to change that? What about all the "voices" you have surrounded your coaches with? I get you want experienced people in the building, why not make them the coordinators, instead of consultants? It feels like there are too many cooks in the kitchen trying to plan the perfect meal; there is no such thing.
The bottom line is it is troubling, because it feels like they are wanting to continue in doing the same things for the sake of continuity. But doing the same things and expecting different results is insanity; is this what the Raiders have become? Commitment to Insanity?
At what point does common sense come into play? Who's job is it to bring in the common sense? Telesco, Brady, Seymour, Mark Davis, Pierce, Marvin Lewis, Joe Philbin, Norv Turner, Rob Ryan, Patrick Graham, the players, or the fans?
As a fan, here is what I want to see this offseason. Pierce needs to lose some of the cooks and trust the staff that he wants. The Raiders football operations develop a plan of what is needed to gain more "Ws" on both sides of the ball. The coaching staff training this offseason for better game clock management and challenges to bad calls; which means digging in and studying the rules of the game a little more than what was shown this season. Working together to address the weaknesses of the roster to play more aggressive, and not get so discouraged by the challenges (like losing a player to injury).
Nate, we can discuss the nuances of these coaches but there's no escaping the challenges and risks of a lame duck HC which, as you said, Mayo was, and Pierce will be if he stays.
It will be hard to retain any of their staff, and it might be hard to retain key players, like Crosby. As it stands, with lame duck HC and no QB1, even the Raiders own free agents might want out.
This is just another head-scratching moment for the Raiders organization.
They haven't even given Pierce the courtesy of their decision.
Your comments about common sense and insanity are spot on. Perhaps it's for those reasons the Raiders should be looking for a new HC. IDK.
Patrick Graham to interview for Jags HC and Bengals DC openings.
Safe to believe he's NOT coming back to the Raiders.
The Raiders have put themselves in this precarious position.
1/7/25 2:46pm CST - Raiders have fired Antonio Pierce as HC.
I'm probably overreacting but I think Mark Davis should have known that outcome even before the Chargers game and, at a minimum, saved Pierce from doing a presser where he had to stand there and tell the world he was still the HC of the Raiders.
Mark Davis lacks decency and common sense, maybe any sense.
If he wants to recover, he will quickly interview Patrick Graham for HC position. That kills two birds, with the Rooney Rule.
But I seriously doubt he's that smart.
Mark my words, if Mike Vrabel becomes the next Raiders HC, it will be because of Tom Brady, not Mark Davis or Tom Telesco, who's mysteriously disappeared from view over the past weeks.
I hate the way the Raiders do business. It's clearly reflected by their results.
Buckle up! We're starting over, again!
Now the Raiders have to worry about hiring a whole new coaching staff. I'd immediately interview Patrick Graham, Pete Carroll, and Klint Kubiak. I do not think, however, the Raiders can afford to wait until after the playoffs to assemble a staff together. That means, depending on how long they go into the post-season: Ben Johnson, Kliff Kingsbury, Todd Monken (OC, Baltimore), Wes Phillips (OC, Minnesota), and Liam Coen may not be interviewed.
Another season and offseason, same ol' story
Firing Pierce is the right call, not so much because of the record (which was bad) but because of the lame duck theory. Raiders staff would be heavily depleted. No coordinator or assistant worth his salt wants to work on a one-year contract. Coaches don't mind getting fired, as long as they get paid.
That's at least partly why this decision could have and should have been made weeks ago. Otherwise, they could have extended Pierce's contract another year. Then you can hire assistants on 2-year deals. Even then, it's handcuffing the org with middling coaches. That's how we lost Kingsbury as OC.
Unfortunately, I believe arrogance drives the Raiders slow and poor decision-making. Mark Davis is still pimping the brand that's been dying for 20 years, thinking the Raiders are a destination of choice. He may find out that it's not as he looks for another HC.
Meanwhile, we are left watching the carnage for 22+ years.
Absolutely agree with your last post, NY. I don't like the firing, but I understand it. Knowing our luck we will end up with Raiders/Pats2.0 by hiring Vrabel; who like McDummy, destroyed Tennessee. The only reason he had a few seasons of winning was because he inherited a good roster; but he destroyed it.
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